ISU Grand Prix Assignments 2006-2007

Alsace said:

Emily wouldn't look ungainly in appearance if she had great dance skills. There's just something about the dancer's posture and movement that drops ten or more pounds from a figure. Plus, I've only seen her on TV, which is supposed to add ten pounds or more to any frame.

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I think Waxel put it very PC, nicely said and not offensive at all. Its the people who use smartallic slang comments that are "out of line IMO.

I also believe Alsace to be totally true as well. Dancers GENERALLY don't have that kind of figure - just appears different. Even though she really has a nice figure for a teenager or anyone, it dose seem a little uncommon here. Sara was the same way. IMO, beautiful figure that just isn't that common in FS or Dance. But It could also "hurt" and cause issues particularly on ice.

Sarah was extremely skinny when she won her OGM at 16. But after the Olympics, she stopped training heavily and had to have gained at least 20 lbs by the time Worlds 2003 came around, and she was no longer able to do her 3/3s.

Both Sarah and Emily, who are about 5'6", seem to take after their father, who is tall and on the portly side. Their mother is petite and very slim.

chuckm said:

Sarah was extremely skinny when she won her OGM at 16. But after the Olympics, she stopped training heavily and had to have gained at least 20 lbs by the time Worlds 2003 came around, and she was no longer able to do her 3/3s.

Both Sarah and Emily, who are about 5'6", seem to take after their father, who is tall and on the portly side. Their mother is petite and very slim.

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Thank you for clarifying that, I really didn't even remember that she was skinnier until you said that. I wouldn't go as far to say extremely skinny after watching a couple of vids, but I do think that she personally looked better with a little more weight, but I definitely believe that did affect her skating - as you point out.

Plus 20 pounds is a fairly big jump in that period of time. I think most wpmen can fluctuate 10lb and it is fine IMPO. But it still depends on the woman on what weight looks best. The last I saw of Sarah (thanks for getting the spelling, for me I always left that off) and Emmie they looked great as "goodlooking goes" but if the same issues affected Sarah then it is likely for Emily as well.

I bet it was those darn Sarah Gold rolls she was getting at the Sushi restaurant - if they are what I think, which is also a favorite of mine - they are fattening.

?????Now what is affected the most regarding such. Is it the hight or the center of gravity. I am sure it is a little of both but wonder which would be most effected. My guess would be COG because the strength should be compensating as it comes on. But this is only a guess.

Sarah grew a couple of inches and "filled out", as they say, between the 2002 Olympics and 2003 Worlds. Sarah was pretty flat-chested at 16 but "bloomed" at 17. Emily is a "normal girl" size that for a figure skater is on the large side, but she is still not quite "filled out".

When girls start to "bloom", it shifts the center of gravity, for sure.

Joesitz said:

Who are Platanova/Maksmishin?

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Platonova/Maksimishin were 5th in dance at 2006 Junior Worlds and 6th in 2005.
Slightly better junior record than Pratt/Gilles. Who are they, again?

Mukhortova/Trankov?

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2005 junior world pair champions, 12th at 2006 senior Worlds.

Makova/Tokarev?

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Simakova/Tokarev. Winners of last year's JGP final, ahead of Vlassov/Meekins etc. I don't know why they weren't at Jr. Worlds.

The men's event at Eric Bompard is going to be great! Presumably Joubert and Buttle will fight it out for the trophy, but it also has Preaubert and Contesi from France (a fierce intenecine rivalry), Chiper, Klimkin and Graziev. plus Shawn Sawyer and Patrick Chan

Also world junior champion Kozuka (choreography by Yuks Sato )

chuckm said:

When girls start to "bloom", it shifts the center of gravity, for sure.

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When Michelle got to that age, she said the media made her feel so self conscious.

As she said to Christine Brennan in an interview, "What did they think I was going to do, topple over?"

I see that Skate Canada did not choose Emanuel Sandhu. They went with Sawyer and Marc-Andre Craig instead. Is there a story there? Do they think maybe Sandhu will withdraw? (He has two other events.)

I am going to miss the "old regulars" from the circuit, but I am really excited to see lots of new faces this season!

Thanks gkelly, for the info. I don't follow juniors as much as I would like to. I do see the Americans at their Nationals.


Mathman - Intersting race at EB with Joubert v. Buttle, Chiper,Klimkin, Griazev. (Joubert but Paris has never seen him at his best) I like Ponsero better than Contesti but he'll be at Canada and China.

And don't forget the hot competition in Japan with Stephane v. v.d.Perren, Chenjian Li, Oda and Takahashi - all with easy Quads!

Hot Ladies' competitions: Skate America: Mao v. the 3 American beauties. Skate Canada: Rochette v. Leung; Poykio; Onda; Suguri, Kim and Taylor!!! Eric Bombard: Carolina v. Rochette, Poykio, Ando, Kim, Meissner and Zukowski. NHK: looks like a Japanese sweeep. Poor Bebe - maybe she'll surprise them.

