Grand Prix Final: Ladies LP

sleepyjl said:

Yeah, I think Brian said the same thing when she was getting off the ice. But she only got lvl 3s on her final two spins. That indicates to me that she was losing concentration as the program wore on, which is a big red flag, especially when the competition is this close.

Skating, like other individual sports such as tennis and gymnastics, is a very lonely sport. You're out there by yourself in front of a enormous audience, and everything comes down to your performance. That's why tennis players and gymnasts all consult sports shrinks. I'm hoping Yuna's management team is smart enough to do the same.

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I keep coming back to sports psychologists because it's obvious that all of Yuna's problems are mental, and b/c of the cultural taboo against seeing shrinks in Korean culture and Brian Orser's statements to the press that "I'm the only person who knows what she's going through." Well, sorry to point it out, but Orser LOST the OGM to Brian Boitano. I don't know if she wants to put all of her mental eggs in Brian's basket, so to speak.

I wouldn't count Joannie out. If anything, the pressure is off her just a bit, she may be galvanized and ready to focus come Olympic time. The gold is still Yu Na's to lose, but she just seems more likely to lose it than she did when the season first got started.

silverlake22 said:

Nah. Akiko is way better than Yukari, I can't enjoy Yuakri's skating fully just because her leg wraps are so ugly. I was noticing how fast Akiko skates tonight, and how her footwork is great. I think Japan is crazy if they pick Fumie or Yukari over her.

As for the costumes, ITA, the fancy Russian costumes have too much fabric and look overpowering on petitie skaters like Mao and Miki. The long skirts I like, but if they could get dresses more like Yuna's and not have all that arm and ruffle business, I think they'd look much better on.

On a different note, Yuna without the 3-3 and a couple minor mistakes is the best, but only by 3 points instead of 30. I wonder if Miki had done the 3lz-3lo and not put her hand down on the 3sal if she would have won here (if that had happened, I still think Yuna should have won but it would a have been a tough call).

Another thing, I don't think people should count on Joannie for medaling at the Olympics, she's inconsistent as too often makes silly mistakes. She's becoming a lot like Alissa in that she can't be counted on to land more than 3-4 clean triples in the long. Also, I like how her LP here was comparable to the one she put down at SC and she got a 95 here and a 112 there ....hmm :scratch:. Plus if her scores were 2/10 lower she would have been last.

I think Akiko should be looked at as a OM contender now. And way to go Ashley! I wonder what this means for the USFS now

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I've always wondered what a leg wrap was... could you explain or show me? I'm a newbie to figure skating, so maybe a youtube clip might help my understanding.

Kim skating with a 3Lz+2T instead of a 3-3 just shows me how cautious she has become. In one way I'm glad that a cautious Yu-Na scores ~190, but I definitely want her to step it up. I'm hoping he pressure of having to be perfect all the time in front of the media and stuff will subside and she can now just concentrate of being her brilliant best at Vancouver.

With this said though, I hope everyone will believe that OGM is not a given. A bad Yu-Na skate gets duly punished and a good skate from Mao, Akiko or Miki could really get first place if they skate well enough.

janetfan said:

This must be encouraging to Mao.......

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Yes but it would require Mao to actually start skating strategically... Frankly I think Miki Ando is in a GREAT place. However, I will say that I think she'd be better of getting those combinations out there.

Kim skating with a 3Lz+2T instead of a 3-3 just shows me how cautious she has become

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Kim was right not to do the 3lutz/3toe because her landing on the 3lutz wasn't good enough for a 3/3.

What a beautiful podium. Congratulations to the three medalists. I'm genuinely happy for them. Congratulations to Yuna for hanging tough there and delivering a decent performance, and for the 3F! So happy that she landed it. Congratulations to Miki and Akiko on their first GPF medal. Especially to Akiko. She had tears on her cheek when they were doing the victory parade, which almost made me want to cry too. I really hope she can make the Olympics team (judges, show Akiko some PCS love!)

sleepyjl said:

I keep coming back to sports psychologists because of the cultural taboo against seeing shrinks in Korean culture and Brian Orser's statements to the press that "I'm the only person who knows what she's going through." Well, sorry to point it out, but Orser LOST the OGM to Brian Boitano. I don't know if she wants to put all of her mental eggs in Brian's basket, so to speak.

