Skaters who have done well only at senior level without success at juniors?

[TT_Fin]

There is a thread about why it is so hard to turn from juniors to seniors, but how about opposite way? Is there any skaters, who have never got noteworthy success at juniors not even at national level, but got medals or maybe won nationals and maybe got also international success at seniors?

I wrote in some thread before Emmi P. has not taken part in juniors at nationals, but I checked it is not true, because she has got one silver at juniors. It is 13/14 which is not visible on her ISU profile.

 

[yume]

Bradie Tennel. She turned senior at 19yo and before that, wasn't in spotlight in juniors, at least internationally. I don't think she had even won a JGP medal.
Then in her first senior season she won nats and went to olys.

 

[AlexBreeze]

Mark Kondratiuk. He performed at JNats only once and finished 16th.

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

What about Marilena Kitromilis? She had no success whatsoever in Juniors, because she completely skipped Junior level!

Marilena went straight from doing domestic competitions in America at Novice level one season, to doing international competitions at Senior level the following season.

And in her second season in Seniors, she won a Challenger event, the 2021 Autumn Classic.

CaroLiza_fan

 

[kolyadafan2002]

Javier fernandez wasn't anything special at junior level

 

[Lzbee]

Loena Hendrickx. Her highest JGP placement was 9th.

Katelyn Osmond maybe? She was quite successful at nationals as a junior but doesn't have any international junior medals.

 

[GoneWithTheWind]

In ice dance, Guignard and Fabbri.
She once won French Jr. Nats and finished 19th at Jr. Worlds. He won bronze at Italian Jr. Nats and finished 20th at Jr. Worlds.
Together on the senior level, they've won 6 GP medals, 2 European medals, 1 GPF medal, 4 national golds and 8 national silvers so far. It also took 9 seasons before they won a medal higher than Challenger level!

 

[eppen]

If there is not supposed to be any success at all in juniors, not even national, then none of the singles mentioned actually qualifies. Except maybe Kitromilis, but even she medaled in lower level national competitions as a pre-junior.

Not a whole lot of data on Osmond - the Canadian results are poorly available, but Wikipedia tells me she medaled at nationals at junior level, and had poor success and very few junior competitions internationally.

Emmi Peltonen also medaled nationally and in quite a few international junior competitions, but just not in the JGP.

Bradie Tennell was pretty much unbeatable in the US regional and sectional circuits, won the nationals as a junior and even got medals in minor international juniors.

Kondratiuk medaled in 5 minor international junior competitions before turning senior even without much national junior success.

Hendrickx won the nationals as a junior and medaled in smaller international competitions.

And Javi, the apple of my eye, he sure has no junior record to boast, but even he won the nationals as a junior a couple of times. And medaled at Merano Cup as a novice skater.

It is very hard to hide talent for that long?

E

 

[kolyadafan2002]

If there is not supposed to be any success at all in juniors, not even national, then none of the singles mentioned actually qualifies. Except maybe Kitromilis, but even she medaled in lower level national competitions as a pre-junior.

Not a whole lot of data on Osmond - the Canadian results are poorly available, but Wikipedia tells me she medaled at nationals at junior level, and had poor success and very few junior competitions internationally.

Emmi Peltonen also medaled nationally and in quite a few international junior competitions, but just not in the JGP.

Bradie Tennell was pretty much unbeatable in the US regional and sectional circuits, won the nationals as a junior and even got medals in minor international juniors.

Kondratiuk medaled in 5 minor international junior competitions before turning senior even without much national junior success.

Hendrickx won the nationals as a junior and medaled in smaller international competitions.

And Javi, the apple of my eye, he sure has no junior record to boast, but even he won the nationals as a junior a couple of times. And medaled at Merano Cup as a novice skater.

It is very hard to hide talent for that long?

E

A note about nationals: in small feds with few skaters, winning doesn't necessarily show talent to be a top international skater, particularly with the lack of male skaters in Spain back then.
It's one thing to win Monaco junior nationals, quite another to win russian junior nationals.

And of course, the right skater needs to find the right coaches etc. Lots of possibilities and probabilities for skaters.

 

[dorispulaski]

Tonya Harding - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Did Tonya Harding ever compete as a junior? I do not remember her doing so.

 

[mrrice]

If Alissa Czisny was a strong Junior, I never heard about it. The first time I saw her was in 2005 at Skate Canada. Not the best jumper but, those spins......

 

[mrrice]

Tonya Harding - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Did Tonya Harding ever compete as a junior? I do not remember her doing so.

I agree, if she was a great Junior, I certainly never heard about it.

 

[yyzskater]

If there is not supposed to be any success at all in juniors, not even national, then none of the singles mentioned actually qualifies. Except maybe Kitromilis, but even she medaled in lower level national competitions as a pre-junior.

Not a whole lot of data on Osmond - the Canadian results are poorly available, but Wikipedia tells me she medaled at nationals at junior level, and had poor success and very few junior competitions internationally.

