Tchernyshev to apply for Canadian Citizenship

PrincessLeppard said:

A. He didn't dump Naomi. SHE stopped skating for awhile, then came back and they competed at Nationals, withdrawing after the CD.

B. SHE then dumped HIM after becoming pregnant.

Ice dancing is his JOB. Of course he cares about it. I personally think the wiser decision would be for them to skate in shows, but it's not my life. Neither of them have an Olympic medal, and I'm sure that something very tempting to go for. As the wise Atticus Finch says in "To Kill a Mockingbird," "Don't judge a man until you've walked a mile in his shoes."Laura

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A. Didn't they stop dancing because of her ankle and then went back to do Nats.

According to pennyfrom heaven:

Also, contrary to the information that was all over the media when Naomi and Peter split; the split was not Naomi's idea. The information given to the media came from Naomi and Peter's agent and it was not the truth about the situation.

B. I really don't think anyone is coming down on Peter for taking up yet another citizenship, but the rules of immigration have to be followed and there should be no exception.

As far as the Olympic rules, can you imagine a six man regata where the coxman is a German, and the rowers are Portuguese. If the team wins, which flag is hoisted up? The Olympic rules are there for a purpose.

I do agree with you, on both of them doing shows where nationalities do not come into play and Peter will be doing the JOB that he loves That's what we all want to see. However, when they retire, will Peter he be happy if his options are gone?

Joe

And I should trust pennyfromheaven because......?

And was Peter supposed to wait for the baby to be born, wait to see if Naomi wanted to skate again, and then what? Coaching pays some bills, but I'm sure skating in the GP and at Nats and on COI pays much better.

Well you can trust my inside sources on that one, at least I do, they are pretty reliable. Well if Peter had waited for Naomi to have the baby as she wanted, and then resumed training, he wouldn't really be in much different of a positon than he is right now would he? I mean right now he has to develop the connection with SL, and the polish and finesse on the ice that usually only come after years of skating together. With either Naomi or SL for his partner he still has not been on the ice much training, and has not been competing in awhile. At least with Naomi they can both represent the US, and they have 8 years of skating together behind them plus 5 Nationals titles. That's why I could understand if he and SL wanted to go pro, it would be an interesting combination and might help COI or SOI sell some more tickets than having Naomi and Peter in their shows would, but who knows, it might not make that much of a difference either, outside of Canada. Now he is in unknown territory, who knows how he and SL will be received by the international judges? Who knows if the usfsa is even going to release him to skate for Canada?

Naomi had been unsure whether she wanted to compete last season, and Peter waited then, hoping she would come back. Even if Naomi said she wanted to continue after having her baby, she might easily have changed her mind. There is no one else available in the US who has the experience and would be a good match - Peter is very tall, and obviously age is also a factor. He probably doesn't have the time to wait for a new partner to reach his level, if he wants to continue competing, and if there was no one in USA, he would have to go elsewhere. Whatever Peter and Shae's past situations are, they are two skaters who want to continue competing, so i hope they can - partly because i want to see them, and partly because it's not nice when people have to retire sooner than they would like. Maybe he won't get Canadian citizenship in time, or maybe the USFA will block it, or maybe they will make it and not be recieved well by the judges, but at least they will have tried, and will know that they did all they could.

miffy said:

Naomi had been unsure whether she wanted to compete last season, and Peter waited then, hoping she would come back. Even if Naomi said she wanted to continue after having her baby, she might easily have changed her mind..

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On your first sentence, what is your source for making the statement? On your second sentence, "she might" is pure conjecture.

Peter is fine with all his citizenships. If he goes pro with whomever that would be ideal. If he intends to try yet another Oly then his eligibility will come into question. That is a Canadian thing. I, personally, do not feel athletes or any other beings, movie stars included should waltz into new citizenships without going through the normal procedures. We know there are ways to pull strings and maybe Peter can do something to that affect. Let's see.

