Jackson Artiste to....? Upgrade help!

[thisismynewsport]

Hey peeps! Ok so lockdown in my area has gotten me into ice skating. So I purchased a pair of skates without going to a fitter because this was impossible due to lockdown restrictions. I’ve been limited to outdoor rinks because nothing is allowed to be open by law. Not knowing my skill level I opted for the Jackson Artiste women’s recreational skates.

Fast forward 4 weeks later the padding inside the boot is not as plush anymore and the foam seems to be breaking down? Outside of the skates look fine I do not see any creasing but there is a ton of creasing on the tongue. Skills I’ve been able to accomplish on my own are forward and backwards crossovers, outside 3 turns, mohawks, 2 foot spins, bunny hop, waltz jump, salchow and basic edge work.

I’ve been doing a lot of skating approximately 6-8hrs a week. However the last session I only skated for 1 hour practicing my backwards crossovers and got some pretty bad pain on the top of my ankle. I guess where the instep is. So I took a look at the tongue of my boots and you can basically fold it in the same area where I am getting the pain.

Now I suppose the Artiste boots are not made for jumping and maybe I am skating way too much for a beginner but I seriously think I need new boots. I’ve been learning these skills on my own under my own and I do not plan on learning anymore skills until I get a coach because I don’t want to develop too many bad habits or even risk getting badly injured.

I guess what I am trying to ask or the feedback I am trying to get is whether I need new boots or not. Are the Artistes past my current skill level? Are my current boots breaking down or am I underbooted? I just need to be a little more convinced before looking for a new pair of skates now that I can finally see a fitter. By the way if you think I am ready for a new pair of skates what do you think about Risport RF3 Pro? I want something with more padding at the tongue and ankles.

Also suggestions for boots and blades would be appreciated.

Stats: Female/31yrs/115lbs/5’4”

PS. Sorry for the long post. Just wanted to give people a clear picture of what’s going on.

Thank you!

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Hey peeps! Ok so lockdown in my area has gotten me into ice skating. So I purchased a pair of skates without going to a fitter because this was impossible due to lockdown restrictions. I’ve been limited to outdoor rinks because nothing is allowed to be open by law. Not knowing my skill level I opted for the Jackson Artiste women’s recreational skates.

Fast forward 4 weeks later the padding inside the boot is not as plush anymore and the foam seems to be breaking down? Outside of the skates look fine I do not see any creasing but there is a ton of creasing on the tongue. Skills I’ve been able to accomplish on my own are forward and backwards crossovers, outside 3 turns, mohawks, 2 foot spins, bunny hop, waltz jump, salchow and basic edge work.

I’ve been doing a lot of skating approximately 6-8hrs a week. However the last session I only skated for 1 hour practicing my backwards crossovers and got some pretty bad pain on the top of my ankle. I guess where the instep is. So I took a look at the tongue of my boots and you can basically fold it in the same area where I am getting the pain.

Now I suppose the Artiste boots are not made for jumping and maybe I am skating way too much for a beginner but I seriously think I need new boots. I’ve been learning these skills on my own under my own and I do not plan on learning anymore skills until I get a coach because I don’t want to develop too many bad habits or even risk getting badly injured.

I guess what I am trying to ask or the feedback I am trying to get is whether I need new boots or not. Are the Artistes past my current skill level? Are my current boots breaking down or am I underbooted? I just need to be a little more convinced before looking for a new pair of skates now that I can finally see a fitter. By the way if you think I am ready for a new pair of skates what do you think about Risport RF3 Pro? I want something with more padding at the tongue and ankles.

Stats: Female/31yrs/115lbs/5’4”

PS. Sorry for the long post. Just wanted to give people a clear picture of what’s going on.

Thank you!

Oh boy, where to start. First of all, get a coach and have them teach you the skills, you are probably learning them improperly which will possibly injure you and run you into issues later on. Secondly, the skates are all wrong. You should have never been in the boot you are in for the fact that you are an adult and need a stiffer boot that will actually fit you correctly (you really need a fitting, I know covid and all but I'm shocked your rink was even open as many closed). Do not do anything else in those boots, especially jumping.
You are skating too many hours.

Here is my advice. Go to a fitter and get measured and your feet traced and put in a brand of boot that is good for you. Why suddenly is everyone asking for a Risport RF3? is it from reading recent posts here?!?! It's a good boot but I'd put you in something else entirely as it's above your skill level and need of stiffness level, that is if a Risport is even for you.

What is your foot like? Width.: wider toebox, narrow heel or the opposite, or foot one width the whole way through?
That is how suggestions here can be made for what brand "might" work for you.

