Is Yu-Na more similar to Katarina rather than Michelle?

janetfan · Jun 9, 2009

soogar said:
Neither. Katarina had personality and sex appeal and Yu Na is just plain boring and sexless (at least to me.) I don't see any Michelle in her either because Yu Na has some really sloppy movements on the ice (esp in her spiral) and while Michelle was not a very exciting skater (IMO), Michelle was always neat and polished in her presentation.

Interesting comments - but better prepare yourself for some major "bot" attacks

I think Yuna is a pretty girl and will be an even lovelier young woman.
I always felt something undefinable and special when I watched Michelle skate. I felt it when she was 14 and I will always feel it.

szidon · Jun 9, 2009

Wrlmy said:
She does have little bit of MK-like qualities and little bit of KW-like qualities.

I know what you mean. During her amateur career Witt showed a variety of characters like Carmen, Maria(West Side Story), a Broadway showgirl and a Hungarian folk dancer, etc. But Michelle tended to show charismatic but elegant herself other than the music characters. I think both of their expression approaches were equally beautiful and also effective to get audiences' attentions.

Maybe Yu-na has a kind of a Witt-like approach in that she tends to show her backgound music's characters although you could also find her unique personality in every program.

Wrlmy said:
But if I have to compare her to someone right now, it would be Kristi Yamaguchi .

Also agree with you. Yu-na has little bit of Yamaguchi-like qualities in that both of them are willow-looking skaters.

HCOSurfer · Jun 9, 2009

janetfan said:
I still have a hunch Yuna may be doing Carmen for her LP this season. But I have no information on that - just a hunch.

You're not the only one. Ever since this season ended I've had this gut feeling that Yuna might revisit Carmen.

janetfan · Jun 9, 2009

Wrlmy said:
You make me really nervous. Are you sure you have no secret source? God I hope Yuna picked anything but Carmen.

Sorry to make you nervous. I have NO info at all and I am probably wrong. It is just a hunch, and nothing more. I have mixed feelings myself. I happen to LOVE the music from Carmen (not necessarily the most famous parts though).
We will see come October what Yuna, Mao and the other skaters are bringing us next season.

szidon · Jun 9, 2009

soogar said:
Neither. Katarina had personality and sex appeal and Yu Na is just plain boring and sexless (at least to me.) I don't see any Michelle in her either because Yu Na has some really sloppy movements on the ice (esp in her spiral) and while Michelle was not a very exciting skater (IMO), Michelle was always neat and polished in her presentation.

What Michelle's surprised me was that she'd never done any sloppy movement on the ice. Absolutely. That's why I love Michelle.

As for Yu-na, we could wish her a little bit more extension during her spiral, but she has different aspects of strength on her spirals: speed, ice coverage and edge control. (Kurt mentioned about that at 2009 4CC) That's the reason I like her spiral.

And her spiral extension's got better compared to last seasons.

Besides, I think Yu-na's expressive upper body delivers a very rare quality movements. I consider one of David Wilson's strategies for Yu-na is how to maximize effects of her expressive upper body movements.

shine · Jun 9, 2009

I had to

at the comparison of Mao to Irina. While Mao has beautiful extension and lines, a balletic quality and a lightness in her movement and stroking, Irina had none of that. Neither are they similar in build - Mao is long-limbed and lanky while Irina is shorter and stubbier. I have no idea how Mao could remind anyone of Irina.
And I definitely don't agree that Mao is any less musical than Yuna. She might not have the dramatic facial expression but IMO she's one of the most musical skaters, even more so than Yuna, who is more of an actress.

soogar · Jun 9, 2009

janetfan said:
Interesting comments - but better prepare yourself for some major "bot" attacks I think Yuna is a pretty girl and will be an even lovelier young woman..[/QUTE]