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Well, Brian Orser LOST the OGM but that sort of experience might gear Yu-Na up, learning from what her coach did wrong.

sleepyjl said:

I keep coming back to sports psychologists because of the cultural taboo against seeing shrinks in Korean culture and Brian Orser's statements to the press that "I'm the only person who knows what she's going through." Well, sorry to point it out, but Orser LOST the OGM to Brian Boitano. I don't know if she wants to put all of her mental eggs in Brian's basket, so to speak.

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Judging from Yuna's demeanor and calmness, I wouldn't guess she has nervous or anxiety troubles on her own like someone like Alissa does. I think Yuna's stress and nerves are caused by the fans and her being the best. My guess is that Yuna's kind of nerves are probably easier to deal with.

Another thing, if Yuna wins OGM does anyone know if she will continue skating or retire? I guess if you win OGM then there isn't really anything else left to win (she already won worlds), no where to go but down. She might want to go to college too. She's so good though that it might be sad to see someone like her retire before she turns 20. Does anyone know if she's said anything about this?

silverlake22 said:

Another thing, if Yuna wins OGM does anyone know if she will continue skating or retire? I guess if you win OGM then there isn't really anything else left to win (she already won worlds), no where to go but down. She might want to go to college too. She's so good though that it might be sad to see someone like her retire before she turns 20. Does anyone know if she's said anything about this?

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AFAIK She hasn't spoken about it officially yet.

A leg wrap

I've always wondered what a leg wrap was... could you explain or show me? I'm a newbie to figure skating, so maybe a youtube clip might help my understanding.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhqMx2HE_UI Yukari's Lp performance at 2008 World. Take a look at her second jump, especially how her non-landing leg wraps around the other leg when she jumps. It is rather distracting and unattractive. It's not common, as this technique makes a skater harder to jump, though some of the most accomplished jumpers like Midori Ito of Japan, also has this jumping technique.

Hope it helps.

Congratulations to Yuna, Miki and Akiko Miki gets the Olys seat, and Akiko got the highest TES!

Marrymeyunakim said:

I've always wondered what a leg wrap was... could you explain or show me? I'm a newbie to figure skating, so maybe a youtube clip might help my understanding.
.

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Leg wrap is when a skater rotates her jump with a free leg that is up very high and pressed tight to the landing leg from the hip to the knee, then open wide from the knee to the foot. I find it very distracting. If you watch Yukari's program from TEB, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBdT_lYkXUw , around the 30 second mark you will see the leg wraps. Miki Ando does it a little too, but only on her 2loop jumps; Yukari does it on basically every jump. If you watch that video and then compare it to a skate of Yuna's or Joannie's you will see what I mean. It doesn't bother some people though

Marrymeyunakim said:

Well, Brian Orser LOST the OGM but that sort of experience might gear Yu-Na up, learning from what her coach did wrong.

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Brian did not "lose" as much as he was beaten by Boitano.

Had Miki skated clean Yuna would have lost tonight. But she would have lost because she was far from her best.
There is a difference and it is silly to think Orser does not know how to talk about handling Olympic pressure.

Orser handled it in '84 and probably won the OGM that went to Scott.

In 88 it took a perfect skate to beat him and he was at home under the most intense pressure.

There is probably know coach in the world better to handle Yuna heading to Vancouver than Brian O

I expected Kim to lose (and hoped she would because Orser claims she thrives off loss -- as evident in last year's GPF loss and subsequent 4CC and WC wins). I prefer it this way, though . I'd hate to see her lose and the media have a heyday. This Japanese article was already claiming she "lost her throne" after the "sub-par" SP (but PLEASE it may have been sub-par by Kim's standards, but it was still decent. She's human too).