Also, last but not least, because you were skating in boots that were not meant for you and doing skills in them you shouldn't have been doing, you really need to go see an orthopaedist and get your foot(feet) ankles etc checked to make sure you didn't injure yourself.

Good luck!

 

[thisismynewsport]

@Ic3Rabbit thank you so much for your response. I know Edea’s won’t work for me because I like a tight fit and I kinda want to see what other options there are outside Jackson. I’ve heard good things about Risport in and out of this forum so that’s what got me thinking about the RF3s!

I had no idea how much I would enjoy skating which is why I opted for a recreational skate. By the way my rink is not open - outdoor only rinks are allowed in my city. As soon as they do reopen I already have a coach who is going to be teaching me. Right now I am under the “supervision” of my boyfriend who already knows all the basic skills and plays hockey and yes I know it’s a different sport. And when I say under the supervision he does make sure I am using the correct edges for my 3 turns and mohawks.

In response to foot type I have a medium arch, tapered toes (second toe same length as my big toe and tapered throughout the rest), and wider through the ball but slightly narrower at the heel. If we talk about regular shoes then that dreaded pinky toe likes to stick out sometimes when I wear sandals. Sorry if that sounded weird.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

@Ic3Rabbit thank you so much for your response. I know Edea’s won’t work for me because I like a tight fit and I kinda want to see what other options there are outside Jackson. I’ve heard good things about Risport in and out of this forum so that’s what got me thinking about the RF3s!

I had no idea how much I would enjoy skating which is why I opted for a recreational skate. By the way my rink is not open - outdoor only rinks are allowed in my city. As soon as they do reopen I already have a coach who is going to be teaching me. Right now I am under the “supervision” of my boyfriend who already knows all the basic skills and plays hockey and yes I know it’s a different sport. And when I say under the supervision he does make sure I am using the correct edges for my 3 turns and mohawks.

In response to foot type I have a medium arch, tapered toes (second toe same length as my big toe and tapered throughout the rest), and wider through the ball but slightly narrower at the heel. If we talk about regular shoes then that dreaded pinky toe likes to stick out sometimes when I wear sandals. Sorry if that sounded weird.

Risport doesn't sound like it's for you.

I would honestly stay with Jackson, because it sounds like it's best for your type foot. You could also look at Riedell and possibly Graf.

 

[thisismynewsport]

Risport doesn't sound like it's for you.

I would honestly stay with Jackson, because it sounds like it's best for your type foot. You could also look at Riedell and possibly Graf.

I’m going to a fitting tomorrow so we shall see what happens. They sell all 3 brands you mention so I should be in good hands.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Models:

Graf look at F4000, it should take you through doubles if that is where you decide to go with your skating. Because you are an adult and creased your last boots so badly these should work just fine.
Riedell: Bronze Star
Jackson: Debut Fusion.

Be aware that sizing and stiffness ratings are not universal across boot brands.


ETA: Also know that skating on natural outdoor ice is very different than indoor man made ice. Also do not take your good indoor boot/blades and skate outdoors unless you already have a new set up for indoor training.

Good luck!

 

[thisismynewsport]

Models:

Graf look at F4000, it should take you through doubles if that is where you decide to go with your skating. Because you are an adult and creased your last boots so badly these should work just fine.
Riedell: Bronze Star
Jackson: Debut Fusion.

Be aware that sizing and stiffness ratings are not universal across boot brands.


ETA: Also know that skating on natural outdoor ice is very different than indoor man made ice. Also do not take your good indoor boot/blades and skate outdoors unless you already have a new set up for indoor training.

Good luck!

Thank you! I appreciate your recommendations and advice. I will keep this thread updated with what I ended up going with.

 

[thisismynewsport]

Update: Went to my shop today and got fitted. I decided to go with the Jackson Premiere which is a bit stiffer than the Debuts. I know this is a huge jump from the Artistes but after talking to the fitter and because of my stronger legs I should be able to handle the Premieres.

After measuring my feet my fitter said my current skates are half a size too big and too wide for me. Putting on the new skates felt much better in sizing and my foot felt locked into the boot like it should.... but man those ankles hurt like a ... I looked like a new born deer.

Blades: I know this is a very unpopular choice but I decided to go with the Matrix Legacy. I know some of you reading this may be giving me the the stink eye but this was kind of my first choice blade and I have heard great things about it. Also the fitter suggested it to me based on my skill level. For whatever reason a lot of shops in my area do not carry Coronation Ace. It’s just not popular here. They did have some MK blades but the more advanced models and she said she could show them to me but it would not be the best choice.