I can deal with attacks. It seems that some fans have transferred the crazy from Michelle onto Yu Na. Yu Na is a pretty girl but I don't feel her skating warrants the excessive praise that is heaped onto it. When I compare her to Sasha or Michelle, I just don't see that finished quality to her skating. I don't think you can even put the blame on COP as Sasha and Shizuka (!) were outstanding COP skaters and had lovely programs with finished movements. Even Joannie exhibits more polish and puts more thought into her performance than Yu Na.

poloska · Jun 10, 2009

shine said:
I had to at the comparison of Mao to Irina. While Mao has beautiful extension and lines, a balletic quality and a lightness in her movement and stroking, Irina had none of that. Neither are they similar in build - Mao is long-limbed and lanky while Irina is shorter and stubbier. I have no idea how Mao could remind anyone of Irina.
And I definitely don't agree that Mao is any less musical than Yuna. She might not have the dramatic facial expression but IMO she's one of the most musical skaters, even more so than Yuna, who is more of an actress.

Agreed. I like Irina, but I don't see any similarities with Mao. Mao has a perfect strech, great positions in spirals,spins. She's like breeze , flying around the rink

Irina's strongest point was speed and her powerful skating. Everything is different.

szidon · Jun 10, 2009

soogar said:
I can deal with attacks. It seems that some fans have transferred the crazy from Michelle onto Yu Na. Yu Na is a pretty girl but I don't feel her skating warrants the excessive praise that is heaped onto it. When I compare her to Sasha or Michelle, I just don't see that finished quality to her skating. I don't think you can even put the blame on COP as Sasha and Shizuka (!) were outstanding COP skaters and had lovely programs with finished movements. Even Joannie exhibits more polish and puts more thought into her performance than Yu Na.

I witnessed lots of commentators of NBC, CBC, CBC in French, British Eurosport, Russian Eurosport, RTR, German Eurosport, CC TV, France 3-TV and Teledeporte (TDP) marveled at Yu-na's porformances at 2009 Worlds.
But i think everybody has a different taste and preference.

seniorita · Jun 10, 2009

janetfan said:
Yu Na is a pretty girl but I don't feel her skating warrants the excessive praise that is heaped onto it. When I compare her to Sasha or Michelle, I just don't see that finished quality to her skating.

I think I agree on this, Yuna has something in her posture that I dont like, but I dont know what it is. I love her intense moves but in slow pieces I miss something, like she is rushing. She is an exceptional skater of course and probably the best around now. But I like the lightness of Mao and Miki's strech and posture is the best. Yesterday I saw a Caroline video, I loved her , I havent seen much of her.

antmanb · Jun 10, 2009

soogar said:
I can deal with attacks. It seems that some fans have transferred the crazy from Michelle onto Yu Na. Yu Na is a pretty girl but I don't feel her skating warrants the excessive praise that is heaped onto it. When I compare her to Sasha or Michelle, I just don't see that finished quality to her skating. I don't think you can even put the blame on COP as Sasha and Shizuka (!) were outstanding COP skaters and had lovely programs with finished movements. Even Joannie exhibits more polish and puts more thought into her performance than Yu Na.

Well every single skater you mentioned (Michelle, Sasha, Shizuka, Joannie) all grew up, learnt to skate and hit seniors and competed for the majority of their competitive lives under 6.0. Isn't it possilbe, plausible, even that the skaters that grew up in a system where you did what you could, and did it well subject only to having a "balanced programme", are going to be more polished, finish their moves better etc etc, than the skaters who have groen up under a system that rewards quantity over quality?

Why would a skater do something with finesse, polish or finish it properly if judges are too stingey with +GOEs? If the simple maths is do a level 4 poorly, because the points are far higher than a level 1 with +GOE (which in any event you're not likely to get).

Or are are we simply comparing 16-18 year olds with 24+ year olds so there is going to be no comparison in terms of polish?

Who knows?

