Mikhail Kolyada shelves popular 'White Crow' program

[el henry]

And actually we learned something very new in this article, besides going round and about on SL:

the Nutcracker for SP.

So maybe the thought was two ballet programs was too much ballet, which I can understand.

of course, as a Misha Ge fangirl, I think fondly of that program, and in my head it will be the battle of the Mishas

but that’s just me.

 

[kan01]

I hope next season will not be about battling Schindler's Lists programs. LOL! Probably not though, since Mikhail Kolyada has at least one reliable quad and I don't see Jason and Kolyada as strict rivals.

Excuse me? So one of them having a more reliable quad makes them not strict rivals in your opinion? Last time I checked figure skating competition outcomes were determined by points and placements.
To give an example:
Jason Brown Personal Best Combined Score: 274.82
Mikhail Kolyada Personal Best Combined Score: 274.37
JB Worlds '21 placement: 7th
MK Worlds '21 placement: 5th
JB World Standing: 4th
MK World Standings: 16th
And so on and so forth, I could continue...
In competitions they usually go against each other in the FS in the last group, usually both are between best 6th after the SP where rivalry is the greatest in elite figure skating.
...and you're telling me they're not "strict" rivals because one of them happens to have one super reliable quad and the other doesn't?

I'm sorry but Kolyada is not yet (based on older and latest results) a serious threat to Nathan or Yuzuru even if he has quads, so yeah, Jason is still his rival, reliable quad or not. 100% his rival and who doesn't see that is blind.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Excuse me? So one of them having a more reliable quad makes them not strict rivals in your opinion? Last time I checked figure skating competition outcomes were determined by points and placements.
To give an example:
Jason Brown Personal Best Combined Score: 274.82
Mikhail Kolyada Personal Best Combined Score: 274.37
JB Worlds '21 placement: 7th
MK Worlds '21 placement: 5th
JB World Standing: 4th
MK World Standings: 16th
And so on and so forth, I could continue...
In competitions they usually go against each other in the FS in the last group, usually both are between best 6th after the SP where rivalry is the greatest in elite figure skating.
...and you're telling me they're not "strict" rivals because one of them happens to have one super reliable quad and the other doesn't?

I'm sorry but Kolyada is not yet (based on older and latest results) a serious threat to Nathan or Yuzuru even if he has quads, so yeah, Jason is still his rival, reliable quad or not. 100% his rival and who doesn't see that is blind.

I see you are hung up on the numbers and on the World standings. Frankly, I am NOT! But thanks for doing that bit of research which is interesting in a strictly numbers-based, statistical way, that for me will never be a primary focus of my figure skating enjoyment. I enjoy the skating of both Mikhail and Jason. I adore and admire them both for so many different reasons, not the least for their strong characters, and their human sensitivities, which frankly overall are qualities more crucial to their lives beyond their athleticism and their sublime artistry.

I am simply looking forward to viewing the genius of Nathan Chen, Jason Brown, Mikhail Kolyada, Shoma Uno, Keegan Messing, Roman Sadovsky, Yuma Kagiyama, Denis Vasiljevs, et al., and to rooting them on to free their minds (especially of any thoughts of imposed rivalries) in order to be their best and to spread joy in the hearts of fans who are present in the moment and not caught up with the numbers game.

I responded earlier somewhat tongue-in-cheek, which is what my 'LOL' inclusion was meant to indicate. It was not of such great importance or so serious in nature to obsess over.

These guys surely want to beat their closest competitors, but even they know that their focus should be on what they can do, and not on what their closest competitors are capable of doing. I'm sure that most of today's group of top male skaters greatly admire each other, rather than harbor unproductive feelings about rivalries. I'd be shocked if any of them spend more time perusing the World standings than they do working on improving their weaknesses and trying to enhance their strengths.

Bravo to all of these amazing skaters. I am going to try to relax and enjoy every moment of this season, because a number of these guys will not be continuing in the sport indefinitely. We don't know what we have till it's gone. The sport and some fans seem to take these skaters for granted, or to continually engage in arguing about their favorites, rather than giving thanks for our tremendous blessings as skating fans.

 

[Mauvedreamer]

Let me be the devils' advocate here.... to those thinking that Misha will be compared disadvantageously to Jason, what about the fact that honestly, some may be way more excited about Misha's version, just because it hasn't been seen already.... Perhaps Jason is disappointed that one of his direct competitors is coming with something new here... just saying it can go both ways.... it's not the same thing as when two skaters are using the music for the first time during the same season... and then there is a "ermmm let's see who brought what" ... what we see here is a skater bringing back a well-loved program... which is already in the minds of the fans and judges... while another skater, well-known for having his own style, bringing a brand new program on the same very iconic music.... I for one, am very excited to see another interpretation of SL.... if Misha's program is beautifully done, it may bring a lot of momentum for him.

I am totally looking forward to Misha's interpretation. I like your balanced thinking.

 

[kan01]

I see you are hung up on the numbers and on the World standings. Frankly, I am NOT! But thanks for doing that bit of research which is interesting in a strictly numbers-based, statistical way, that for me will never be a primary focus of my figure skating enjoyment.

