Skating moves named after the skater

mpal2 · Nov 9, 2004

I tend to roll my eyes when I hear the "Mike Pike" but then I started thinking that once upon a time the "Hamil Camel" got named. We also have a Beilman spin and the Ina Bauer. I'm sure there are plenty more.

Who started the names for these moves. Was it the skater/coach or was it the fans or media. I think I would tend to roll my eyes if the skater or coach tried to start the name, but go with the flow if the media or fans started the name.

It may be a double standard, but to me there is a question of humbleness versus an obnoxious need for attention. I get really irritated with people who demand my attention which is why I think I roll my eyes at the "Mike Pike". His camp is the one trying to start the term and gain attention. I'm ok with the media or fans starting a name for a skating move because it comes from admiration or affection IMO. (This can also work in the negative, but I won't go there. Let's stay on the sunny side

)

The other names I mentioned for skatings moves existed before I started watching skating so they don't bother me. Would they have irritated me at the time they were started? Who started the term? Was it the skater or was the it the media and fans?

BravesSkateFan · Nov 9, 2004

Well I think the problem with names like "MikePike" or "Sasha Sprial" is that they are moves that have been done before. Its not so much that someone is trying to name them after the skater its the fact that they aren't original moves. That's what annoys me about them. Now things like the Biellman and the Ina Bauer were named after the skaters that acutally invented them (AFAIK anyway). To me its not a matter of who names them, just if the move is original to that skater or not. I wouldn't mind a skater or a skaters coach/choreographer naming a move after them if they were the first to do it.

mpal2 · Nov 9, 2004

Good point. I hadn't thought of that. I think it would be a lot harder to get something named after yourself now. There are a lot of moves that have been done. To extend your point, a skater would (at the very least) have to be the one to make the move a signature move or popular.

I've seen the term "Kwan spiral" a lot for the inside to outside edge spiral and that one doesn't bother me. Probably for both reasons. Her camp isn't the one saying watch for the Kwan Spiral. That one has pretty much come from the internet fans. And she has pretty much made it a signature move and popular. I don't really remember seeing too many skaters changing the edge of a spiral before but that could be because I'm a relatively young skating viewer.

mike79 · Nov 9, 2004

Moves like the Ina Bauer and the Biellman are very cool looking when done well. The Mike Pike is just plain ridiculous, especially as it tends to be a 'highlight' of his programs.

I agree that moves that are named after people should be original moves, not recycled ones. I would add an exception to the rule: Ilia Klimkin should name the cantilever since he does it so well.

TwizzlerS · Nov 9, 2004

I am fairly sure that the "Biellman" spin and the "Hamill camel" were not invented by their namesakes. It was just that they did them so well and they used them as highlight or signature moves so they were named after them. If you've seen Denise Biellman do a Biellman spin, you'll know no one can do them like her. I don't have a problem with naming signatures moves after skaters who showcased the move to the extent Biellman and Hamill did theirs. But, I don't think the Mike Pike fits this category. Lucinda Ruh, on the other hand, should have the Pancake spin named after her.

JonnyCoop · Nov 9, 2004

Fun Fact:

The Biellmann spin is in fact a variation of a spin invented by another Swiss skater, Karin Iten, who was a European bronze medallist in 1973. Iten did the spin by extending her leg to the side; Biellmann was the first to pull the leg all the way up. So, Biellmann kind of invented it and kind of didn't; Iten laid the groundwork for it. (This is according to Beverley Smith's Figure Skating: A Celebration, and since Ms. Smith seems to know her stuff, it's probably a reliable source.)

Vash01 · Nov 9, 2004

The Charlotte move was named after its inventor.

I see nothing wrong in naming moves after skaters- Salchow, axel (Axel Paulsen), etc. were also named after skaters that did those jumps first. It does not matter who names the move. In science, math and engineering, formulae and technical terms are named after their inventors. I don't see anything objectionable in it.