Heat moulding: WOW!! What huge difference! And such a nice warm feeling haha. Instantly felt better but still needed the ankles punched out on both sides of the boot. So much better once that was all done. I honestly have no idea how some people are able to go through the pain without heat moulding. No skating for at least 12 hrs.... oh well.

So fast forward to 12hrs later at home.
I put on my new babies... left foot perfect but for sure needs so ice time to help breaks them in. But the right foot.... ummm what the heck... My big toe is in pain (manageable but doesn’t seem normal) and my foot is not sitting in the boot well almost like I can’t get my heel locked in properly? I feel like it is causing my foot to be pushed forward and my big toe to curl a bit because my foot isn’t flat in the boot. I’m kinda freaking out to be honest because I spent over a grand on this new set up.

Maybe I need to calm down a bit. I know I can go back to the shop and get the right boot looked at again because it was fine in the store. I double checked the sized and they are both marked 5.5 so it’s not like anything got switched in the process. I guess it just sucks because I have to wait a week before I can go back.

 

[gliese]

Blades: I know this is a very unpopular choice but I decided to go with the Matrix Legacy. I know some of you reading this may be giving me the the stink eye but this was kind of my first choice blade and I have heard great things about it. Also the fitter suggested it to me based on my skill level. For whatever reason a lot of shops in my area do not carry Coronation Ace. It’s just not popular here. They did have some MK blades but the more advanced models and she said she could show them to me but it would not be the best choice.

All I'm gonna say is that if you start getting scritchy-scratchy with your toe picks, the blade will be why. Some people do good in Matrix (such as myself a couple years ago before parts of my skating changed), but it's rare.

I put on my new babies... left foot perfect but for sure needs so ice time to help breaks them in. But the right foot.... ummm what the heck... My big toe is in pain (manageable but doesn’t seem normal) and my foot is not sitting in the boot well almost like I can’t get my heel locked in properly? I feel like it is causing my foot to be pushed forward and my big toe to curl a bit because my foot isn’t flat in the boot. I’m kinda freaking out to be honest because I spent over a grand on this new set up.

Did you wear the same socks and padding in your boots? Also, every time you take your feet out of your skates, unlace all the way and pull the tongue up. Make sure you are pulling the area where your heel locks (from the back of your arch to the first two hooks) tight. If that causes inability to bend, don't use your top hook. Some people never use it or only start using it as their boot starts to break down (or break in) and some people couldn't fathom not using it; it's a personal preference thing.

 

[thisismynewsport]

Did you wear the same socks and padding in your boots? Also, every time you take your feet out of your skates, unlace all the way and pull the tongue up. Make sure you are pulling the area where your heel locks (from the back of your arch to the first two hooks) tight. If that causes inability to bend, don't use your top hook. Some people never use it or only start using it as their boot starts to break down (or break in) and some people couldn't fathom not using it; it's a personal preference thing.

Same socks and I undid the first 2 hooks. Weird thing is that I took out the insole to test it out and my foot felt the same (pain). I think I need it heat moulded again because all was good in the shop.

 

[gliese]

Same socks and I undid the first 2 hooks. Weird thing is that I took out the insole to test it out and my foot felt the same (pain). I think I need it heat moulded again because all was good in the shop.

Maybe, but give it a couple hours on the ice.

 

[thisismynewsport]

Maybe, but give it a couple hours on the ice.

I will do that today. I just tried the skates on again at home and knee bends seem to alleviate the pressure a bit. I believe that is a good sign and it just needs to be broken in a bit more. I will follow your advice and report back in a week.

 

[MCsAngel2]

At your weight and skill level, I am side eyeing your skate shop selling you those boots and blades BIG time. I hope it works out for you, but I think you were upsold.

 

[MCsAngel2]

I also.....kind of....don't believe that skate shops in your vicinity don't carry the Coronation Ace. I'm pretty sure that's the single most popular selling blade and has been for many years. Sold out/out of stock, yes, but don't carry it at all? Hmmmmmmmm

 

[thisismynewsport]

I also.....kind of....don't believe that skate shops in your vicinity don't carry the Coronation Ace. I'm pretty sure that's the single most popular selling blade and has been for many years. Sold out/out of stock, yes, but don't carry it at all? Hmmmmmmmm

3 shops said they do not sell Coronation Ace. I know it’s extremely popular but in my area they seem to push Ultima/Matrix way more. They are not out of stock either and they said if I really wanted them it would take 2 days. So no issue getting it from the manufacturer either. The shops do carry Pattern 99 and Gold Seals and even the MK Professional Revolution (not the standard one). I went to a very reputable shop so I’m not questioning them trying to sell me stock.