You're welcome. I believe it's not your primary focus though it seemed judging rivalries based on solely quads was a bit of a focus for you, which is not a balanced view in my opinion and unfair to compare two skaters with similar scoring potential only on one element and imply that one of them is less than based on that.

As amused as you are by it, the numbers are there to show how comparing two skaters on one element doesn't have much to do with the reality of competing in figure skating where ALL elements are summed.

 

[Mista Ekko]

Well, People are fully entitled to their wrong choices

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

You're welcome. I believe it's not your primary focus though it seemed judging rivalries based on solely quads was a bit of a focus for you, which is not a balanced view in my opinion and unfair to compare two skaters with similar scoring potential only on one element and imply that one of them is less than based on that.

As amused as you are by it, the numbers are there to show how comparing two skaters on one element doesn't have much to do with the reality of competing in figure skating where ALL elements are summed.

As I said in my previous post, I'm not hung up on 'rivalries in figure skating,' perceived or otherwise. Plus, Jason and Kolyada are among a group of guys who have fairly equal scoring abilities at any given competition, depending on different factors. I look at them as both having superb, yet uniquely different skating talents. I've never thought to compare them, much less to think of them in terms of being rivals. They are very close competitors in terms of skating talent, but there are a number of other guys who are always in the mix vying for placements with them at major competitions.

My original comment was made offhand. It is your erroneous assumption that I am 'judging rivalries based solely on quads.' LOL That's silly. I'm not interested in the topic of 'rivalries in figure skating.' The topic I was addressing is chiefly about dueling Schindler's List programs. In that respect, it will be interesting to see how they each perform this current warhorse. We've seen Jason's gorgeous program previously, but he will likely make a few adjustments and enhancements. We'll see.

And please don't get overexcited about my reference to 'dueling Schindler's List programs.' It's a figure of speech, not a declaration that I think these two will be in some kind of war with each other over the course of the season.

Stats are stats, but I don't bother obsessing over the numbers. Stats can provide some general information. However, there are always many factors involved surrounding stats. You have to look at extenuating circumstances of what was going on at the time of various events. For e.g., Kolyada was out for awhile, and then prior to that, he had a season or so where he was popping jumps a lot and he was a very unreliable competitor (maybe for a variety of reasons, which stats don't tell us). Stats are more important in baseball, IMHO, than in figure skating.

Seriously, it seems like you are taking offense as if you think I'm trying to put Jason down, which is nowhere near the ballpark. I love Jason, and if anything, I'm not happy about the sport's over-focus on quads, which has impacted the course of Jason's brilliant career. I've also pointed out on numerous occasions that Jason was robbed of credit for the quad he landed at 2016 Skate America, in the fp. He landed the quad cleanly, from my viewing, at less than 1/4. Later, there was discussion (as there tends to be) about the poor call having been hampered by lack of good camera angles, which shouldn't be used as an excuse. That was a crucial turning point for Jason moving ahead with performing quads. By them denying him that jump, it became a set-back in his progress.

As far as rivalries, the skaters themselves surely don't buy into that whole drama aspect. It is mostly a fan obsession and a media-based promotional tool for the sport, or ongoing debate on forums. I'm not into that overdramatized aspect of the sport, except to talk about what draws me to one skater more than another, or to discuss the qualities I like in different skaters. As I said, the skaters are more concerned with what they have control over, which is their own training, preparation, and performances on the ice. In other respects, the chips fall where they may.

In regard to direct rivalries, the one that's most often touted by the media, is obviously between Yuzuru & Nathan. But both guys have great respect for each other, and more than anything feed off their own individual competitive passions, rather than strictly worrying about how they are discussed and pitted against each other in the media and on fan forums.

 

[ice coverage]

I love this music and enjoy watching any and all skaters interpret it. ...

Agree. The Schindler interpretations from Josh Farris and Satoko Miyahara are among my favorites, but I have enjoyed others too.

...
Mr. Mishin I believe was not aware of the fact that Jason had gone back to "Schindler's List" when he picked that music, but he knows now and he is aware of the criticism.

OTOH, I think it is hard to judge and talk about a program nobody has seen yet. I am convinced that Mikhail can do a great job with this music.

Thank you for the article and for shedding additional light in this thread.

As for Kolyada's yet-to-be-seen program, I am hopeful for another worthy interpretation.

---

... I've also pointed out on numerous occasions that Jason was robbed of credit for the quad he landed at 2016 Skate America, in the fp. He landed the quad cleanly, from my viewing, at less than 1/4. The judges blamed lack of good camera angle on their decision, which shouldn't be used as an excuse. ...

Off topic, but I do not recall any public comment from the 2016 Skate America tech panel about its calling of Jason's quad in the FS??

I know that as a general topic of discussion, camera angle is the subject of opinions throughout the skating community.
But that is different from someone responsible for officiating a specific segment of a specific competition saying something about a specific call that was made during that segment.

I would be very surprised if anyone from the 2016 Skate America tech panel for Men's FS made any public comment of any kind about its calling of Jason's quad?
Or if anyone from the judging panel made any public comment either?

