2021 Worlds: Ladies FS "Thoughts and Observations"

[Flying Feijoa]

Granted I don't live in China right now and perhaps that's why those words affected me but I said it as someone who is Chinese. Considering the state of current affairs where there's been an increase in casual and outright racism towards Asian people (Chinese in particular), I find it in bad taste to criticise a Chinese person skating to traditional Chinese music for being "cheesy".

I believe the person who said that is also of Chinese descent. So, I don't think we can label that as racism. Although, I'm not sure calling something "cheesy" is ever particularly racist. Every culture has "cheesy" music. But, of course, I understand why you would be particularly sensitive right now.

Thanks @readernick for helping to clarify my stance. Maybe I should have stated my ethnicity from the beginning, given the current political climate.

I'm proud of my own heritage, acutely aware of anti-Chinese/East Asian discrimination and appreciative of the symbolism in Karen's music choice. I was just overexposed to Butterfly Lovers throughout my childhood/adolescence. It's not unpleasant, but it makes me mentally disengage. There is nary an Olympic cycle when a Chinese pair doesn't skate to either Butterfly Lovers, Mo Li Hua or Turandot (the latter having become sort of reappropriated...)

Here are a few alternatives:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWY9tLkm7zg Kind of retro and Yunnan-specific, but includes some of my grandmum's favourite movie theme songs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBOKeVsiJho Collection of 'classical' Chinese pieces (as opposed to folk songs or Western-influenced fusion genres)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60hOVk4uud0 Popular repertoire among Chinese orchestras
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfBosRFSrtA A traditional Shanxi folk song
Various wuxia film scores (not traditional but fun and lots to choose from)
Mandopop/Cantopop/Hokkien-pop

The Yellow River Concerto turns up occasionally in skating but it might have awkward nationalistic (PRC) overtones.

 

[Jontor]

I was experimenting with switching the scoring to the old judging system for the Ladies at Worlds.

Here is how it all would have ended up with the old scoring:

1 (1) Anna Shcherbakova 2.5
2 (2) Elizaveta Tuktamysheva 4.5
3 (3) Alexandra Trusova 7.0
4 (6) Kaori Sakamoto 8.0
5 (4) Karen Chen 8.0
6 (5) Loena Henrickx 9.0
7 (7) Rika Kihira 10.0
8 (9) Bradie Tennell 11.5
9 (8) Olga Mikutina 12.5
10 (10) Lee Hae-in 15.0

So, the big change would be that Kaori moves up to 4th with the same points as Karen but would win over her as her free program was ranked higher. But as Bradie moves up one place, US still would have managed to get that 3rd spot for the Olympic season.

I am a bit surprised that Trusova managed to hang on to her bronze medal, I didn't expect that. She would have taken bronze even if she was only second in the free. The thing is though, she would never have scored as high in the free with the old system as they always held the scores back for earlier groups. On the other hand, she probably wouldn't have been 12th after the short either, they would have held her up and maybe she would have skated in the last group anyway. That's how unreasonable the old system was. (Michelle Kwan comes to mind in 99. Terrible short, that shouldn't have been in the top 10, but they ranked her 4th! Just ridiculous!)

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I was experimenting with switching the scoring to the old judging system for the Ladies at Worlds.

Here is how it all would have ended up with the old scoring:

1 (1) Anna Shcherbakova 2.5
2 (2) Elizaveta Tuktamysheva 4.5
3 (3) Alexandra Trusova 7.0
4 (6) Kaori Sakamoto 8.0
5 (4) Karen Chen 8.0
6 (5) Loena Henrickx 9.0
7 (7) Rika Kihira 10.0
8 (9) Bradie Tennell 11.5
9 (8) Olga Mikutina 12.5
10 (10) Lee Hae-in 15.0

So, the big change would be that Kaori moves up to 4th with the same points as Karen but would win over her as her free program was ranked higher. But as Bradie moves up one place, US still would have managed to get that 3rd spot for the Olympic season.

I am a bit surprised that Trusova managed to hang on to her bronze medal, I didn't expect that. She would have taken bronze even if she was only second in the free. The thing is though, she would never have scored as high in the free with the old system as they always held the scores back for earlier groups. On the other hand, she probably wouldn't have been 12th after the short either, they would have held her up and maybe she would have skated in the last group anyway. That's how unreasonable the old system was. (Michelle Kwan comes to mind in 99. Terrible short, that shouldn't have been in the top 10, but they ranked her 4th! Just ridiculous!)

