Look for gold for Cohen and Belbin/Agosto! | Golden Skate

Look for gold for Cohen and Belbin/Agosto!

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
After the blatant overscoring of Evan Lysacek in the mens competition I am not pretty sure Cohen will win the womens gold, and I also now believe Belbin
/Agosto have a great chance at the dance gold. It is very apparent to me that NBC and the USFSA have something cooking, similar to the gymnastics at the 2004 Olympics that led to a questionable gold for Carly Patterson, and a farcial gold for Paul Hamm which is still being debated and even ridiculed to this day. Poor Inoue/Baldwin were left out to dry and were even undermarked for their stunning short program. U.S TV thrives on American success in judged sports in the Olympics after all, for the men it was a toss up who to determine to lobby for between Weir and Lysacek, and since Weir got the scores he deserved for both his programs, they obviously chose Lysacek. For the women and dance it is a clear call which American to lobby for. I hope that Cohen and Belbin/Agosto skate well enough to deserve their gold medals that they are going to win, barring major errors from both and stunning performances from their Russian rivals Slutskaya and Navka/Kostomarov, and if Cohen does a program with only minor errors Irina will definitely need one of her hardest triple/triples to win. Hopefully they perform like true Olympic Champions so there will be no controversy to their wins.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
wow. I don't know what to say. I still am convinced it's the Russians' to lose. Irina will win ladies and N and K will win Dance. Belbin and Agosto might win silver or bronze, and Cohen might get a bronze, or a silver if she does well.
 

Kwanford Wife

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
slutskayafan21 said:
After the blatant overscoring of Evan Lysacek in the mens competition I am not pretty sure Cohen will win the womens gold, and I also now believe Belbin
/Agosto have a great chance at the dance gold. It is very apparent to me that NBC and the USFSA have something cooking, similar to the gymnastics at the 2004 Olympics that led to a questionable gold for Carly Patterson, and a farcial gold for Paul Hamm which is still being debated and even ridiculed to this day. Poor Inoue/Baldwin were left out to dry and were even undermarked for their stunning short program. U.S TV thrives on American success in judged sports in the Olympics after all, for the men it was a toss up who to determine to lobby for between Weir and Lysacek, and since Weir got the scores he deserved for both his programs, they obviously chose Lysacek. For the women and dance it is a clear call which American to lobby for. I hope that Cohen and Belbin/Agosto skate well enough to deserve their gold medals that they are going to win, barring major errors from both and stunning performances from their Russian rivals Slutskaya and Navka/Kostomarov, and if Cohen does a program with only minor errors Irina will definitely need one of her hardest triple/triples to win. Hopefully they perform like true Olympic Champions so there will be no controversy to their wins.

:laugh: :rofl: :rofl:

You know, I'm convinced you go on these rants just for me... Too funny!!!

I'd be so surprised if Irina didn't win... for so many different reasons... Don't lose the faith just yet... But if your predicition comes true, there is a good chance that I'll be done with the competitive side of figure skating... Not because I've turned anti-American skaters, but because I simply cannot fathom a world in which Irina didn't win this gold and B&A beat Navka...

I do agree a controversy is looming however, but I think its going to be a $$$ controversy surrounding the NJS vs. the skaters...
 

FreeKatie

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 21, 2005
slutskayafan21 said:
After the blatant overscoring of Evan Lysacek in the mens competition I am not pretty sure Cohen will win the womens gold, and I also now believe Belbin
/Agosto have a great chance at the dance gold.

Did Irina have a bad practice today or something? :laugh:
 

Frau Muller

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 1, 2005
Unless Irina pulls "an Evan" in the SP *and* "a Johnny" in the LP (two bad programs), she will win the Ladies gold medal -- plain & simple.

Navka/Kostomarov may very well be defeated by either B&A (the more likely upsetters) or maybe by D&V. The weirdest (but possible?) scenario would be an out-of-left-field defeat by the 'great unknowns' of this season -- Fusar-Poli/Margaglio, world champs in 2001. Remember: they are the only world champs in the dance competition beside the current champs.
 

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
FreeKatie said:
Did Irina have a bad practice today or something? :laugh:

I have heard she is having good practices, it does not matter when NBC and the USFSA have pulled their strings. However Russia is pretty good at that as well, so it might even out in the end. We will have to see. Russia is not a country like Japan, Switzerland, Canada, who had their skaters unfairly treated by the judges compared to the dealmaking bolstered Americans, that has no political power, no sway, no financial power to fight back, they likely will and it might even out.
 

