Questions for the COP Experts... | Golden Skate

Questions for the COP Experts...

Doggygirl

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
These questions relate to required elements, and scoring implications under COP for Men's SP.

Q1: A jump combo is a required element, right? I realize there are +/- GOE implications that might be impossible to predict. But generally speaking, what do you think a typical negative COP scoring impact would be if there is a step out on the first jump of a combo before the second jump is performed. For the sake of this discussion we can assume both jumps are fully rotated, just with a wonky landing on jump 1 requiring a step out before jump 2.

Q2: An Axel is required for Men's SP, right? I believe the minumum is a double Axel. What would the COP negative implication be for completion of a fully rotated SINGLE Axel? Wouldn't that be a missed element? Not sure what the penalty (if any other than lack of points for the required element) is for that.

Still learning this new system..

DG
 

hockeyfan228

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Doggygirl said:
These questions relate to required elements, and scoring implications under COP for Men's SP.

Q1: A jump combo is a required element, right? I realize there are +/- GOE implications that might be impossible to predict. But generally speaking, what do you think a typical negative COP scoring impact would be if there is a step out on the first jump of a combo before the second jump is performed. For the sake of this discussion we can assume both jumps are fully rotated, just with a wonky landing on jump 1 requiring a step out before jump 2.

The text in JS 15 Singles - Instructions for Technical Specialist #7-#8 says that in the SP, if there is a turn out on one leg, regardless of whether the free leg touches the ice, it will be considered a combination. (In the FS, if the free leg touches the ice during the turns, the jumps are scored as a sequence.) The GOE chart determines the deduction.

According to the JS 12 Singles - GOE Short Program, the deduction for turns on one leg without touching the ice is -1, and the deduction for turns or steps using the second leg is -2. However, the JS 22 Singles/Pairs - Guidelines for Short Program is more specific: those grades count only if there is one three turn between jumps. If there is more than one three turn between jumps, the deduction is -2, and if there is a touchdown with the free leg or steps, then only the first jump counts as well.

Doggygirl said:
Q2: An Axel is required for Men's SP, right? I believe the minumum is a double Axel. What would the COP negative implication be for completion of a fully rotated SINGLE Axel? Wouldn't that be a missed element? Not sure what the penalty (if any other than lack of points for the required element) is for that.
If a required jump or jump combo is not completed with at least the correct amount of revolutions, the GOE is -3 (degrees) from the base of the jump completed. For example, a 1A starts with a base of .8, and -3 degrees is a deduction of -.5, earning .3. (That's in the JS 10 Singles - Scale of Values)

For spins, not doing the required number of revolutions is minimum of -1, and in a combo spin, not doing the required number of positions is a minimum of -1, but the grade also must be negative. (So no 0/base grade if the skater doesn't do all of the positions.)

There are two types of "missed elements": not doing the proper number of rotations in a jump or spin, which earns the skater minimal, but some, points, and conditions where the skater gets no credit at all (missed element/does the wrong element or repeated element.)

I'm scratching my head, because I can't find where the requirements for SP's are listed, but Men and Ladies must perform an Axel jump of at least two revolutions.
 

Doggygirl

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 18, 2003
Thanks as always Hockeyfan...

For helping us all learn ever more about the COP. I appreciate the time you took to type this up.

Thanks!!!!!!!

DG
 
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