Yu Na, Mao, Kimmie and who else?

Joesitz (RIP) · May 23, 2006

In the battle of the sexes, it is believed by some (mainly by me) that the Men's Division will be more exciting than the Ladies because of the anticipated close competition. (Lambiel, Joubert, Lysacek, Buttle, Sandhu, Mabee, Weir, Takehashi, Oda - not easy to pick a podium here except for favorites)

How many Ladies (Yu Na, Mao, Kimmie, Joannie, Sasha - maybe Fumie and Michelle) are so close to podium standards that their competition will be exciting?

I don't think I could pick the Lady winner but I could assume the podium and I do not think it will be an interesting contest.

Joe

attyfan · May 23, 2006

While Mao, Yu-Na and Kimmie are currently the "next big thing", I don't think that Emily, Katy, Christine Z, Elena G (just to name a few) are going to be spending this summer sitting on the couch watching TV. Remember Naomi Nari Nam? Miki Ando? Both the "next big thing", hyped to the gills -- and never made it (although NNN might still do it in pairs)

dizzydi7 · May 23, 2006

I remember the hype about Carolina Kostner. Wasn't she going to be the big upset in Torino----the Olympic Gold medalist?

Just goes to show us that it's hard to impossible to predict the next great skater. As so many have said before, it's a long gueling four years to the next Olympics.

Dizzy

R.D. · May 23, 2006

I think more will happen than many people think. Just think about it for a moment- the dominant veterans are basically retiring now. That opens up the field for a whole new generation of skaters. And if there was ever a time to say "ANYTHING can and WILL happen," it is now. JMO

Joesitz (RIP) · May 23, 2006

dizzydi7 said:
I remember the hype about Carolina Kostner. Wasn't she going to be the big upset in Torino----the Olympic Gold medalist?

Just goes to show us that it's hard to impossible to predict the next great skater. As so many have said before, it's a long gueling four years to the next Olympics.Dizzy

This is not a prediction thread. It is about which division will be more exciting this coming season.
.
Are Gedevenashvili,Katie, Emily on equal footing with Oda, Sandhu and Weir as people you expect to be on the podium? All the boys are. That is my point.

Given all the nine boys mentioned skate their best, it will be an exciting event. I see only 4 ladies to make it interesting. It will be somewhat less exciting. JMO

Joe

hockeyfan228 · May 23, 2006

It doesn't matter to me if every Ladies' competition next year is decided by .2 and the winners keep changing. The only current (based on 2005-6) top Ladies whose skating interests me (so far) are Kim -- I'm interested to see how she develops -- and Rochette. (And Cohen, if she returns.) I'm more interested to see if Ando, Kostner, Volchkova, and Sebestyen can get back their form, if Meier can continue to improve at the same rate she did over the past season, and if Poykio can take the next step. I'd rather watch Yan Liu, Tugba Karademir, Kiira Korpi, and Arina Martinova than any of the other top ladies.

But the men: bring on Lambiel, Joubert, Weir, Buttle, Sandhu, Oda, Takahashi, and Li anytime. (I'm not familiar with Preaubert.) The only one among the top men I don't really like is Lysacek, which is too bad, because he has so much potential, although I have to admire his grit and competitive spine.

Mathman · May 23, 2006

hockeyfan228 said:
It doesn't matter to me if every Ladies' competition next year is decided by .2 and the winners keep changing....

To me, that would be very interesting because it would provide data for a neat study of the New Judging System.

The new question in competitive figure skating is how to milk that last .2 points out of the CoP. (As for being transported to paradise by the exquisite beauty of the performance, we have our MK tapes for that

)

For ladies, this means, how to work in seven triples. If you have a triple Axel (Mao), it's easy: Do all six different triples, then repeat one with a double loop tacked on.

If you have a tripel-triple (Kimmie), do two of them and a double Axel.

If you are Yu-na Kim, rack up the points on the PCS side.

How will the NJS respond, if this is indeed the direction that figure skating has taken?

MM

Lucy25 · May 23, 2006

Personally, I hope Joannie and Carolina come out strong next year and are very competive with Yu Na, Mao, and Kimmie. Miki Ando, too. What a season it would be if all these ladies skate their best! :clap:

demarinis5 · May 23, 2006

For me the ladies will be more exciting than the men. If the dominant ladies
retire that will open a new field and it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

As for the men the next couple of seasons won't change much. The current crop of top men will be battling for the podium and each one of them capable of making it.