That said, I am not sure that Mike Pike is an original move.

Vash

Ladskater · Nov 10, 2004

Ina Bauer was a champion skater who invented a move named after her, thus the Bauer. The Bielman spin was named after Denise Bielman who invented it. Most skating moves and jumps and spins are named after the skater who invented the move. Some of the names such as the Hamel Camel are sort of coined because a move is exclusive to a certain skater and we identify the move with that particular skater. The Mike Pike is obvious. Who else would attempt the move?

Here is a picture of Ina Bauer, the skater who invented the Bauer:

http://www.jacksonskates.com/photos/pics/T-38.jpg

Joesitz (RIP) · Nov 10, 2004

The sitzspin is sometimes called a 'Jackson' after Jackson Haines who invented it. The spin created a marvel in its day. I've seen skaters do it in the 'L' position and go down and up 3 times. Years ago, it was quite common to see a skater do a Split Flip and a Half into a lunge into a sitzspin with the free leg swinging into the curled position.

Its the spin where I totally agree with Button - if you can't have your fanny almost on the ice then you are not doing a sitzspin.

Joe

icenut84 · Nov 10, 2004

Ladskater said:
Ina Bauer was a champion skater who invented a move named after her, thus the Bauer. The Bielman spin was named after Denise Bielman who invented it. Most skating moves and jumps and spins are named after the skater who invented the move. Some of the names such as the Hamel Camel are sort of coined because a move is exclusive to a certain skater and we identify the move with that particular skater. The Mike Pike is obvious. Who else would attempt the move?

The "Mike Pike" is something that, actually, almost every skater learns. In the US it's called a shoot-the-duck, in the UK it's called a teapot, and I think it has a few other names too. Skaters almost always have to learn it (unfortunately!!). They're not done at the elite level that often, but some skaters do do them, such as doing them as a transition into a jump (Nancy Kerrigan for one has done a backwards "mike pike" into a jump in her SP before, and I'm pretty sure others have done similar things too). It's certainly not somehting Mike Weiss invented, nor is it something that only he does. He does it very well, granted, but in relation to most skating moves at the elite level it is not among the most difficult.

As for the Biellmann spin, I don't know if Denise Biellmann actually invented it or whether she just popularised it because it became her trademark. Every time this issue is brought up, people say that actually other skaters did it before her - one poster has already mentioned one, but I'm sure I've read that Tamara Moskvina used to do it when she was a skater too, which of course was before Denise's time.

LimeZest · Nov 10, 2004

From a Denise Biellmann fan site:

The Biellmann Spin

''Her famous spin, now known as the Biellmann spin, became her signature move in her professional career, which began at the young age of 18. Denise's spin, where she pulls her free leg high above and behind her head, is performed with incredible speed and versatility. Even though Denise did not actually invent the Biellmann spin, since Janet Champion of the US and Karen Iten had also performed this spin, she had made the spin famous in the late 1970's and early 80's. She has also developed many variations of this spin throughout her professional career. Many young skaters, including Irina Slutskaya of Russia and Lucinda Ruh of Switzerland, have worked hard on achieving this very difficult spin. Nathalie Krieg, who was an up-and coming star in the early 1990's but who is no longer an amateur, performed the very fascinating Biellmann spin with expertise. Denise, the master of the Biellmann spin, is very pleased about leaving a mark on figure skating with her spin: "It's special to have {a move}, a spin, named after me. So it means even when I don't skate anymore sometime, they will have my name."IFS;May/June,1997''

If they didn't have any reliable source to named who invented that spin, I agree that the name of the spin went to Denise, since she mastered it

I think Sandhu's spin is named the strawberry picker (I want to know if Toller Cranston inspired him for this...lol) and I actually read that Rohene Ward (on his website) invented a jump called the ''Dre''. I would like to see this!

dlkksk8fan · Nov 10, 2004

"GRAFSTROM SPIN" A spin that retains the name of its inventor, Gillis Grafstrom (Swedish three-time Olympic gold medalist). It is a camel spin in which the raised free leg is bent upward at the knee instead of extended in a straight line behind the skater.
Grafstrom- also the first to add variations to the sit spin: the flying sit spin and the change foot sit spin.

