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Thread: Cohen and Nicks Plan for Success

  1. #16
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by distantvoice
    It doesn't matter how I know, I do.
    I love it! Cue Rod Sterling!

    Welcome to Golden Skate, Distant and Mysterious Voice.

    Mathman

  2. #17
    Hopeless fan Doggygirl's Avatar
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    Congrats to Sasha....

    Quote Originally Posted by euterpe
    When Cohen quit Nicks and went to Tarasova, she said he had taken her as far as he could and it was time for her to move up to a coach who could help her win the OGM she missed out on in 2002. I think if Sasha had stayed with TT, she'd be in a much, much better position to win the OGM in 2006 than she ever would with Nicks. Unfortunately for Sasha, TT grew weary of Sasha's headstrong ways and declined to coach her any longer.

    I always thought Robin and Sasha were a mismatch, but no matter how you look at it, going back to Nicks may rob Sasha of all the gains she made under TT. And TT made her toe the line. She had Sasha doing endurance exercises to build up stamina, something she was sorely lacking at Marshall's.

    It will be far too easy for Sasha to fall back on her old patterns under Nicks, where she'd be doing her own choreography and often ad libbing her way through her FS.
    ....for maintaining public popularity!! When they stop talkin' about you (for better OR for worse), that's when you know you're through.

    Mean time, all the speculation will certainly be put to rest On The Ice at Nats and Worlds. I'm willing to wait. Should be quite entertaining, which is why I love watching this sport.

    DG

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuchana
    It's not only Marshalls mind you but the majority of her inconsistent history. No matter how you sugar coat the facts, they speak for themselves more than anything else. She's not up to par, she has been known not to be up to par and until she is, then there are people who have every right to question her work ethic, being how she hasn't carried it through as she should and yes she should but she doesn't. So let's wait 'til we see how she fares at Nationals and Worlds but I'm waiting with bated breath I may add. If she is able to I'll be one very surprised person.
    Why does Sasha have to answer to you or anyone else? Do you pay for her skating??Her work ethics (as you put it) have nothing to do with you or me. What she does she will have to answer for, it is her life..

  4. #19
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Hi, Nuggetr. I think the right idea is what Doggygirl said. In show business and sports, it doesn't matter if people say good things or bad things about you, just so long as you've got center stage. Sasha has nothing to worry about as long as she is the one that everyone wants to talk about, whether pro or con.

    As for who pays for her skating, well, for one, everyone who buys a Citizen's watch does. And everyone who pays $65 to see her skate in COI does. Even the Kwan fans who turn on the TV hoping that Sasha will mess up, do.

    Sasha has the same chance as Michelle to win Nationals next month. She has the same chance as Irina and Shizuka to win Worlds, and the same chance as everyone else in Torino. If she wins these championships, that will be a wonderful accomplishment.

    If she doesn't, she is still a beautiful and uniquely gifted skater.

    Mathman

  5. #20
    Down With It
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    Sasha has the same chance as Michelle to win Nationals next month. She has the same chance as Irina and Shizuka to win Worlds, and the same chance as everyone else in Torino. If she wins these championships, that will be a wonderful accomplishment.

    If she doesn't, she is still a beautiful and uniquely gifted skater.

    Mathman
    You really think it's a 50/50 shot that she'll win those two events...?

  6. #21
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    I predict again that Sasha will skate much better than expected at Nationals. She will have more confidence because she has an old friend in her corner. She will be more at peace because she will be "home." Lokk for her best performance all season.

  7. #22
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    Predict

    I adore the prediction in the post before mine... especially since it doesn't go so far as to predict that Sasha will win. Just predicts her best performance all season. That prediction is like flipping a coin and suggesting that it will land on heads or tails. Sasha will hardly have to put much effort into skating better than she did at her previous performances this season.

    I guess what would impress me the most were if Sasha were to give it a genuine shot, make a great effort, maybe not be perfect but show her heart a bit out there by fighting for the landings... and if she didn't get gold, be gracious and grateful for having done as well as she did. No disappointment - just real joy at having the chance to skate. For a skater like that, I'd buy a ticket to COI (or shop at Marshall's or eat Smart Ones).

    Linny

  8. #23
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Dog
    You really think it's a 50/50 shot that she'll win those two events...?
    Not 50-50, but as good a chance as the other top competitors. For Nationals I'll say 45% Michelle, 45% Sasha and 10% somebody else. For Worlds, 20% Sasha, 20% Michelle, 20% Irina, 20% Shizuka, 20% someone else.

    For the Olympics I would throw in Miki Ando, Carolina Costner, Joanne Rochette, Yukina Ota and a couple of others and give them all about a 10% chance (the same chance Sarah Hughes had in 2002).

    Mathman

  9. #24
    GOLDEN DREAMS RealtorGal's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman
    Not 50-50, but as good a chance as the other top competitors. For Nationals I'll say 45% Michelle, 45% Sasha and 10% somebody else. For Worlds, 20% Sasha, 20% Michelle, 20% Irina, 20% Shizuka, 20% someone else.