Joe

It did not become clear to me, did he have tears in his eyes because he had to give up his Russian citizenship or because he got the US citizenship?

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Good question.

It was clear to me after watching the fluff piece that the tears in his eyes were because he no longer had Russian citizenship, not tears of happiness over finally being an American. I even recall there were several threads on different skating forums talking about this then - how if he was so sad at giving up his Russian citizenship then did he really want to be an American citizen or was it just for skating, etc. etc. Also in response to other posts saying that Naomi is no longer available to be his partner and has retired I would just like to clarify this according to what I have been told; she is still available to be his partner and he is well aware of this.

Why this negative innuendo towards Peter T.?
He's a good guy, and this citizenship meant something to him.
He knows more about American politics than many born and bred here!
He's doing the best he can to continue competing in a sport he loves.
He's now paired up with Shae who is talented, nice, gorgeous, and a hard worker.
There are layers of complexities on these matters - from citizenship to his former partnership - and I have nothing but admiration for a guy who even at
33 has stayed healthy and is not willing to give up.

Good luck to Peter and Shae - and I think we will definitely see them compete.

It almost sounds like there is a lynch mob forming to hang Peter for a horse thief and no one even knows if the horse is missing yet.

In a fluff piece from the last Nationals, Naomi stated that a fan's website encouraged her to return to competition. That sounds to me like she was the one who was thinking about quitting.

I may have read it wrong, but in the article (the "long" version that I can't find right now, sorry) that talks about Peter gaining citizenship in time to compete as eligible, it seemed like the attitude was, "Oh well, we will try, but if it doesn't happen, we will just skate as pros."

I don't think any of us know Peter well enough to say we know what is going on in his head or what he was thinking at any given time. I do think that he (like Abt) has had some rough breaks in his career and he deserves to be able to continue, if that's what he wants, however it's possible for him to do so and hopefully be able to taste some additional success. If he has to become a citizen of another country to do this, so be it.

I don't remember any big protest when he gave up his citizenship with Russia and took US citizenship so he could represent the US at the 2002 Olympics. Did any of you who object now, object then? If not, why? Because he was bringing his talent *to* the US and not *away* from it?

This is Peter's life, to do with as he sees best and I don't think any of us really know what we might do in similar circumstances. Just my opinion.

Nan

Joesitz said:

On your first sentence, what is your source for making the statement?

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My first sentence just said that Naomi had been unsure of whether she wanted to compete last season and Peter waited hoping she would come back - that was public knowledge! That is why they withdrew from the Grand Prix last season - not due to injury. USFSA and CMM both had articles: 'L/T take a break from competitive skating', with quotes from both Naomi and Peter. I can't find the articles (CMM has taken L/T's page down, and the link to the USFSA's article just goes to the homepage now that they changed the site) but this article briefly backs up what i said: http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/FigureSkating/2004/01/06/306072-ap.html

I'm sure there are other articles that go into more detail.

I don't remember any big protest when he gave up his citizenship with Russia and took US citizenship so he could represent the US at the 2002 Olympics. Did any of you who object now, object then? If not, why? Because he was bringing his talent *to* the US and not *away* from it?

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Perhaps you may want to ask the Russian skating fans in Russia?



Anyway.. Who is really lynching or out to lynch him here? I am not sure that's how I'm reading posts here and in a few other boards.... I think people have stated their disappointments or opinions, but that does not equal hatred or bashing the man...

I never said anyone was bashing or hated Peter, but you might agree that phrases like, "It seems to me like he is shedding citizenships like dirty clothes." and "If Peter T. takes his American citizenship that lightly, then I think he's a dope................. then Peter is stupid to let himself be used in this manner." and "He doesn't care about his citizenship. It is only skating he cares for. This is obvious" and "the citizenship means nothing to him, it is only the skating that's important and winning that Olympic medal at any cost." are less than flattering and call into question his motives without any direct input from Peter on the subject.