Ant

antmanb · Jun 10, 2009

seniorita said:
I think I agree on this, Yuna has something in her posture that I dont like, but I dont know what it is. I love her intense moves but in slow pieces I miss something, like she is rushing. She is an exceptional skater of course and probably the best around now. But I like the lightness of Mao and Miki's strech and posture is the best. Yesterday I saw a Caroline video, I loved her , I havent seen much of her.

Miki's posture is the best??? Really? I couldn't disagree more! I think of all the elite skaters Miki's posture is still the worst. She has worked very hard on it, that much is true, but she still falls behind most of the skaters in the tope 10 and lower in terms of posture.

Ant

seniorita · Jun 10, 2009

I like her arms and her lines and extention, she has something royal in her body expression, isnt this all what posture means?

the bizarre thing would be if we didnt disagree :laugh:

antmanb · Jun 10, 2009

seniorita said:
I like her arms and her lines and extention, she has something royal in her body expression, isnt this all what posture means?
the bizarre thing would be if we didnt disagree

You're so right Seniorita i think the world might end if we did actually agree on a skater (though i think we may both love Weir's skating no?).

With her posture i actually meant her back specifically - she tends to skate hunched over slightly and pumps her back when gaining speed in cross overs (reminding me of Slutskaya - though i think Irina's back pumping was worse than Miki's). I think she has learnt to use her arms better but i still think her lines aren't the best.

Ant

seniorita · Jun 10, 2009

Yes we dont want the world to end, do we?

Strangely enough I have figured out which skaters you dont like(like that was hard :laugh:

) but I have no idea of your fav skaters:think: Yes, Weir is second best now Lambiel retired

The japanese come next

Strange i think yuna skates with hunched shoulders also, pumps her back what does it mean?

cosmos · Jun 10, 2009

szidon said:
I witnessed lots of commentators of NBC, CBC, CBC in French, British Eurosport, Russian Eurosport, RTR, German Eurosport, CC TV, France 3-TV and Teledeporte (TDP) marveled at Yu-na's porformances at 2009 Worlds.
But i think everybody has a different taste and preference.

True! Skating forum is not a proper place to ask its opinion of a skater. Members are eager fans of some skaters and often biased. (I am not blaming anybody). General audience' reaction in a competition is more direct and honest.

Fortunately, YuNa is appreciated by many experts like Sonia Bianchetti. Below is the link to her LA Worlds commentary. (If this was posted before, sorry).

http://www.iceskatingintnl.com/current/content/Sonia 2009 Worlds.htm

Yu Na was in a class of her own. She is so natural and elegant. I was impressed by her ability in expressing and interpreting the music, by the harmony of all her movements, by the excellent choreography. Her short program was superb, one of the best programs I can remember in a long time. It made me cry! She made me feel that "artistic emotion" that I have been missing for many years.

This program will go down in skating history like the Bolero of Torvill and Dean, Katarina Witt's Carmen, Kurt Browning’s Casablamca or Yagudin’s Winter. Thank you Yu Na

Joesitz (RIP) · Jun 10, 2009

I don't get the comparison offered between Kwan and Witt. Why those two should be compared with YuNa is kind off in left field. No?

antmanb · Jun 10, 2009

seniorita said:
Yes we dont want the world to end, do we?
Strangely enough I have figured out which skaters you dont like(like that was hard ) but I have no idea of your fav skaters:think: Yes, Weir is second best now Lambiel retired The japanese come next
Strange i think yuna skates with hunched shoulders also, pumps her back what does it mean?

By pumps her back I mean - if you watch (particulary Irina) doing back cross overs - watch her back specifically in order to go faster her back moves up and down in time with the cross-overs. This is usually a result of exerting more perssure in trying to go faster. That is usually a sign of weak edges/bad technique as the speed should be generated by pressure on the blade, lean into the edge, or depth of edge. Good skaters with great edges (like most ice dancer) will never pump with their back to go faster they can rely on the purity of their running edge - like Ilia Kulik!