 

[kan01]

As I said in my previous post, I'm not hung up on 'rivalries in figure skating,' perceived or otherwise. Plus, Jason and Kolyada are among a group of guys who have fairly equal scoring abilities at any given competition, depending on different factors. I look at them as both having superb, yet uniquely different skating talents. I've never thought to compare them, much less to think of them in terms of being rivals. They are very close competitors in terms of skating talent, but there are a number of other guys who are always in the mix vying for placements with them at major competitions.

My original comment was made offhand. It is your erroneous assumption that I am 'judging rivalries based solely on quads.' LOL That's silly. I'm not interested in the topic of 'rivalries in figure skating.' The topic I was addressing is chiefly about dueling Schindler's List programs. In that respect, it will be interesting to see how they each perform this current warhorse. We've seen Jason's gorgeous program previously, but he will likely make a few adjustments and enhancements. We'll see.

And please don't get overexcited about my reference to 'dueling Schindler's List programs.' It's a figure of speech, not a declaration that I think these two will be in some kind of war with each other over the course of the season.

Stats are stats, but I don't bother obsessing over the numbers. Stats can provide some general information. However, there are always many factors involved surrounding stats. You have to look at extenuating circumstances of what was going on at the time of various events. For e.g., Kolyada was out for awhile, and then prior to that, he had a season or so where he was popping jumps a lot and he was a very unreliable competitor (maybe for a variety of reasons, which stats don't tell us). Stats are more important in baseball, IMHO, than in figure skating.

Seriously, it seems like you are taking offense as if you think I'm trying to put Jason down, which is nowhere near the ballpark. I love Jason, and if anything, I'm not happy about the sport's over-focus on quads, which has impacted the course of Jason's brilliant career. I've also pointed out on numerous occasions that Jason was robbed of credit for the quad he landed at 2016 Skate America, in the fp. He landed the quad cleanly, from my viewing, at less than 1/4. The judges blamed lack of good camera angle on their decision, which shouldn't be used as an excuse. That was a crucial turning point for Jason moving ahead with performing quads. By them denying him that jump, it became a set-back in his progress.

As far as rivalries, the skaters themselves surely don't buy into that whole drama aspect. It is mostly a fan obsession and a media-based promotional tool for the sport, or ongoing debate on forums. I'm not into that overdramatized aspect of the sport, except to talk about what draws me to one skater more than another, or to discuss the qualities I like in different skaters. As I said, the skaters are more concerned with what they have control over, which is their own training, preparation, and performances on the ice. In other respects, the chips fall where they may.

In regard to direct rivalries, the one that's most often touted by the media, is obviously between Yuzuru & Nathan. But both guys have great respect for each other, and more than anything feed off their own individual competitive passions, rather than strictly worrying about how they are discussed and pitted against each other in the media and on fan forums.

Look, you implied what you implied and everyone can see. This thread is about Schindler's List/music choices and you, out of the blue, brought up a certain jump comparing two skaters based on it. But keep on deflecting and being passive-aggressive with your laughing emojis, go off I guess.

And sorry everyone for going off topic, I won't be responding to this little issue any further.

 

[formersk8ter]

Mikhail Kolyada shelves popular 'White Crow' program

It’s full steam ahead for Russian Champion Mikhail Kolyada who trains alongside 2021 World silver medalist Lisa Tuktamysheva, 2019 European Champion Sofia

www.goldenskate.com

What are your thoughts?

Kolyada will skate beautifully to whatever he chooses... but seriously, The Nutcracker and Schindler's List?

Don't get me wrong, I love both and there is a reason they are classics. But with all the huge variety of music available, coming up with something original would be nice (for all skaters), whether it be classical music or otherwise.

I LOVED Kolyada's White Crow program.

 

[formersk8ter]

This thread is about Schindler's List/music choices and you, out of the blue, brought up a certain jump comparing two skaters based on it.

It's laughable to believe that anyone could still be bent out of shape by a UR 4T call from 2016. Furthermore, Jason has had FIVE YEARS to answer that by doing a clean quad in competition, but he hasn't.

But back to Schindler's List: I really do love the way Jason skates to it and feel sad that Kolyada's will automatically create an unnecessary comparison between the two programs. This is why I appreciate the music Nathan Chen comes up with. Always different and compelling. Even Nathan's classical choices -- Rite of Spring, Philip Glass -- aren't skating warhorses. There's no reason that all skaters can't try harder to do the same. And why wouldn't they want to?

 

[Clairecz]

I'm looking forward to Misha skating to the Nutcracker so much I discovered Konstantin Miljukov last season thanks to him skating to the Nutcracker.

 

[elbkup]

When I first heard the news I viewed it negatively but in hindsight Mishin is a true sportsman and understands fully the concept of competition between worthy opponents. Whether he knew about Jason’s return to SL or not is beside the point: he knows it now and in a weird way MK’s switch to SL , intentional or not, is a testament of respect to Jason’s skating precision and talent. Jason is a strong competitor. While Jason’s SL may be a sentimental favorite amongst fans and audiences now, if I know Jason from years of fandom, he will make it memorable and super special. I look forward to both interpretations with enthusiasm.