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
Frau Muller said:
The weirdest (but possible?) scenario would be an out-of-left-field defeat by the 'great unknowns' of this season -- Fusar-Poli/Margaglio, world champs in 2001. Remember: they are the only world champs in the dance competition beside the current champs.

Unless they look stunning to what everybody has heard about them, that would be some real dealmaking though. :rofl:
 

millie

Medalist
Joined
Nov 1, 2004
Oh boy, this is looking good for Joannie. There is a chance that things may turn out for Joannie and they did for Jeff. She may be the one to medal. Wouldn't that be great. You never know how the judges are going to judge this competition.
 

nymkfan51

Medalist
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Frau Muller said:
Unless Irina pulls "an Evan" in the SP *and* "a Johnny" in the LP (two bad programs), she will win the Ladies gold medal -- plain & simple.

Exactly, Frau! :agree:

But thanks anyway, Slutskayafan21, for the good laugh ... I needed that today!!! :clap:
 

FreeKatie

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 21, 2005
slutskayafan21 said:
I have heard she is having good practices, it does not matter when NBC and the USFSA have pulled their strings. However Russia is pretty good at that as well, so it might even out in the end. We will have to see. Russia is not a country like Japan, Switzerland, Canada, who had their skaters unfairly treated by the judges compared to the dealmaking bolstered Americans, that has no political power, no sway, no financial power to fight back, they likely will and it might even out.


thanks for the comedy relief!!:bow:
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
:sheesh: EVAN was overscored... how about: try Evgeny... :sheesh:


and the sour grapes keep coming 'round :laugh:
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Tonichelle said:
:sheesh: EVAN was overscored... how about: try Evgeny... :sheesh:
Toni, don't tell me you didn't appreciate the ALL TIME GREAT MEN'S PERFORMANCE IN THE HISTORY OF FIGURE SKATING, according to the NJS.

Let's see...Stroke, stroke, stroke, jump
Stroke, stroke, stroke, jump
Stoke, stroke, stroke, jump
Stroke, stroke, strok, jump
Stroke, stroke, stroke, jump (is that 8 jumping passes yet? Ok...)

Wave your arms, wave your arms, wave your arms (as Dick Button said, bamboozle the audience into thinking you are doing something, when you are really just resting)

then end with a half-hearted spin and a little sheepish smile.

PCSs through the roof for Transitions (what transitions?), choreography (what choreography?), Interpretation (what interpretation?) :laugh:

On topic, though, I don't think any of this will help Belbin and Agosto (maybe bronze?). NBC TV might be NBC TV, but ice dance is ice dance.

However, they might sacrifice Irina if it comes down to the last go-round and the U.S. has not won anything at all. Look for Sasha to be held up in the SP anyway. Who will watch TV on Saturday if the game is over on Thursday?

MM
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
Mathman said:
Toni, don't tell me you didn't appreciate the ALL TIME GREAT MEN'S PERFORMANCE IN THE HISTORY OF FIGURE SKATING, according to the NJS.

you are so weird lol :rofl:

considering a lot of guys in the past have gotten away with a subpar performance to win I guess I can't complain too much...

but to say Evan didn't deserve his marks is disgusting... try Joubert who with two flawed programs beat Matt Savoie... or Evgeni just being so far ahead of everyone before you beat up on Evan
 

Kwanford Wife

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Mathman said:
Wave your arms, wave your arms, wave your arms (as Dick Button said, bamboozle the audience into thinking you are doing something, when you are really just resting)

then end with a half-hearted spin and a little sheepish smile.

PCSs through the roof for Transitions (what transitions?), choreography (what choreography?), Interpretation (what interpretation?) :laugh:

On topic, though, I don't think any of this will help Belbin and Agosto (maybe bronze?). NBC TV might be NBC TV, but ice dance is ice dance.

However, they might sacrifice Irina if it comes down to the last go-round and the U.S. has not won anything at all. Look for Sasha to be held up in the SP anyway. Who will watch TV on Saturday if the game is over on Thursday?

MM

MM, I will definately be watching TV... I hate what is happening to this sport. I love Plushy but that was a joke.