SeaniBu · May 23, 2006

Yukina, Yukari? is there an age limit? "Japan is about take over the world."
Nipon has already started, I like the idea, and I am not just talking about FS

Skye · May 24, 2006

Talking of data, thanks to the COP, we can use previous scores as guidelines for future projection.

2005/06 Season Best & Season Average

Irina Slutskaya 198.06 / 190.07
Sasha Cohen 183.36 / 179.92
Shizuka Arakawa 191.34 / 179.41
Mao Asada 189.62 / 175.50
Yu-Na Kim 177.54 / 168.48
Kimmie Meissner 189.87 / 165.87
Joannie Rochette 167.27 / 163.23
Fumie Suguri 181.27 / 161.75
Elena Sokolova 177.85 / 160.61
Yukari Nakano 167.86 / 159.87
Miki Ando 172.30 / 156.04
Sarah Meier 170.47 / 155.62
Carolina Kostner 172.45 / 150.16
Alissa Czisny 164.05 / 148.18
Emily Hughes 160.87 / 143.12
Katy Taylor 167.27 / 142.23
Elene Gedevanishvili 153.27 / 140.02

With Arakawa heading for the pros, and Slutskaya and Cohen rumoured to be season-off for a break, you can see next season should be Mao's to lose. But even she came behind Yu-Na in a junior competition and look at what Kimmie did with a performance of her life at Worlds. Rochette has been very steady, and veterans like Suguri and Sokolova are not to be ruled out yet. I suppose any of these ladies can be considered strong candidates for the podium, and whoever pulls off a clean 7 triple program becomes the Champion that night.

As for other up-and-coming ladies who have had some of their own moments to shine, IMO they will need at least another improving season for a step up. Czisny is much too inconsistent, Taylor does not yet have adequate experience yet and Gedevanishvili, lovely as she might be, has been a Cohen Jr in most of her LPs.

My personal hopes are on Yukina Ota to make a strong comeback.

Ladskater · May 24, 2006

Joesitz said:
In the battle of the sexes, it is believed by some (mainly by me) that the Men's Division will be more exciting than the Ladies because of the anticipated close competition. (Lambiel, Joubert, Lysacek, Buttle, Sandhu, Mabee, Weir, Takehashi, Oda - not easy to pick a podium here except for favorites)

How many Ladies (Yu Na, Mao, Kimmie, Joannie, Sasha - maybe Fumie and Michelle) are so close to podium standards that their competition will be exciting?

I don't think I could pick the Lady winner but I could assume the podium and I do not think it will be an interesting contest.

Joe

Hi Joe:

I have been a figure skater and around figure skating for many years - don't want to give my age away, but it's kind of always been the men's discipline is more exciting and filled with great rivalry over the ladies. It's not that there have not been some surprises in the ladies discipline either - Midori Ito for example added some great drama to the ladies - who could beat her when it came to jumping? In fact, Kurt Browning always said "Midori could easily compete with the men."

The ladies are getting more challenging now as far as jumping goes so that could up the ante somewhat. In the old days the ladies were not expected to do more than a double or combination. They were marked more on their poise and presentation than anything and of course figures played a big factor. Now we see the ladies going for the quad, not to mention the triple axel.

I think things are becoming more equal now with the new marking system and the ladies are getting tougher. So "fasten your seatbelts" we could be in for quite an exciting ride from both disciplines!!!

antmanb · May 24, 2006

Joesitz said:
This is not a prediction thread. It is about which division will be more exciting this coming season.
.
Are Gedevenashvili,Katie, Emily on equal footing with Oda, Sandhu and Weir as people you expect to be on the podium? All the boys are. That is my point.

Given all the nine boys mentioned skate their best, it will be an exciting event. I see only 4 ladies to make it interesting. It will be somewhat less exciting. JMO

Joe

I would agree with you up to a certain point Joe (in that i think the mens has the potential to be more exciting, but i'm personally more excited about seeing ladies i've not seen skate before like Kim, Asada, Taylor etc) but i don't think Sandhu or Weir are any more dead certs for the podium than e.g. Gedevanishvili. Sandhu is a notorious headcase who hasn't in ...what...8 seasons ever managed to land on the podium at worlds. Weir hasn't managed it at two (or is it three) worlds and an Olympics, and Oda personally, i don't get the hype. He looks like a junior skater and doesn't have the big jump elements.

