AMERICAN IDOL - FINALS

AMERICAN IDOL - FINALS

<span style="color:blue;font-family:comic sans ms;font-size:small;">As a change of pace, WITHOUT PEEKING, which one of our beloved GoldenSkate posters posted this WAY at the beginning of the season?</span>

<span style="color:red;font-family:comic sans ms;font-size:small;"><em>"So far I'm putting my money on the dweeby redheaded guy in the funny clothes who looked liked Howdy Doody with a bad haircut. But he could actually sing."</em></span>

Re: AMERICAN IDOL - FINALS

Wow, RGal, we must have punched in our respective threads at the same time........as to your question, I haven't a clue...........maybe Idel? 42

american idol

Just started reading this thread in the past month .... (I didn't get hooked til 5 weeks ago) ... but my money has to go on one of 2 people for that comment.

Dweeby redhead/howdy doody has to be either fetal or mathman. Can't decide which so I am gonna guess both!

Canuck

Re: american idol

that really sounds like and "Rgirlsim" to me...

Re: american idol

Thanks for the vote, Sk8m8, but it sounds more like an R<strong>gal</strong>ism to me. Although I also have a vague memory of Mathman saying something about loving the "geeky guy who looks like Howdy Doody." Actually, I'm leaning toward Mathman based on a factor that I won't mention

I can't even remember who I picked at the beginning, except I know I liked Frenchie, but all I got to hear her sing was "Band of Gold." It was interesting to see in the retrospective that it was Kim Locke and Ruben who beat Clay in Group Two. I'd have to check the old threads to see what I thought of the rest.

I'm so glad they didn't write an AI song for side-by-side comparison. I thought "A Moment Like This," the one they used last year, wasn't much of a song. I preferred this format of picking three different songs in similar styles.

As for tonight's show, here's how Rgirl called it:
<strong>Ruben "A House is Not a Home":</strong> Ruben's still not my choice for AI, but his performance of this song in particular made me see why people love him so much. I still think he sings from too high in his chest, so he doesn't get those big power notes. Also, when they showed the audition clip, I noticed he had that rasp in voice back then. He is really velvety in the bass notes, but I just can't get into his voice when he's in the upper registers. I agree with Simon that Ruben has been better.
<strong>Clay "This is the Night"</strong> Definitely more Michael Crawford than Michael Bolton. Clay needs some edge to be a pop star. But I think he can get it. After all, look how he transformed himself from Howdy Doody into a hottie singer with girls screaming for him. His voice gave out near the end of the song on the last high <em>ENDS</em> in <em>"ends of the earth..."</em> Simon again is absolutely right about how handsome Clay has become.
<strong>Ruben "Imagine":</strong> Again, I can see how Ruben gets to people; he just doesn't get to me, although I definitely like the guy and have no doubt he should be either the winner or runner-up. In "Imagine" I think he sang around the notes too much (is there a technical term for that?) and I didn't like the octave jump he did at the end. I thought it sounded forced. Some of my favorite songs are covers of Lennon, McCartney, and/or George Harrison songs, ie I love Fiona Apple's cover of "Across the Universe." But this was one of my favorite Ruben performances.
<strong>Clay "Here, There and Everywhere":</strong> First time I heard some strain in Clay's voice. He outright blew the last <em>always</em>. This time I thought Clay played around with the notes too much. I disagree with Randy that it was a safe choice. Vocally, it's a very difficult song with a big range and big jumps from one note to another. That's where I felt the strain, when Clay was going from the low to high notes. Didn't get much feeling from him either.
<strong>Ruben "Flying Without Wings":</strong> This is the kind of song I hate, but if it's the kind of song you like, I think Ruben did a great job, except he missed one or two notes--but both guys did throughout the evening. A little much for Paula to call it a "religious experience." My favorite part though was the look on Simon's face when Paula grabbed his hand and made him wave along with the rest of the audiences. Yeah, Simon really loved that:lol: But he's a man after my own heart:evil:
<strong>Clay "Bridge Over Troubled Water":</strong> Didn't like the arrangement. Too upbeat and too much the same all the way through. In fact, very karaoke except for the kicka** note at the end, which was a great note on which to end the competition. But I guess they had to put those gospel singers to use There was something off about the way Clay sang the word "water." The "er" sounded odd, too nasal, or off-key, or something. I found it distracting. Unfortunately, I think this song, by comparison to Art Garfunkel, really showed Clay's weakness, which is conveying feeling. Both Clay and Ruben have a problem with it, as did all the contestants, and by feeling I don't mean being emotional. I'm talking about conveying the spirit of the song. You can be very inwardly focused, soft, and "unemotional" and still convey the meaning of the song to the point of bringing people to tears. PBS reran Simon and Garfunkel's Concert in Central Park about six months ago and Art Garfunkel singing "Bridge" really was something akin to a religious experience. He was like a great sculptor working a piece of clay--no pun intended. Clay doesn't have that yet, but he's got the materials.