Russian fans might very well have been disappointed when he gave up his citizenship there to skate for the US, but that's not who is posting here on the subject now. It seems in part, Peter became a US citizen because this is where he found gainful employment and could continue skating as an eligible skater. A lot of other skaters in several different countries have done the same. Peter may be unique in that this may result in a second move, but what he is doing now is no different than what he did when he became a US citizen, or what other skaters have done for much the same reason.

No one but Peter knows how he felt when he became a US citizen and no one but Peter knows how he feels about the prospect of giving up that citizenship.

Nan

Zanzibar said:

Why this negative innuendo towards Peter T.?

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I don't think negative innuendos are abounding on the post. No one has said he should not skate with SL. I think most people are happy that he still has the spark for figure skating - not unlike Michelle Kwan, and Irina Slutskaya - who many posters put down because they believe that that spark is not real (innuendo) and they should allow for the teenagers to compete among themselves. There is no rule on aging in figure skating.

These are facts which we have come up with on this thread:

Peter gave up his Russian citizenship

Peter searched for an American Ice Dancer; found one, and became an American citizen

Peter's American partner could not skate for a while do to pregnancy.

Peter searched for another Ice Dancer. He found one in Canada.

Peter can only skate Olympics with Canadian citizenship

Here are questions that have arose:

Were there other reasons for leaving Russia?
What was so important about getting an American partner?
Was the partner's pregnancy the reason to split?
Will he skate pro which does not present a problem?
Will he skate eligible which will?

Regardless of the questions that have arisen, I prefer he skates Pro.

Joe

Joesitz said:

Here are questions that have arose:

Were there other reasons for leaving Russia?
What was so important about getting an American partner?
Was the partner's pregnancy the reason to split?
Will he skate pro which does not present a problem?
Will he skate eligible which will?

Regardless of the questions that have arisen, I prefer he skates Pro, and with anyone he is able to get.

Joe

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It's early in the morning for me, not enough coffee yet and I'm not the best speller (sorry, Granny!), so please excuse me in advance for incorrectly spelling any of the names in this post.

If I remember correctly what commentators have said in the past, Peter originally came to the US with his (then) wife who came to the US to skate professionally and coach. They subsequently divorced and I believe she was the one who divorced Peter, not the other way around.

When Peter was looking for a partner, I'm not sure it was so important to find an "American" partner as is was to find a partner Peter was compatible with and he was *in* America, hence the search for an "American" partner. Don't forget, Naomi was his second partner in the US, if all he wanted was an "American" partner, he had already found one. Ice Dance seems to be a little more unique in pairing partners of different countries than Pairs does, perhaps because Pairs skaters often begin skating together at a much younger age and Ice Dance teams can still be formed as viable teams with adult partners. There are many ice dancers who have crossed country boundaries to find compatible partners. Annisina left Russia to skate with Gwendal, Petukov came to the US to skate with (and subsequently marry) his current partner, Tanith left Canada to skate with Ben, Victor left Germany to skate with Shae-Lynn, Stavisky left Russia to skate with Denkova and the same holds true for many lesser known teams. Commentators have said many times that the lack of female ice dancers in Russia had "forced" many Russian men to seek partners outside Russia, Annisina seems to be the exception.

I don't think we can assume that Naomi's pregnancy was the sole reason for a split between Peter and Naomi. Don't forget, she herself stated she had wanted a "break" from skating, the pressure was getting to her, and she did have trouble with diagnosing her ankle injury for a long time. Her injury was the reason sited for withdrawing from Nationals and at the time, Naomi herself stated that she should have had it taken care of previously, but didn't. During a fluff piece at those same Nationals, Naomi talked about coaching children and how it was the "best part of her day." I did get the impression then that was the direction her heart was taking. I don't know Naomi, but unless we hear directly from her, I don't think we can assume she would be willing to leave a newborn to continue competing anymore than we can assume the opposite. In all the time Peter and Naomi were off the ice, I don't recall reading any statements from Peter that were anything less than supportive where Naomi was concerned so to assume he would break up the team just because Naomi became pregnant is a bit of a stretch, I think. In my opinion, he seems to have made every attempt to hold the partnership together as long as he felt it had a future.