I think the reason you hear less and less about my favourite skaters is that no-one right now is really standing out for me. I never used to watch the ladies (i found them really boring) until a young 14 year old named Michelle Kwan came along and between her and Slutskaya i was hooked on the ladies. Now i'm just not that bothered. I really like watching both Mao and Yuna, but the element-fest that is COP means that none of their programmes have ever excited me (or moved me) like programmes of Kwan or Slutskaya. Plus the music choices of the ladies is just so zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz that it doesn't normally hold interest.

The men right now are very interesting. I love Weir's skating, i also love Joubert's skating (but you'll note even my favourites are not immune to my criticism). I really enjoyed Abbott's performances on the GP last year and hope he can reach that level again. Takahashi is another skater i also really like, even though it took me a while to "get it". I also really like Tomas Verner and wish he could skate more consistently. I also have a soft spot for Van de Perren even though his presentation skills leave an awful lot to be desired!

And as for pairs - it was my original favourite discipline - the thing that made me start watching figure skating. For me, COP has cmopletely ruined this discipline with inane rules and difficulties. It's limited the lifts that the top pairs do, the spins are awful, the death spirals are ugly and horrible and the step sequences/sprial sequences drive me insane. That doesn't leave much does it? Under 6.0 is was quicker to give you the short list of pairs that i didn't like. Now I find the discipline boring and fast forward through programmes most of the time. I do love the germans and wish they#d been able to skate under 6.0. And if Shen & Zhou come back for the Olympics (and they're on the GP roster) then i may actually pee my pants watching them skate :laugh:

Ant

seniorita · Jun 10, 2009

we dont have such much difference in taste afterall, i agree with pairs and men(no lambiel and yagudin?) , ( but I cant believe your fav is joubert, for no other reason just after all your remarks in plush thread :eek:

, i would never imagine you like his style)
I enjoy ladies a lot, although noone has the place in my heart like irina and kwan. szizuka came close though.
thanx for pumps explaining, i ll start to pay attention

Although I think I know what you describe and I like how they move, i have not connected it with weak edges though.

antmanb · Jun 10, 2009

seniorita said:
we dont have such much difference in taste afterall, i agree with pairs and men(no lambiel and yagudin?) , ( but I cant believe your fav is joubert, for no other reason just after all your remarks in plush thread , i would never imagine you like his style)
I enjoy ladies a lot, although noone has the place in my heart like irina and kwan. szizuka came close though.
thanx for pumps explaining, i ll start to pay attentionAlthough I think I know what you describe and I like how they move, i have not connected it with weak edges though.

Sorry i only spoke about the current men because they interest me (unlike the ladies) Yagudin has to be one of my favourite male skaters (although this does not make me immune to some of his issues as a skater). Lambiel i only really apprciated competitively when he did his Flamenco programmes. I loved him as an up and coming junior but hated his competitive programmes after COP was introduced. He's one skater i'd much more happily watch in exhibition rather than competition - expecially his spins :love:

Joubert I really do actually like his skating an awful lot. I do criticise things i don't like (i'll have to dig out the posts i wrote about Yagudin's straightline step sequence in winter which i thought was absolutely ridiculous - the toe pick steps in it looked so silly to me, much like Joubert's running man! I still loved winter as a programme despite the step sequence! I'd have hated it even moer had i known what it would do to step sequences in the future!) but ultimately i love nearly all of his music choices and despite sometimes having questionable or non existant choreography i really do like his style a lot. As a person, however, most of what he says turns me off him, but he's seemingly learnt some humility of late.

Also i adored Buttle's skating!

Ant

Is Yu-Na more similar to Katarina rather than Michelle?

janetfan

Match Penalty

szidon

HCOSurfer

janetfan

Match Penalty

szidon

shine

soogar

poloska

szidon

seniorita

antmanb

antmanb

seniorita

antmanb

seniorita

cosmos

Joesitz (RIP)

antmanb

seniorita

antmanb

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