<strong>General Thoughts:</strong> I think either Clay or Ruben, but especially Clay could be a true vocal artist if he finds the right person to work with and learns how to mold the very depths of his soul into a song and make each song a small work of art. Diana Ross needed Berry Gordy. The Beatles needed George Martin. Either Clay or Ruben is going to get Simon as a producer, which might have something to do with something I heard Kim Locke say. In an interview last week she said she thinks Simon wants Ruben to win because he knows how to market Ruben and doesn't know how to market Clay. I thought that was interesting. I thought Ruben looked better than Clay tonight. Ruben dressed very well and looked very professional. I realize Clay's untucked, long-tailed shirt thing is supposed to be his "look," and sometimes it's fine. But tonight I wish he would have done three different outfits--and not just three different untucked shirts. He's come a LOOOONG way looks-wise, but he could look really good. Being so thin, he can do a lot with that coat-hanger body and he's not using it. So, despite my concern about Ruben's weight (and it is only a health concern; I love the way he looks), I think Ruben won in the looks department tonight.

The video I voted for was "Ride With Me"--pimp Ruben and geeky Clay.

I got through once and voted for Clay. Even with his weak night (and I do think Clay was off tonight), he still gets my vote. I liked Ruben tonight the best of all the times he's sung. But I guess I just don't get what Ruben's got. Whoever wins, I think they will both do well in the singing biz.
Rgirl

Edited to fix some of the ezcodes for bold and italics and my misspelling of "karaoke."

Re: AMERICAN IDOL - FINALS

Okay, now I peeked at what we said on the first AI thread, but I won't give anything away re Rgal's question except to say that aside from the person Rgal is referring to, there is another person who said, "I liked the geeky Howdy Doody guy."

Guess who Rgirl found out Rgirl liked best besides Frenchie? Check out part of my first post on the subject:
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Anyway, as of tonight, my first favorite is Frenchy, the zahftig black woman with thumbnail length hair that changes color with every audition and the great big voice. My other favorites are her male counterpart, the great big black guy with the great voice <em>[ie, Ruben, lol!]</em>, and the 22-yr-old guy they told at his first audition looked too old ("Hercules! Hercules! Hercules!) <em>[ie, Ricky]</em>.

I also like this developing soap opera: I can only remember one of their names, Julie or Julia, I think, the one whose group-mates stood her up for the rehearsal and now there's a big rivalry between her and the beautiful blonde <em>[ie, Kim Caldwell]</em>. Julia is nicer but the blonde may have a better voice.[/quote]

So I started out a Ruben fan and forget I was one:lol:

Here's part of what Rgal had to say after the first show:
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Rgal--&nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp Re: American Idol Time
Okay, it's over, and per request of my Twinnie, I will give my objective, voice teacher's opinion. Based on what I saw tonight, none of these people exhibited "star" power. Way too much use of the hands (my policy is: If a gesture doesn't mean anything, don't do it. Don't use your hands and force us to look at them for no reason.) Also, don't point at yourself when you sing "me" or "I" and don't point at body parts (we already know where your head is, your eyes are, etc.).....

If people would just THINK about the words they are singing and the emotion BEHIND those words, their performances would improve significantly. (Actually, this was something Charles did well.) Take Julia, for instance. Did you for one second believe she knew what the hell she was singing about? Were you able to see what was so intense about this "son of a preacher man" that he "moved" her? The answer is NO, because she herself was not seeing him. If SHE doesn't see him in her mind's eye, her audience will never see him. She has to get beyond the "I'm performing" and into the "I want to communicate" realm.

I know this is a long post but these things formed the foundation of everything I taught singers over the years, and they are very important aspects of what makes a long lasting star. A communicator (think Bette Midler) will last longer than a technically good singer with little communication skills. Of course it's great when both are there! [/quote] I chose these quotes because I noticed a couple of things. Of the final four performers, virtually no one pointed or hardly ever pointed and tonight, neither Ruben or Clay pointed at all. And even though I still think they need work in terms of communicating, they are SO much better than when they started out. Rgal, that's the gig you need to get: Vocal coach on American Idol. I bet the pay ain't bad and it's only three months work.
Rgirl

Re: AMERICAN IDOL - FINALS

<span style="color:red;font-family:comic sans ms;font-size:x-large;">Hire me! Hire me! I'll take it! I'll take it!</span> :rollin: :lol:

Hey, did ya think I had no opinion?????

:rollin:

First off, I thought Clay and Ruben were horrible in their first two songs. And to take 2 of my favorite Lennon-Mccarthy songs...well, just never mind about how I feel about that!!!!!