I'm just glad Kim successfully jumped that 3F! It used to be one of her most scintillating jumps (in the 3F-3T combo). I don't know what in the world is happening to her. Her gorgeous jumps -- often executed with textbook precision, that is, delayed and with ice coverage and height -- are becoming tentative (like someone already said). I'm hating these DGs, "e"s and "!"s. They're cutting into the poor girl's confidence. Goal #1 for the Kim Dream Team: CONFIDENCE BUILDING! Yu-Na, no matter what other people say, you are the reigning world champion with superhuman abilities, the Queen everyone can't stop talking about!

Amazing performance by Akiko. She's now one step closer to making it into Team Japan. Miki has a place bagged. Asada definitely does (regardless of what JFS criteria are, the Fed WILL find a way to get her in ). Too bad about Akiko's PCS. I feel awful for her, but hey this performance will help raise it in time for the Olympics!

Miki showed her home crowd that she's READY! Hope to see the 3-3 (or the quad!) in the Olympics.

sleepyjl said:

Skating, like other individual sports such as tennis and gymnastics, is a very lonely sport. You're out there by yourself in front of a enormous audience, and everything comes down to your performance. That's why tennis players and gymnasts all consult sports shrinks. I'm hoping Yuna's management team is smart enough to do the same.

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Those are great & valid points. I think the feeling of solitude is heightened even more in figure skating because in gymnastics there are other people competing while you are. Although in event finals I think you're the lone competitor, but there are apparatuses around you. Whereas in skating you're encircled by everybody focusing on you on a huge rink. My friend's a gymnast & she shows me all kinds of recordings & I forgot who, but the commentator Cathy? said a really poignant thing "that competing well in front of a live audience isn't something you can teach, but you either get used to or don't." That goes along with the rhetoric, you got to do your best when it counts. Not just be a practice skater with potential. That's why I'm really gunning for Sasha for another Olympic berth. She's been a skater w/immense amount of talent & my favorite skater, but I think she's always had consistency problems. Anyways, I'm sure Yuna's consults to some sort of adviser & her mom is super supportive of her so I don't think there needs to be too many worries. And I'm glad that she's got the flip under her belt. It definitely was a mental thing. I really don't like Orser, but that's irrelevant. As long as Yuna feels comfortable w/Brian then I think Yuna's fine. She's level headed enough to pace herself well.

Congratulations to YuNa, Miki and Akiko. Beautiful looking podium!!.
Shout out to Ashley for 4th place. Very nice skating from the top four ladies.

dlgpffps said:

I expected Kim to lose (and hoped she would because Orser claims she thrives off loss -- as evident in last year's GPF loss and subsequent 4CC and WC wins). I prefer it this way, though . I'd hate to see her lose and the media have a heyday. This Japanese article was already claiming she "lost her throne" after the "sub-par" SP (but PLEASE it may have been sub-par by Kim's standards, but it was still decent. She's human too).

I'm just glad Kim successfully jumped that 3F! It used to be one of her most scintillating jumps (in the 3F-3T combo). I don't know what in the world is happening to her. Her gorgeous jumps -- often executed with textbook precision, that is, delayed and with ice coverage and height -- are becoming tentative (like someone already said). I'm hating these DGs, "e"s and "!"s. They're cutting into the poor girl's confidence. Goal #1 for the Kim Dream Team: CONFIDENCE BUILDING! Yu-Na, no matter what other people say, you are the reigning world champion with superhuman abilities, the Queen everyone can't stop talking about!

Amazing performance by Akiko. She's now one step closer to making it into Team Japan. Miki has a place bagged. Asada definitely does (regardless of what JFS criteria are, the Fed WILL find a way to get her in ). Too bad about Akiko's PCS. I feel awful for her, but hey this performance will help raise it in time for the Olympics!

Miki showed her home crowd that she's READY! Hope to see the 3-3 (or the quad!) in the Olympics.

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I'm glad that Yu-Na still won, because I'm her fan, but I think a close win achieves what a loss would have, and then some. It tells her that other competitors will capitalise on her mistakes if she has any and that she must work very hard before Vancouver to rectify them (and this is something that a loss would have told her), and secondly, that she can still produce gutsy performances and produce a solid peformance when the chips are down.