None of these skaters are going to be slacking off in the summer but i think Sandhu we can write off already.

If a large number of skaters all skate their best then it would be a good competition rewgardless of whether its the ladies or the mens. At the end of the day its personal preference - do you prefer the mens or the ladies?

Ant

Mathman · May 24, 2006

inloveagain said:
Talking of data, thanks to the COP, we can use previous scores as guidelines for future projection.'...

Thanks for taking the trouble to compile these statistics, especially the averages. :rock:

Meissner's inconsistency really stands out, with a personal best 24 points ahead of her average based on her one great performance at Worlds. (Even that was probably overmarked in the PCS.)

Rochette is the most consistent. But that means consistently 12 points below Mao.

Mao set an even higher personal best (LP only) at the Japan cheesefest. Although the judging may be more generous at affairs like that, still, as long as Mao has that no-fooling triple Axel, the other ladies are going to have to scramble to put together enough points on the tech side to challenge her.

MM

Linny · May 24, 2006

How about some of the skaters at regionals?

At the regionals, there are always skaters who are just one below the top tier this year who are going home with determination in their gut. They are probably working like crazy to improve and make it to nationals next year. Anyone see any that seen to have the elusive "it" factor?

I liked Jane Buguva at Eastern Regionals.

Linny

Joesitz (RIP) · May 24, 2006

hockeyfan228 said:
It doesn't matter to me if every Ladies' competition next year is decided by .2 and the winners keep changing. The only current (based on 2005-6) top Ladies whose skating interests me (so far) are Kim -- I'm interested to see how she develops -- and Rochette. (And Cohen, if she returns.) I'm more interested to see if Ando, Kostner, Volchkova, and Sebestyen can get back their form, if Meier can continue to improve at the same rate she did over the past season, and if Poykio can take the next step. I'd rather watch Yan Liu, Tugba Karademir, Kiira Korpi, and Arina Martinova than any of the other top ladies.

But the men: bring on Lambiel, Joubert, Weir, Buttle, Sandhu, Oda, Takahashi, and Li anytime. (I'm not familiar with Preaubert.) The only one among the top men I don't really like is Lysacek, which is too bad, because he has so much potential, although I have to admire his grit and competitive spine.

I respect your interest in certain skaters (there are skaters, I too, am interesred in and not necessarily seniors) but for me, I spend a lot of money to see competitive skating and the more competitive it is the more I enjoy it - even those I don't particularly like.

Certainly, Volchkova is an excellent skater as is Susanna, Carolina, Miki, etc. but the four I mentioned are, imo, the most daring skaters in the mix to give me a hankering to see them contest for the podium. Of course, there could be a skater come out of no where and win. I was in Calgary and saw that happen.

But this is not about a winner. It's about the field of Ladies. Can they give me a good contest?

Joe

antmanb · May 24, 2006

Joesitz said:
But this is not about a winner. It's about the field of Ladies. Can they give me a good contest?

Joe

Yes - if enough of them skate clean.

But that question and answer applies to all the disciplines.

Ant

Lonewolf · May 24, 2006

Of the two disciplines, I feel that the Ladies will be more interesting. This is because with the Ladies, you are having a change over from the old to the new. It will be interesting to see who steps up a notch and who does not. It will be interesting to watch and see how it all plays out. Then when you add in Sasha, Michelle, and Irina to the mix, will they skate or retire. If they skate, how many events will they skate, and so on all this adds to the excitement making the Ladies discipline more exciting, IMO.

anything_for_skating · May 24, 2006

Who Else?

Of those who you all did see:
Carolina Kostner
Arina Martionva
Kiira Korpi
Laura Lepisto

Joesitz (RIP) · May 24, 2006

antmanb said:
Yes - if enough of them skate clean.

But that question and answer applies to all the disciplines.

Ant

Indeed, but the Ladies in the Olys, except for one did not skate clean. Why?

Joe

Yu Na, Mao, Kimmie and who else?

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