Emmi Peltonen also medaled nationally and in quite a few international junior competitions, but just not in the JGP.

Bradie Tennell was pretty much unbeatable in the US regional and sectional circuits, won the nationals as a junior and even got medals in minor international juniors.

Kondratiuk medaled in 5 minor international junior competitions before turning senior even without much national junior success.

Hendrickx won the nationals as a junior and medaled in smaller international competitions.

And Javi, the apple of my eye, he sure has no junior record to boast, but even he won the nationals as a junior a couple of times. And medaled at Merano Cup as a novice skater.

It is very hard to hide talent for that long?

E

 

[yyzskater]

From her commentary with Ted Barton at Nationals, she mentioned she went to her first JGP with just a 2A and a shakey 3S. Oh, how times have changed!

 

[blue_idealist]

What about Marilena Kitromilis? She had no success whatsoever in Juniors, because she completely skipped Junior level!

Marilena went straight from doing domestic competitions in America at Novice level one season, to doing international competitions at Senior level the following season.

And in her second season in Seniors, she won a Challenger event, the 2021 Autumn Classic.

CaroLiza_fan

Nicole Watt from Canada back in the early '00s wasn't super-successful, but I remember that she skipped right over Jrs. domestically and won the senior title one year. She did compete at Jr. Worlds, though.

 

[eppen]

A note about nationals: in small feds with few skaters, winning doesn't necessarily show talent to be a top international skater, particularly with the lack of male skaters in Spain back then.
It's one thing to win Monaco junior nationals, quite another to win russian junior nationals.

And of course, the right skater needs to find the right coaches etc. Lots of possibilities and probabilities for skaters.

You are absolutely right - but as the original question did not make any difference btw nations or quality of that junior success, Javi's jr wins did have to be included.

Also, even if you are the only one competing (he was sometimes), you can be better than what your country's general level suggests.

Tonya Harding - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Did Tonya Harding ever compete as a junior? I do not remember her doing so.

In those days, there really was no such established junior scene as there is now. The age limit for seniors was 12 and so you could go straight to international competitions at 11 or 12 (and they also did) - younger than the juniors these days. Only after the age restrictions were applied in the 1990s, the junior scene really started to develop.

Wikipedia shows Harding's first nationals in 1985-6 when she was 15 and first international competitions the next season - medals in both national and international comps that year. She surely must have competed before that...

National junior scenes have existed of course, but because of the no real age restrictions in the seniors, the participants might have not been the best skaters in the country. Even after the age restrictions were applied, juniors have been able to participate in the senior nationals, so the top skaters might have skipped junior nats completely.

Alissa Czisny medaled in the US jr nats in 2001 and was very successful in the sectional/regional circuits. She also medaled in the JGP and was in the JGP final in 2002.

E

 

[dorispulaski]

It is true that the Junior circuit was not as well developed, but Junior World's existed since 1976. But even Michelle Kwan stopped to win a Junior competition at Gardena before going Senior at age 12 or 13.

Michelle Kwan - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[eppen]

It is true that the Junior circuit was not as well developed, but Junior World's existed since 1976. But even Michelle Kwan stopped to win a Junior competition at Gardena before going Senior at age 12 or 13.

Michelle Kwan - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

She was seemingly only a couple of years later that Tonya, but it seems to have meant surprisingly much.

Since the beginning of the jr Worlds in 1976 until late 1980s, very few skaters participating in them made in big. Curiously enough, US women are a slight majority: Zayak, Sumners, Chin, Cook. The others were Kira Ivanova, Midori Ito, and Elizabeth Manley. But that was everyone for 11 seasons. The end of the 1980s marked a slight increase in participation of future big names (eg Yamaguchi, Sato, Chen Lu, Bonaly, etc, 2-3 names every season) and by the time Michelle went in 1994, it seemed to have been already a more common thing to do for the young top skaters.

The competition was pretty stiff in the US at the time which might explain why they took that opportunity to do international competitions. The first age raise from 12 to 14 happened around this time also, but Michelle was not affected by it.

I have also wondered how much the termination of compulsory figures meant for career choices for the top girls. Compulsories kept the jumping beans from shooting straight to the top, but after they were no longer, would that have made a difference in how they planned their seasons? Travel got also easier as time went on.

But it is interesting that she went to Gardena (she was still 12 at the time, it was a spring competition and she was born in July) . Gardena was established to include a junior competition from its start in 1990 - it was a newish addition to the competition schedule in 1993. Funnily enough, there does not seem to be info even on the medalists on a regular basis until the mid-1990s. The Americans seem to have really loved it as the winner in the singles in juniors was a US skater almost all the time until the mid 2010s!

E

 

[macy]

i'd say Alissa Czisny had more success as a senior than a junior.

 

[mskater93]

I agree, if she was a great Junior, I certainly never heard about it.

I believe she skipped from Novice to Senior