I'd be very surprised if Sasha was held up too high, though, the USFSA doesn't go all out for her like it has for Kwan, nor does she appear to factor into their long term planning (they have a "face" with Kwan & new, young star who'd stick around in Kimmie)... Add that to Russsia's formitable powers at politicing and you have Irina, '06 OGM. Now, what may cause some fun drama is the possiblity of Emily going all out during the short program & landing within podium range... then we'll see some fireworks ~ that story line is just too good. Add to that a Ladies contingenant with lots of headcases & yes my friends its looking good for Irina...

However, like I've said earlier, its good that the winners are the favorites therefore people don't look to hard at the "how" of winning... and those that do are accused of "sour grapes."

(somebody please explain to me how complaining about how the new system is applied = sour grapes... please?!?)
 

slutskayafan21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
Tonichelle said:
but to say Evan didn't deserve his marks is disgusting...

Actually the fact that a skating fan would actually have the gall to say something like that is the thing that is truly disgusting. :laugh:
 

Dibs

Rinkside
Joined
Nov 2, 2005
Carly Patterson's gold in Athens was hardly "questionable" as I recall Svetlana Khorkina made several small mistakes and had some steps and shaky landings. Paul Hamm's gold is definitely questionable, but Carly had a clean competition.
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
slutskayafan21 said:
Actually the fact that a skating fan would actually have the gall to say something like that is the thing that is truly disgusting. :laugh:

:sheesh: hilarious

Dibs said:
Carly Patterson's gold in Athens was hardly "questionable" as I recall Svetlana Khorkina made several small mistakes and had some steps and shaky landings. Paul Hamm's gold is definitely questionable, but Carly had a clean competition.

don't you know Americans are never supposed to beat Russians... it's not "right" and it's all NBC's fault :sheesh:
 
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slutskayafan21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
Dibs said:
Carly Patterson's gold in Athens was hardly "questionable" as I recall Svetlana Khorkina made several small mistakes and had some steps and shaky landings. Paul Hamm's gold is definitely questionable, but Carly had a clean competition.

I agree Carly's was not near as blatantly wrong as Paul's, and her gold was acceptable, although still debatable IMO. However Chorkina was underscored on two events clearly, vault and floor. On vault Carly did a vault with good but not outstanding height and form(it is not one of her great events, she is only good on vault and bars even at her best, but great on beam and floor), took a hop to the side, and was out of bounds, and it was only a 9.8 SV. She got a 9.3+. Chorkina did a vault with a 9.9 SV, stuck the landing cold, was perfectly down the centre, and had great height and distance. She should have outscored Carly by atleast 0.3 on vault but only did by just over 0.1. On floor Chorkina also deserved atleast a 9.650, but was given a 9.562. Chorkina's tumbling was not the hardest but it was still a 10 S.V routine and her passes were clean and her dance was the best of the event. I had no problem with Patterson scoring higher on floor, but Chorkina should have been closer than she was in the score. Chorkina was overscored on bars though, by about 0.15 since she did not do anywhere near her usual routine, she and Carly should have been about tied on bars, although it is an event Chorkina would normaly be well ahead. So Chorkina should have gained ground on Patterson from vault and floor, relative to the scores that were given, but Carly to Chorkina on bars. Had all events been judged correctly it would have been very close.

As for Paul Hamm, well we agree here. What a joke his gold was. I think even he knows it, hasnt he retired now?
 

rob43

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 1, 2005
Slutefan- Carly may not always please the eye but her win was pretty decisive. She had a clear adavantage in start values. (Partly because Khorkina lost some bonus.) That is why Patterson won- 2 clean routines with 10 start value and two routines that were not great but started at 9.8 and 9.9.

I understand thinking she isn't artistic or lacks great lines- but she had the start values the other women didn't and that won it for her. To be honest if Courtney Kupets had not been injured she might have beat both based on her ability to turn in clean perfromances but she too lacked about .2 of Patterson's total start values.

And Hamm deserves his Gold- if anyone was gifted it was the second place finisher who actually should have lost SV but the judges didn't notice. Oh- and the Greek guy winning in EF was also a travesty. As was Pavlova finishing 4th in the AA- she should have won 3rd.

I don't know why you get such pleasure out of declaring everyone false winners. If the judges wanted to give anyone a medal they would have, all the men missed multiple elements except Lysachek and (obviously) Plushenko. And even Evgeny had inflated scores- the correct placement but very high component scores for the content. Evan's scores reflected both his great skate and how sloppy everyone else became.
 
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