Skating as eligible poses the problem of citizenship. Skating as professional poses the problem of securing contracts with shows or tours. Each has it's own set of difficulties. I don't really care if Peter and Shae-Lynn skate as eligible or professional as long as they are doing what gives them the most satisfaction. I just want to see Peter on the ice again.

Sorry for rambling on for so long, blame it on the lack of coffee, please.

Nan

My feelings on citizenship are very clear and don't waiver whether you are a sports person or a celebrity or an ordinary Joe Soap nobody knows.

I am Irish and I am fiercely fiercely proud of that fact. I live in Britain now but I would never dream of giving up my Irish citizenship for anything.
I firmly believe that gaining citizenship of a country should be a big deal and not something to be taken lightly. Effort should be made to learn the language if you don't already speak it, time should be taken to learn about the country, the history, customs, ways of life etc and it should be the same for *everyone* who applies.

People have mentioned here about younger skaters simply having to beat Peter and Shae to get their place on the team. The thing is there are a hell of a lot of athletes who are not good enough to win Olys but who are good enough to be there and compete and live the experience. If I was a young athlete who worked my *** off for years to get to Olympics, Worlds, whatever, I would be mightily po'd if I lost my place on the team because someone better was sped through the citzenship process to allow them compete.

Being a citizen is more than just a passport or a house in a country. It's about feeling that unexplainable sense of pride when you see your national flag somewhere or that proud tone when you tell someone your nationality. It's about wanting to tell everyone you know that your country is the world tiddly winks champions - doesn't matter that tiddly winks is stupid and everyone will probably laugh - it's about the fact that your country is the best at something! It's about defending your country to the death when some-one says it's ugly, horrible, rural full of thicko's whatever.

Just my opinion

diver chick, I applaud your views on citizenship and your devotion to your country, I really do, please don't think I'm making light of that, I think it's wonderful, but not everyone has the same views and not everyone has the luxury of holding true to their own views and ideals. Sometimes life interferes with our noblest ideals and you just have to make adjustments.

To assume anything regarding Peter's motives or feelings on this matter without hearing directly from him does him a disservice. Just my opinion.

Nan

diver chick - The citizenship thing is a very important issue. IMO, Peter's tears for Russia and the United States will dry up quickly when he seeks his goal of Canadian citizenship. So be it. We all can assume we know what Peter has had in mind from day one, i.e. to skate in the Olys and one was not enough. Will he regre this after the Olys are over?

I respect your attachment to your country of birth and agree that one should take citizenship of an adopted country seriously.

Nan - When Annenko divorced Peter did the divorce take place in Russia and if so, did Peter go back to Russia for the legalities? If so, while in Russia it is hard to believe he could not find a partner and had to return to America to find Naomi. Naomi was not a well known name at the time.

How many of those examples you listed have had more than one change of citizenship?

I don't think the pregnancy was the sole reason for the split. I think and I say, think that he knew Tanith and Ben were the superior team and that was the underlining cause for the split between him and Naomi. Was Peter that good? IMO, no, I preferred to watch Naomi. Peter always looked to me as a heavy and desperate. Naomi just flowed with the dance. Were Tanith and Ben superior? Yeah!

Naomi leaving her baby alone to skate. That sort of thing was the way we were Nowadays, Nanis and baby sitters as well Au Peres are quite plentiful and certaintly Naomi's tribal family would see to it that the baby was well taken cared for.

Yes, yes. Let's not speed up the third citizenship thing. I think they will make a good looking team and be a bright spot in SOI. Everyone wants to see them on the ice.

