The Top Six Males Skaters in the World

Here's a couple of lists of what I think about the Men' competition this season, and none are in my order of placements:

A TOP SIX.........NEXT GROUP OF SIX.........OTHER GROUP

Plushenko........................Weir....................................Li
Joubert.............................Weiss.................................Chiper
Lindemann.......................Sandhu...............................Honda
Lambiel............................Buttle..................................Dinev
Klimkin.............................Van der Perren..................Zhang
Goebel.............................Griazev..............................Davydov

Do you agree? If not whom would you replace with?

Joe

Joesitz said:

Do you agree? If not whom would you replace with?
Joe

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That all depends, are those placements considering their overall performances on the past season (03-04)? or for some miracle considering if they were a 100% so they can show their best that they are capable of doing?

Let's assume it's all the men skating their best. I would move Goebel into the group of second six, because there are men there capable of quads and far superior artistry, and move Sandhu over to the top six. I love Lindemann, but I might swap him and Johnny Weir, and then switch Honda and Griazev.

hmm, interesting things to ponder....

Laura

Joe,

It seems the list is based on last year's worlds, and partly on talent. I agree with about 80% of the list.

IMO there are two ways to look at this- A)what these skaters are capable of when they are healthy, and B)what is expected of them, given the recent injuries.

In either case, I agree with the top 2 spots (Yes, Plushenko is #1, even with an injured knee).

A.First, here is my list of the top 7 assuming they are healthy.

1.Plushenko
2.Joubert
3.Goebel
4.Klimkin (he may move upto #3 under COP)
5.Lambiel
6.Weir
7.Sandhu (inconsistency will always rank him low, but at any given competition he is always a threat to medal).

B.Now, given the current situation:

I would have moved down Lindeman to #4 or even #5. I believe his bronze in Dortmund was due to the homefield advantage. He is a respectable skater, but I don't see him as a top 3 skater. However, so many skaters are either injured or been inconsistent, that I have to give this spot to Lindeman right now. I do expect him to slip to #5 this season.

It is hard for me to place Lambiel at #3 even if healthy, because I have not seen a consistently strong performance from him. So the #3 spot is really up for grabs. He has had an injury and surgery, so I don't know how he will skate when he returns. I will place him at #7 for now.

I would move Goebel higher- to 4th, simply because he is capable of so much, technically. He is one of the few that can outquad the top 2 (Plushenko and Joubert). I know, I know- quads are not everything, and under the COP the in betweens would be important, but I honestly don't see any major changes in the mens skating under COP. They will always emphasize jumps (and now the spins, to some extent). I do believe that a healthy Goebel belongs in the #3 spot, unless challenged by Lambiel or Sandhu with a strong performance.

That said, I would move Johnny Weir to #5, based on the overall quality of his skating, and assuming that he has a quad in his repertoire by now. If he lands a quad combination, he could challenge (healthy) Goebel, Lambiel, and Lindeman for the #3 spot.

As much as I love Klimkin, I would not place him in the top 6 at this time. He has had so many injuries that I don't know what he is capable of anymore. He could be another Abt- wonderfully artistic, but plagued by injuries throughout his career. Everytime he skated great, next time he was injured. It is heartbreaking but I would not even put him in the top 12 until I have seen him skate again, which would be next year. However, if he was healthy (pure imagination) and skating what he is capable of, I would place him at #3 without hesitation.

Where does Sandhu stand? I think you were right in placing him in the second group. However, assuming that Klimkin is injured and out until next year, I would move him to the #6 spot, although he could place anywhere between 3 and 9.

I was surprised that you placed Honda in the 13-18 group. I would have placed him in the top 12 (may be #10), but he must have skated really poorly in the most recent competition to make you place him that low. Like Klimkin, he has battled injuries.

So here are my changes.

I would move Klimkin to the last group (#13).
Move Honda to #12 (at least he is still skating)

The top 7 would look like this, given the current situation:

1.Plushenko
2.Joubert
3.Lindeman
4.Goebel
5.Weir
6.Sandhu
7.Lambiel

It is surprising that none of the Chinese skaters made my list in either case. I have not seen them deliver a complete program from beginning to end, in terms of both jumps and presentation. So I had to move them down.

That's how I see it.

Vash

If Honda were healthy, I would place him on top 5, but considering Campbells...what's wrong with him? is he injured or anything?
I would not place Weir just yet in the top 6 because he has yet to show a clean program that includes a quad, he made it top 6 at worlds but Honda and Goebel were not there, Ilia withdrew (he did right? I can't remember) and Sandhu in a good day, could beat Weir IMO

I wonder if the skaters would go for the quads this time considering Kevin medal twice with COP and he didn't have a triple axel or a quad on his programs.