    For the Olympics I would throw in Miki Ando, Carolina Costner, Joanne Rochette, Yukina Ota and a couple of others and give them all about a 10% chance (the same chance Sarah Hughes had in 2002).
    Hey, I like those statistics! You're pretty good at math!

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joesitz
    When Cohen quit Nicks and went to TT she was expecting the best known coach to bring her to first place. TT almost did that, but TT has rules too, which caused the clash of personalities between mother Cohen or Sasha or both. I am not sure who and it doesn't matter. After signing up with Wagner she was writing, she is finally having fun again. After leaving Wagner she wanted to go home to Nicks. This is what we know, and the rest will be in USA Nationals and hopefully, in Moscow Worlds, and then what to do with Nicks if there is no first place. It's Sasha's way and so be it.

    Joe
    IMHO, Sasha's stay with John Nicks will depend completely on her results at Nationals and Worlds. If she wins gold medals at both (which, quite frankly, I don't think will happen), she'll stay with Nicks. If she wins silver and/or bronze medals at both, she might stay with Nicks through the 2006 season and train like mad for the Olympics. If she skates poor performances at either competition - two falls or more - I wouldn't be surprised if she bolts and finds another coach. After all, she seems to blame the coach, not herself, for her technical problems. It seems that she needs to find a coach who is a magical combination of strict taskmaster and fun-loving companion. Does such a coach exist? What's Christy Ness doing these days?

  11. #26
    Custom Title Ogre Mage's Avatar
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    Work ethic

    None of Sasha's coaches have blasted her work ethic. From all reports she trains hard. But there HAVE been reports that she and her inner circle are headstrong and don't take direction well.

    When she was working with Nicks in 2000-02, I did not like her choreography. Hopefully she will not regress on this front. Her basic skating, mediocre in 2000, is now respectable. Her spins, spirals and footwork have gotten better by leaps and bounds -- but the jumps remain the fly in her ointment. Nicks is getting a far more fully-formed skater than the one who left him two years ago. But I suspect the headstrong attitude remains. We shall see what happens.

    If Sasha continues to be a constant medalist on the National, Worlds and Olympics podium, but does not actually win a major championship, would you consider her career to be a success? Or would she have failed to live up to the hype?

  12. #27
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    Living up to Hype

    It's a shame that she was hyped as she was. If the audience had not been prepped to expect a wunderkind, they'd have been thrilled with the performances they got and perhaps Sasha herself would have been more genuinely pleased.

    There are much beloved skaters who don't have half her credentials...

    Linny

  13. #28
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    Ogre Mage: "If Sasha continues to be a constant medalist on the National, Worlds and Olympics podium, but does not actually win a major championship, would you consider her career to be a success? Or would she have failed to live up to the hype?"

    Of course I would consider her to be a success. Anyone who can commandeer pages and pages of webtalk with every new entry in her online journal is by definition a celebrity of the highest order.

    But it isn't what I think that counts, it's what Sasha and her family think about Sasha's career. It may well be that her family is putting pressure on her to win a major championship, and that's why she is so obsessed with winning.

  14. #29
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    Not 50-50, but as good a chance as the other top competitors. For Nationals I'll say 45% Michelle, 45% Sasha and 10% somebody else. For Worlds, 20% Sasha, 20% Michelle, 20% Irina, 20% Shizuka, 20% someone else.
    I kind of like the way you broke it down but in order to agree with it I have to switch a few numbers...I would put it, maybe, 70% MK and 20% SC for nats, and maybe increase Slutskaya's and Arakawa's numbers up a little as well.

    IMHO, Sasha's stay with John Nicks will depend completely on her results at Nationals and Worlds. If she wins gold medals at both (which, quite frankly, I don't think will happen), she'll stay with Nicks. If she wins silver and/or bronze medals at both, she might stay with Nicks through the 2006 season and train like mad for the Olympics. If she skates poor performances at either competition - two falls or more - I wouldn't be surprised if she bolts and finds another coach. After all, she seems to blame the coach, not herself, for her technical problems. It seems that she needs to find a coach who is a magical combination of strict taskmaster and fun-loving companion.
    As long as we're the audience (and I don't see that changing ) we won't know for sure why Cohen is doing what she is doing. We can only speculate. And of course this speculation accounts for almost 1/4 of the discussion that goes on here and other forums (except for Sasha's fan board of course). That said, I think I concur.

    It's a shame that she was hyped as she was. If the audience had not been prepped to expect a wunderkind, they'd have been thrilled with the performances they got and perhaps Sasha herself would have been more genuinely pleased.

    There are much beloved skaters who don't have half her credentials...
    Couldn't agree more. This and I think living in the shadow of Kwan (arguably one of the greats) also contribute to the endless disappointment we see in skating fans who pay attention to Cohen.

  15. #30
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    Linny, not heads but tails. I am predicting she will skate well enough to possibly win Nationals. I am not on the fence in my prediction. I bet she surprises everyone here and at MKF with her effort. This is from a diehard Michelle Kwan fan.

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