Joe

Nan - I totally agree with you about life sometimes just getting in the way and people not always having the luxery of holding to their ideals. For this reason I have no problem with people who chose to change citizenship once. A friend of mine is going through the process at the moment. It is a long and arduous prcess and took a lot of soul-searching on her part to make the decision and she lived in Ireland for years and years before she even considered it.

I just find it sad that a lot of these decisions seem to be taken so lightly and seem to be motivated more by politics or money than anything. Peter has already changed citizenship once. Doing it a second time, particularly if it gets rushed through so he can compete at Olympics to my mind devalues the whole idea of national pride.
It is sort of saying to other athletes, yeah okay you might be Canadian but you are not good enough to win so we will give this guy a passport and he can win us medals and recognition. Also it gives the impression that he himself does not value citizenship as anything more than a passport/piece of paper.
That aside there is plenty of skating to be done without going to Olys, both eligible and professional because as I understand it Olys is the only one you need citizenship for.

Personally I am having a hard time with the idea of Peter and Shae skating together because I think they are polar opposites and while different can work, I am wondering whether these two might be too different to be a match. Only time will tell.

I think I'm just about done on this topic, I know many of you are probably tired of my ramblings already, but here it goes one more time.

Joe, I don't know of any skater at the elite level whose goal isn't the Olympics. Peter isn't unique in this. His route may very well be. As I stated before, a second change in citizenship may indeed make him alone in this regard, but I honestly don't know if there are other skaters out there who haven't done the same thing. Many see Soldatava's situation as similar and information on the lower level teams on this subject just isn't easily available. For all any of us know, it may have already happened several times.

As far as Peter's divorce goes, sorry, I have no idea when or where it took place. Peter wasn't that well known at the time, either, and much of his "past" or "personal" information in this area was never included in any "Naomi and Peter" sites that I've found. I do know that very often, divorce is a matter of paper and lawyers only, the people involved don't need to be present if there are no objections and no one is contesting the divorce. My own happened in much that way.

I think both Naomi and Peter knew that Tanith and Ben were becoming better skaters but I don't see Peter as someone who shies from competition. Wasn't it reported that after he and Naomi withdrew from Nationals, he told Ben (in a joking fashion), "We'll see you next year," or words to that effect? It sounds to me that at that time he had every intension of keeping the team together and continuing to compete for the US with B&A.

Was Peter that good? Well, if you listen to what all the commentators had to say over the years (including the gentleman you use as your icon on GS), and the posters on various skating boards that seem to be very knowledgeable on the subject, yes, he was, and still may very well be. I can't see Shae-Lynn pairing up with someone who is less talented than she is. To watch Peter skate and call him "heavy and desperate" on the ice is a bit naive, in my opinion. I have no problem with anyone perferring to watch one partner of a team over the other, but I don't agree that calling Naomi a better skater than Peter is accurate.

Would Naomi leave her baby in the care of others while she trains and practices? I don't know Naomi so I can't really answer that, but she has always impressed me as someone who holds family as important to her. I would be a little surprised if she abdicated this responsibility to someone else.

I've probably beaten this horse enough, moving on to something else.

Nan

Sorry, diver chick, I didn't see you message before I hit the "reply" button so instead of posting again, I'll just add to this novel I've already started.

Unless we know Peter and have asked him what his motives are and how he feels about a second change of citizenship, we have no way of knowing how he feels. He may very well have thought long and hard before making this decision, he may very well not have, we just don't know. Ultimately, the decision for Peter to become a Canadian citizen is in someone else's hands, the final "okay" is not his. A congressman has taken up the cause to expidite Tanith's papers, someone in Canada may very well do the same for Peter, but all he can do is ask, the decision to let it happen or *when* to let it happen is not in his hands.

I was a little concerned about Peter and Shae-Lynn finding a style of their own that was compatable, too, but I've decided to just sit back and trust their judgement on this matter. I can't see either one of them continuing with this if they weren't fairly confident they could produce something good together.

N.