I definitely think that Suzuki deserves an Olympic spot, but I guess it depends on the Japanese nationals.

CARA said:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhqMx2HE_UI Yukari's Lp performance at 2008 World. Take a look at her second jump, especially how her non-landing leg wraps around the other leg when she jumps. It is rather distracting and unattractive. It's not common, as this technique makes a skater harder to jump, though some of the most accomplished jumpers like Midori Ito of Japan, also has this jumping technique.

Hope it helps.

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Oh my, thank you very much. I guess I haven't watched Yukari much, but I would definitely say that leg wraps are indeed quite unattractive. :yes:

Marrymeyunakim said:

Oh my, thank you very much. I guess I haven't watched Yukari much, but I would definitely say that leg wraps are indeed quite unattractive. :yes:

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You are welcome.

silverlake22 said:

Another thing, if Yuna wins OGM does anyone know if she will continue skating or retire? I guess if you win OGM then there isn't really anything else left to win (she already won worlds), no where to go but down. She might want to go to college too. She's so good though that it might be sad to see someone like her retire before she turns 20. Does anyone know if she's said anything about this?

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A lot of speculation's been going on, but nothing's been officially announced. In her 2006-2007 season (the one with two masterpiece programs -- Tango DR and Lark Ascending), she said she hated skating in an interview. This has been twisted by many Kim-haters (in particular, fans of a rival skater) to mean that she fails to appreciate the sport. What she actually said, however, was that she at times hates skating when she makes mistakes or has a terrible day during which everything goes wrong (and all skaters have such days), but in the same breath she also said that she feels ecstatic when she can get everything together and emerge successful (i.e. satisfy herself). All skaters have a love-hate relationship with the sport, don't they?

Her former coach asked Orser (or was it Wilson?) how he could make her a happy skater (and thus the start of the Kim Dream Team formation). Orser and Wilson's goal has always been to make Kim happy, and her happiness does not necessarily depend on WRs or huge margin wins. She wants to skate her heart out, just as MK had done back in the day (Kim's a huge fan of the Kween). Now that she's injury-free, she's much happier, and her delight on ice is evident in my eyes (I expect they are in yours as well). Even if she retires, I don't think she will be able to resist the allure of ice.

She does, however, seem to be uncomfortable with the Korea-Japan rivalry going on and the nation's unrelenting scrutiny of her every move. Whenever she comes out on TV, she says she misses walking unnoticed on the streets. She wants to have a boyfriend. She wants to go shopping with friends. She wants to be an ordinary girl, but that's impossible with her unprecedented popularity. The stress she gets from the media and expectant fans is mind-boggling. She has been faltering recently, but I doubt it's a result so much of inherent problems in her skating or state of mind as in pressure exerted by external sources. I bet she would want escape from that once she accomplishes her final goal, the OGM. As viewers watching her on TV, we fail to understand the staggering pressure on her fragile shoulders. It may be too much to bear.

For Kim, the ultimate goal is to become "a much-loved skater." What this means is open to interpretation. She may want to become like the Kween, who is much-respected and admired even to this day, not just for superior skating ability and emotion-instilling performances, but also for the pizazz, charm and modesty of a champion. Kwan may not have won an OGM, but she is the defining skater of the last decade of skating. If that is Kim's goal, I doubt she will leave the figure skating scene (which I desperately want because I just can't get enough of her) and stay on for, perhaps, another Olympic cycle. If the OGM is what she has in mind, then I think it will be better for her to retire. The CoP system is too physically-challenging for a long-term career of sustained excellence. She's already suffered many injuries; she might want to avert more. And like another poster said, if she wins the OGM, she will have won everything there is to be won in the FS world. The only way from there is down. That's not a pleasant experience for anyone.

I wouldn't be surprised if Yuna retires after winning OGM.

I don't think she hates skating, but I think she's not too crazy about the media attention. In one interview, she said she wouldn't have her child to figure skating. She said having a normal life as an ordinary citizen was probably the best, which to me seems to indicate that she's tired of the media. She never started figure skating to become a super star.