Interesting rankings under 6.0!

Wow, I totally forgot about this... but 5.5 for technical and 5.9's for presentation (it wasn't even a great program!)... under IJS she def would have not been 4th - and it actually cost Malinina (who should have placed higher than her in the SP) the bronze.

Michelle Kwan 1999 Worlds SP

www.youtube.com

 

[Mathman]

Michelle got the "world champion's bonus" The reigning champion is always givern every possible chance to retain the title. I think that the reasoning goes like this: to become champion you have to knock out the old champ. If anyone else wants to become champion, they have to dominate in similar fashion.

 

[Jontor]

Interesting rankings under 6.0!

Wow, I totally forgot about this... but 5.5 for technical and 5.9's for presentation (it wasn't even a great program!)... under IJS she def would have not been 4th - and it actually cost Malinina (who should have placed higher than her in the SP) the bronze.

Michelle Kwan 1999 Worlds SP

www.youtube.com

Yes, looking at it now the judges were very kind, which they couldn't have been under the IJS. The technical elements were not much to shout about...a very wobbly flutz, fall on the 2A, and only a 3T (the technical standard already at this point was to have a Flip or at aleast a Loop as the second jump), the spins were underwhelming. Great spirals as always though, but that was the only highlight in this program.

There were loads of ladies beating this technically, they may not all have the presentation Kwan had, but under IJS they definitely would have beaten her.

It's funny to hear Eurosport Chris commentate this, he is always super positive about everyone, but here he was not. "She will be lucky to be in the top 5" he said, which means that was the most unlikely positive scenario he could think of, he really felt she would be way down.

 

[Jontor]

Michelle got the "world champion's bonus" The reigning champion is always givern every possible chance to retain the title. I think that the reasoning goes like this: to become champion you have to knock out the old champ. If anyone else wants to become champion, they have to dominate in similar fashion.

Yes, and we still got that Champ bonus today. But it is much harder to hold up skaters with high PCS and fake GOE now. I mean, there is no other way to judge a fall than with -5 GOE.

 

[Jontor]

Interesting rankings under 6.0!

Wow, I totally forgot about this... but 5.5 for technical and 5.9's for presentation (it wasn't even a great program!)... under IJS she def would have not been 4th - and it actually cost Malinina (who should have placed higher than her in the SP) the bronze.

Michelle Kwan 1999 Worlds SP

www.youtube.com

And here is Malinina's short. Again, interesting to hear what the Eurosport commentators were saying, they usually are so objetive and positive about everyone, but here they were kinda sure this would be above Kwan.

Tatiana Malinina UZB - 1999 World Championships SP

QB : 2nd, SP : 5th, LP : 3rd, 4th placeMarch 20th-28th, Helsinki FIN

www.youtube.com

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Yes, and we still got that Champ bonus today. But it is much harder to hold up skaters with high PCS and fake GOE now. I mean, there is no other way to judge a fall than with -5 GOE.

Oh champions still get -4 and even -3s for falls.

 

[Lzbee]

Oh champions still get -4 and even -3s for falls.

Was just thinking this too. It really grinds my gears. Why does the system not give an automatic -5 when it's an F smh

 

[Blades of Passion]

Wow, I totally forgot about this... but 5.5 for technical and 5.9's for presentation (it wasn't even a great program!)... under IJS she def would have not been 4th - and it actually cost Malinina (who should have placed higher than her in the SP) the bronze.

Michelle Kwan 1999 Worlds SP

www.youtube.com

Under IJS if someone is getting the levels, GOE's, and PCS over other people, they are definitely going to be placing higher with a fall.

Malinina was weak in the SP and did not deserve to beat Kwan, they were both overmarked. Malinina's performance had a lack of confidence and choreography and musicality, messy edges, worse spirals and footwork and combo spin, and a step out on the most important jump of the program, which cost her credit for the combination. I'd put her 11th in the SP. There wasn't anything special about that performance, she just had more hype at the time because of winning the GPF earlier in season (the weakest GPF ever).