Joe

Mathman said:

I see that Skate Canada did not choose Emanuel Sandhu. They went with Sawyer and Marc-Andre Craig instead. Is there a story there? Do they think maybe Sandhu will withdraw? (He has two other events.)

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Not really. This year, both Sandhu and Buttle were seeded (Sandhu #5, Buttle #6). If SC picked both of them, they couldn't participate in the draw for the top seeds. You might have thought that they would have gone with Sandhu, as the defending champion, but after all Buttle was the Olympic medalwinner, so they picked him as one of the 3 Men host picks.

Woo-Hoo!!!

I think I summed up my reaction to the GP assignments quite well in my post on AS -
http://absoluteskating.proboards37.com/index.cgi?board=Stphane&action=display&thread=1151299392&page=1#1151379597

All I have to add is - TUGBA! TUGBA! TUGBA! TUGBA!

chuckm said:

The rules are more flexible for the host countries, it seems. According to the rules, after each federation picks its own skaters, the seeds are selected. Then after the top 12 at Worlds have received 2 assignments, those who finished 13th-24th are assigned IN ORDER of their finish. So we had:

13 Mira LEUNG (CAN) - got two events (one from SC)
14 Elene GEDEVANISHVILI - got two events (note: she was also #20 on the Seasons Best list)
15 Idora HEGEL - got two events
16 Yan LIU - got two events (one from CoC)
17 Amanda NYLANDER - got one event
18 Tugba KARADEMIR - got one event
19 Arina MARTINOVA - got two events (one from CoR).

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Except the rules for 2005-6 aren't based on Worlds, unless the skater places 1-12 at Worlds.

The rules are:

1-12 at Worlds: guaranteed two events. Mao Asada replaces Cohen, because no one in the top 6 at Olympics who didn't skate at Worlds (Slutskaya, Arakawa) is coming back, and Asada had a PB higher than anyone at Worlds except Meissner.

Anyone not included above who was top 24 in ISU Worlds rankings (and not retired/non-competing) is guaranteed one event: Ando (6), Kim (10), Czisny (15), Sawada (16), Liu (17), Sebestyen (18), Leung (21), Gedevanishvili (24).

Anyone not included above with a top 24 Personal Best is guaranteed one event: Taylor (15), Liang (18), Hawker (24).

Anyone not included above who is skating seniors this season and who medalled at Jr. Worlds or JGPF is guaranteed one event: Xu (bronze JGPF), Zukowski (bronze, Jr. Worlds).

Each one was given two spots.

Discretionary: anyone not included above who was top 25 in ISU World rankings:

Got none:
Kitamura (27*), Takeda (30*), Efremenko (35), Lepisto (42*), Choi (45*), Kropotkina (47*), Lacoste (49*), Pfaneuf (50), Glebova (53*), McCorkell (54), Cantu (58*) Shin (59*), Vahamaa (60*), Hou (61*), Hyatt (63*), Kahle (65*), Gerboldt (66*), Timoshenko (69), Isabelle Nylander (70*), Suizi (71-no bio link), Cannarozzo (73-no bio link), Marchei (74), Radeva (75)

*Eligible for Juniors

Dytrt (skating pairs), Manzano (retired), Corwin (retired), Drei (retired), Kwan (not skating), Kettunen (retired), Kirk (retired), Maxwell (not skating singles), Nikodinov (not skating).

Got 1:
Mai Asada (29), Carter (37), Chae-Hwa Kim (39), Pavuk (41), Nylander (51), Karademir (56), Gimatzetdinova (64), Paulinius (68), Nylander (70), Bobillier (72)

Got 2:
Duhamel (33), Volchkova (38), Hegel (43), Fang (46), Martinova (48),

Not ranked in top 75, assigned: Luca, Calvez, Lacour.

My questions are: Why did Duhamel and Volchkova get two when better-ranked Mai Asada and Carter got one? Why did Duhamel, Volchkova, Hegel, Fang, or Martinova get two when Efremenko, Pfaneuf, McCorkell, Timoshenko, Marchei, and Radeva got none? (Could be that Efremenko, Timoshenko, Marchei, and/or Radeva are no longer skating or opted out of GP; I don't know their statuses.)

chuckm said:

The problem is that skaters from host countries can be assigned an event as a host skater, while non-host skaters do not start out with this advantage.

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Two skaters without top 75 ranking were assigned to the host nations' discretionary spots: Calvez and Lacour. A third, Roxanna Luca, ranked 96th, was also selected by China.

Oddly, China got three of the top 12 skaters and the US got five.

chuckm said:

The rule should be administered in such a way that if a skater has been selected as a host skater, then that should be counted as the first go-round, like Amanda's and Tugba's first assignment. SECOND assignments should be subject to the same set of rules as the first, and be assigned IN ORDER OF PLACEMENT at Worlds.

Under that scenario, Nylander would receive a 2nd event, not Martinova.