Ximena said:

If Honda were healthy, I would place him on top 5, but considering Campbells...what's wrong with him? is he injured or anything?
I would not place Weir just yet in the top 6 because he has yet to show a clean program that includes a quad, he made it top 6 at worlds but Honda and Goebel were not there, Ilia withdrew (he did right? I can't remember) and Sandhu in a good day, could beat Weir IMO

I wonder if the skaters would go for the quads this time considering Kevin medal twice with COP and he didn't have a triple axel or a quad on his programs.

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'

Yes, Ilia Klimkin had to withdraw.

About Kevin-You cannot really compare a GP medal with one at worlds. The GP field is pretty weak, with just one or two top (world medal caliber) skaters in each.

Vash01 said:

'

Yes, Ilia Klimkin had to withdraw.

About Kevin-You cannot really compare a GP medal with one at worlds. The GP field is pretty weak, with just one or two top (world medal caliber) skaters in each.

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Oh I meant in the GP events so they can assure going to the final without any injury since they didn't try any hard elements. Considering how many skaters have already withdrawn, for the known skaters, such as Joubert, Weir, Goebel etc it is going to enough if they are just clean to win their events (unless they had to compete against the other).

Here are the current top men in the world
Plushenko
Joubert
Weiss
Sandhu
Li
Lysacek
http://www.isufs.org/ws/wsmen.htm
Yes, I know you are looking for opinion, but I find this a useful base of information.

Welcome to Golden Skate, Gregor.

Your referring to the ISU's list of 2004 GP results is ok. Weir wasn't in the GPs last year. Lambiel and Lindemann did not fare well. If you look at the results of the World Championships in Dortmund, you will find Weir in 5th place; Lambiel in 4th and Lindemann in 3rd.

But I would have preferred your personal choices for the present top six in figure skating. Again, if you go with the ISU ratings, that's ok.

Joe

My top 6:
Plushenko
Goebel (he will be back)
Brian Joubert
Lindemann (I think his medal will give him more confidence)
Sandhu (I think people need to look at his entire program rather than harping on the one mistake he makes. I thought his LP at worlds was great and he rebounded well after his mistake which bodes well for his ability to stay mentally focused)
Lambiel

Second 6:
Weir
Weiss
Li (the chinese men are extremely underrated)
Klimkin (Unfortunately I think he will become a talented also-ran. I don't believe he will ever be a serious force to reckon with, though always a threat)
Andrei Griazev (I predict he will overtake Plushenko at the Olympics in 2006 even though I want Plush to win. I think the stars are aligned for him to make his move.
Buttle and KVP- guys with everything except the quads.

Joesitz said:

Welcome to Golden Skate, Gregor.

Your referring to the ISU's list of 2004 GP results is ok. Weir wasn't in the GPs last year. Lambiel and Lindemann did not fare well. If you look at the results of the World Championships in Dortmund, you will find Weir in 5th place; Lambiel in 4th and Lindemann in 3rd.

But I would have preferred your personal choices for the present top six in figure skating. Again, if you go with the ISU ratings, that's ok.

Joe

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Actually I don"t think that list is GP results only. It's the current overall ISU world standings and I believe this includes many different international competitions over more than one year. I admitted that you were looking for opinion, and except for thinking Lysacek is/will be a top skater over Weir, Joubert is on the way up, and that Weiss is on the way down (and probably Plushenko, I would just be guessing to rank.
I just offered the actual ISU current world standings as some current information.
I like reading this board and found out about such things from reading the Golden Skate Home Site.
By the way, Weir not competing GP would kick him off my list since he probably should if he is to be ranked among the top six. (By the way, it would not keep Kwan off a list since she declined GPs only after being a well established top lady.)

I like checking out the ISU rankings. Does the ISU use them for anything, like determining who gets seeded into various competitions?

In the ladies, Sasha is ahead of Ararkawa for the 2003/2004 season because their is only a 50 point differential between first (1200 points), second (1150 points), etc., in worlds, and their is also a 50 point differential in Grand Prox results. So Sasha did better than Shizuka in the GP (plus Sasha had more points from the previous season, factored in at 70% weight).

Michelle is in 13th place, having points only for third place at 2004 Worlds and first place at 2003 Worlds and 2002 Skate America. She is followed by Amber Corwin (14th) and Irina Slutskaya (15th).

http://www.isufs.org/ws/wsladies.htm

Mathman