"BUTTON CAMEL" What is now known as the flying camel. Dick Button was the first to perform this spin.

heyang · Nov 10, 2004

Don't forget the 'Tano Lutz'. I believe Brian Boitano was the 1st to perform this variation consistently. It's a lot harder to get all those revolutions with one arm raised overhead. I believe Brian mentioned at one point that he wasn't even sure if he could do a regular lutz anymore. At the following competition, he proved himself wrong by doing the standard 3x lutz and the Tano 3x Lutz.

Also, at the time, no one else was doing that particular variation - although we've started seeing more skaters doing a Tano, lately.

SailorGalaxia518 · Nov 10, 2004

One of them being, Ryan Jahnke

gezando · Nov 10, 2004

mpal2 said:
Who started the names for these moves. Was it the skater/coach or was it the fans or media. I think I would tend to roll my eyes if the skater or coach tried to start the name, but go with the flow if the media or fans started the name.

It may be a double standard, but to me there is a question of humbleness versus an obnoxious need for attention. I get really irritated with people who demand my attention which is why I think I roll my eyes at the "Mike Pike". His camp is the one trying to start the term and gain attention. I'm ok with the media or fans starting a name for a skating move because it comes from admiration or affection IMO. (This can also work in the negative, but I won't go there. Let's stay on the sunny side )

The other names I mentioned for skatings moves existed before I started watching skating so they don't bother me. Would they have irritated me at the time they were started? Who started the term? Was it the skater or was the it the media and fans?

Good question about who start naming moves after skaters. I know in order for the move to be official the ISU technical committee has to approve it. (I was told)

BTW, Bielman was not the first skater to do that spin, somehow it is named after her. Sometimes coaches and skaters start naming the move, then the media caught on, if the commentators follow then the public are made aware of the move.

I bet my lunch money that the Mike pike and Sasha curl or Sasha spiral will not be officially named by ISU

dorispulaski · Nov 10, 2004

The Original Cantilever by Mr. Frick

Klimkin's cantilevers are great, but the best was the one's done by Mr. Frick, and he continue to do it right until old age. He was part of the ice clown pair of Frick and Frack. I forget which show they were in, perhaps Ice Follies?

IDLERACER · Nov 10, 2004

I've always felt that Maria Butyrskaya should've named that spin where she clasps her hands behind her back after herself. I don't recall anyone else ever doing that before her...Of course, I also have never seen anyone but her do it ever since. This opens a whole new question...Is there any point in naming something after yourself if no one else has any interest in performing it? It would be a bit redundant to call something a Butyrskaya Spin if she's the only one who'll probably ever do it.

mpal2 · Nov 10, 2004

gezando said:
Good question about who start naming moves after skaters. I know in order for the move to be official the ISU technical committee has to approve it. (I was told)

I guess that at some point someone has to bring it to the attention of the ISU technical committee. I wonder if there is a special application form :biggrin:

anya_angie · Nov 10, 2004

I like inventive spins that aren't done by anyone else hardly.

Does Ilia Kulik do his "Flying Kulik" anymore? I only saw it once!

Of course I love the Abt spin.

Spinner · Nov 11, 2004

AFAIK, Tamara Moskvina was doing Biellmann spins long before Denise ever thought of them. I've seen pics, but I can't provide a date.

Skating moves named after the skater

mpal2

BravesSkateFan

mpal2

mike79

TwizzlerS

JonnyCoop

Vash01

Ladskater

~ Figure Skating Is My Passion ~

Joesitz (RIP)

icenut84

LimeZest

dlkksk8fan

heyang

SailorGalaxia518

gezando

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

IDLERACER

mpal2

anya_angie

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