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The ISU obviously doesn't agree, because the selection system they put in place gives precedence to higher-ranked skaters and skaters with higher-ranked personal bests from the strongest nations -- most often the host nations, but not always -- who have more overall depth in their programs, as well as the three completely discretionary picks for the host nations, since they're paying for it, and have to draw the local crowds. Martinova is higher-ranked than Nylander, despite their relative placement at Worlds.

hockeyfan228 said:

The ISU obviously doesn't agree, because the selection system they put in place gives precedence to higher-ranked skaters and skaters with higher-ranked personal bests from the strongest nations -- most often the host nations, but not always -- who have more overall depth in their programs, as well as the three completely discretionary picks for the host nations, since they're paying for it, and have to draw the local crowds. Martinova is higher-ranked than Nylander, despite their relative placement at Worlds.

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more overall depth in their skating?? Is this not a value judgement? Who decides this if the competitons do not?

So money does talk for this GP series. and the 'poorer' nations are there to fill in for the 'show'. am I correct?

Joesitz said:

So money does talk for this GP series. and the 'poorer' nations are there to fill in for the 'show'. am I correct?

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I don't know why we should be surprised at this. The Grand Prix grew out of a collection of unrelated individual events (like Skate America) which invited whoever they wanted, with an eye on the box office.

At least they don't allow a third (non-scoring) event any more. That rule was strictly to ensure that every event had at least a couple of top international draws, like Slutskaya and Plushenko.

Anyway, I think the point of Hockeyfan's post is that the selection procedure is based on broader criteria than just placement at worlds, for skaters that did not finish in the top 12.

Hmm. More fuel to the fire that USFS is favoring Lysacek over Weir?

USFS selected Lysacek for it's showcase event, Skate America, but not U.S. Champion Weir.

Not only that, but Evan is virtually guaranteed a spot in the GP finals because he is skating against relatively weak fields in both of his events. At Skate America his only competition is Oda (unless Sandhu or Lindemann surprise us), and in Cup of China his biggest rivals are Sandhu and Li.

Meanwhile Johnny must face Lambiel, Buttle, Takahashi and Oda at Skate Canada (he could finish off the podium), and Joubert (along with Sandhu) in France.

Mathman said:

Not only that, but Evan is virtually guaranteed a spot in the GP finals because he is skating against relatively weak fields in both of his events. At Skate America his only competition is Oda (unless Sandhu or Lindemann surprise us),

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Sandhu beating Lysacek at Skate America would be a big surprise, since he isn't scheduled to compete there.

(You mentioned Sandhu at three different events, so I went to check which one was wrong.)

Which only strengthens your point that Lysacek is highly likely to medal and fairly likely to win at SA.

Oh. I meant van der Perren.

About the money angle, I can just see the COE of United States Figure Skating sitting down with the PR and advertising folks at H J Heinz (makers of Smart Ones diet foods) to go over their plans for Smart Ones Skate America.

Heinz: OK, we've budgeted10 million dollars for our Skate America advertising budget this year. When will Michelle Kwan be available?

USFS: Um, Michelle can't skate this year, she's injured.

Heinz: OK, we've got 5 million dollars. What about the other girl?

USFS: Sasha? Um, she's a little worn out, too, and is taking some time off.

Wait, wait, don't go! Have we got a girl for you! Kimmie Meissner, world champion in her first try, wave of the future, sweet kid. We've got 5000 "Gimme Kimmie" banners already made up.

Heinz: Is she skinny? This is Weight Watchers Smart Ones, you know.

USFS: Slim as a rail! Plus, we've got a boy, too!

Heinz: Wait a minute. Not that Russia-lovin', powershoppin'...

USFS: No, no. Evan Lysacek. Dated Jenny Kirk AND Tanith Belbin!

Heinz: Are they skinny?

MM

PS. Maybe they would like Johnny after all. The original H J Heinz chose the number "57" for his slogan "57 varieties" for occult reasons. It had nothing to do with the number of products that his company actually made.

The widow of Heinz' great-grandson married Senator John Kerry and invested a certain amount of the family fortune in his campaign for president. That's a lot of pickles.

chuckm said:

Hmmm. I'm not sure what is so especially entertaining about the Canadian Ice Dance roster. You have four teams just moving up from Juniors (Mikhailova/Sergeev, Platonova/Maksimishin, Davis/White, Pratt/Gilles), a Senior team that's been in existence only for one year, with only one "B" International to their credit (Navarro/Bommentre), a third Russian team that has performed poorly in the past year (Romanovskaya/Grachev) and a Chinese team that finished 7th at 4CC. None of these teams are in any way, shape or form competitive with Dubreuil/Lauzon, Drobiazko/Vanagas or even Faiella/Scali. IMHO, they seem to be "filler" teams to ensure a high placement for the new GP team of Virtue/Moir.

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You're kidding, right? This is an amazing field with the top five free-dancers from junior worlds last year (Pratt/Gilles finished 6th overall, but they were 5th in the FD). It's probably the first chance to get a look at what the ice dance field is going to be looking like in the future, and I'm really curious to see if they can knock off any of those older teams.

Of course if the ISU junior age rules change, I wouldn't put it past the UFSA and the Russian Federation to yank all those teams back to junior, so I'm not holding my breath that this field will stay the same.