I understand that the boot is above my level however a lot of my weight is in my legs which are strong from my weightlifting days. I’m not too worried about it to be honest. In the end I think it will work out. If it doesn’t then I can only blame myself because nobody was pushing me to buy anything. I need a few hours on the ice before I can really say anything. As I mention in my previous reply in the thread I will report back as in another week.

Please do not take this response as me being defensive or rude. I know I’m asking for advice and I really do appreciate your response and concern.

 

[MCsAngel2]

3 shops said they do not sell Coronation Ace. I know it’s extremely popular but in my area they seem to push Ultima/Matrix way more. They are not out of stock either and they said if I really wanted them it would take 2 days. So no issue getting it from the manufacturer either. The shops do carry Pattern 99 and Gold Seals and even the MK Professional Revolution (not the standard one). I went to a very reputable shop so I’m not questioning them trying to sell me stock.

I understand that the boot is above my level however a lot of my weight is in my legs which are strong from my weightlifting days. I’m not too worried about it to be honest. In the end I think it will work out. If it doesn’t then I can only blame myself because nobody was pushing me to buy anything. I need a few hours on the ice before I can really say anything. As I mention in my previous reply in the thread I will report back as in another week.

Please do not take this response as me being defensive or rude. I know I’m asking for advice and I really do appreciate your response and concern.

No worries, I didn't mean to seem rude either.

I find it puzzling that the shop's only non-Ultima blade offerings are the most advanced/expensive blades, and none of the common intermediate and beginner blades. Does the shop stock any non-Jackson boots? If they don't, it seems that they are an authorized Jackson retailer and not an independent retailer. Which I think would be a shame, limiting choices means some skaters will wind up settling for a set up that is not ideal.

Of course, weight alone does not determine which boot is best for you, some skaters have very strong knee bends that break down their boots quicker, maybe you are one of those. I am just so surprised you got Premieres as I am 60 lbs heavier than you and still was only recommended Debuts.

 

[gliese]

Of course, weight alone does not determine which boot is best for you, some skaters have very strong knee bends that break down their boots quicker, maybe you are one of those. I am just so surprised you got Premieres as I am 60 lbs heavier than you and still was only recommended Debuts.

This is likely as they mentioned weight lifting. I will also say, I'm OPs exact same weight and height have a strong knee bend and I doubt that I would feel comfortable at their level in a Premiere because of how stiff it is. I would want to be in a Debut for sure even with a strong knee bend.

 

[thisismynewsport]

No worries, I didn't mean to seem rude either.

I find it puzzling that the shop's only non-Ultima blade offerings are the most advanced/expensive blades, and none of the common intermediate and beginner blades. Does the shop stock any non-Jackson boots? If they don't, it seems that they are an authorized Jackson retailer and not an independent retailer. Which I think would be a shame, limiting choices means some skaters will wind up settling for a set up that is not ideal.

Yes they do sell other brands like Edea, Risport, Riedell and GAM. I wanted to try on Edea but she told me no way after looking at my foot. I mean I could have tried them on but she said my foot would not be happy in them.

 

[Sibelius]

Premieres aren't that much stiffer than Debuts. My 12 year old when from Debuts to Premieres and had no adjustment. She's about 5' and approx. 100 lbs. Our fitter questioned it, he thought it would be too stiff for her, but she likes stiff boots and had lost confidence in her Debuts on her doubles.

Do yours have the "Dura Guard" protection stuff on them? It's a shiny coating of some sort to help protect from cuts.

 

[thisismynewsport]

Premieres aren't that much stiffer than Debuts. My 12 year old when from Debuts to Premieres and had no adjustment. She's about 5' and approx. 100 lbs. Our fitter questioned it, he thought it would be too stiff for her, but she likes stiff boots and had lost confidence in her Debuts on her doubles.

Do yours have the "Dura Guard" protection stuff on them? It's a shiny coating of some sort to help protect from cuts.

I believe it has the dura guard protection film. I will have to double check that when I am home. But I actually just skated for 45 mins but the rink was FREEZING. Like basically the same temperature as outside.

So skating seemed like a success. I was kinda panicking last night. Sorry everyone for my therapy/venting session.

Spins are actually really fast and stable. Skates are way more responsive because the actually fit now. It’s incredible what a fitting can do! Pain in the right foot is still there but not nearly as bad as when I was just standing around in my hour. Overall I am quite happy with my choice.

Edited (typo)