Secondly, the choir sure did mask some off notes on the part of BOTH singers. And Simon can take his zippity doo-dah attitude out the back door! Just because someone can hit an exceptional ending note did NOT make that whole "Bridge..." song a winning number.:evil:

And the devil comes out to play today.....:rollin:

I mean, what does it really matter who wins? Both will have recording contracts, either with Simon or Clay with Simon and Ruben with Babyface (yes, Babyface hopes Ruben doesn't win so he can sign him).

So, I ask.....what does it matter? Oh, I voted for Ruben once and that was in the last 5 minutes because I could NOT get through for 2 hours and 55 minutes.

Hey rgirl, wazzup?

Clay all the way!!

Hi everyone. Reuben was fine last night, and I really like him, but I LOVE Clay. I agree with Rgirl who disagreed with Randy saying that Here There and Everywhere was a "safe" choice. Not! The notes jump all over the place, and I also agree that for the first time I heard something a little off in Clay's performance. Notwithstanding that, however, I was thrilled with his last song. Once I heard what song it was going to be, I thought "All right!" because it's a great choice for him. I disliked that upbeat arrangement too, Rgirl, but Clay sings so well, that I ended up not minding at all. His voice is so soothing, it reminds me of Bing Crosby's -- he could sing the phone book and I'd like it! I was so happy at the end, I was really choked up. I hope he wins, but it won't be awful for either of them no matter who wins, since they're already so famous and no doubt both will get contracts. I voted only once for Clay. It was the hardest to get through last night. I couldn't stay up that late to keep trying -- sorry Clay!

goveggie

AI FINAL

I was kinda disappointed in last night's performances - they had better songs to sing than Justin and Kelly did last time, but overall it was a slight letdown. And why not admit that they're nervous? Clay looked like he was going to faint when he stepped out on that stage with the capacity crowd (altho he frequently looks like that, it's part of why we <em>luurve </em>him! )

<strong>Round 1

Ruben:</strong> Sorry, could not help but compare this to Tamyra's rendition, which did Ruben no favors. In general I thought it was a good 'Ruben' performance, but I noticed that his breath and timing were really weird, and he hit a real clunker note on the "end in teeeears" line. Ouch!
<strong>Clay:</strong> Ryan said this was an 'original composition', which I took to mean that it had never been released and no one would know the song. Is this true? If so, I thought it was a risky move that paid off - this song sounded like a hit on the radio, and like it was made for Clay (as opposed to those songs that did NOT sound like they were made for Kelly and Justin last time, but pumped out of a meat grinder) I love when Clay uses his lower register. This was his best performance of the evening IMHO.

<strong>Round 2

Ruben:</strong> Quite simply, Ruben kicked a** with this song. At first I thought the live musicians were a little twee, but this was simply the best performance I have seen from Ruben. Finally, he did something really outside his usual sound. I loved it. If this were the only song of the night, I would put Ruben as the winner.

<strong>Clay:</strong> Well, right off the bat Clay was in trouble, picking a McCartney song vs. Ruben's Lennon song :lol: But really, I started thinking maybe the producers really DID want to influence the votes with the awful, awful lighting. There's no excuse for that big of a production gaffe. Back to Clay - this was the worst he's performed in the whole competition. His falsetto was insecure throughout the song, it felt really trentative from start to finish. Still better than most of the other competitors, but what a time to have your first real clunker!

<strong>Round 3

Ruben:</strong> This song was <strong><em>horrible</em></strong>! Whoever wrote this should be banned from making or even listening to music ever again. But performance-wise, this was just like "Smile" for me - Ruben looked uncomfortable, had some pitch problems, the vocal gymnastics seemed really labored -- the man was just not having a good time out there. But halfway through, something changed. The choir came out, and Ruben was suddenly enjoying himself, and I stopped listening to the stupid words and got really caught up in his performance. Very strong ending. (But I wouldn't go so far as to say it was his best, as Simon did).

<strong>Clay:</strong> I was sooo excited when I heard Clay would sing "Bridge...". I was envisioning a quiet, acoustic (maybe even a capella!) version, and thought this would be a fantastic song for Clay's voice....and what did they give us? Heavy orchestration where the choir starts singing the song for him! Ugh. This arrangement was so wrong. I have never subscribed to the whole 'musical theatre' rap that Clay's been given, but this was a really Broadway version of the song, and Clay even stepped up the facial tics. I do think Clay sang well, and that last note was killer, but this was extremely disappointing.

Each of them had one good performance of the night - Ruben's was even stellar. But this competition is so close that I went with their overall performances throughout the competition and voted for Clay - although I could only get 4 votes in during the 1st hour, and couldn't really get through repeatedly until 11:45. Wow it's going to be close!!!

guinevere

Re: Hey, did ya think I had no opinion?????

Hey realistic, wazzup? Did we agree on something? Did I miss it?:lol: I know we agree on this: That if Ruben doesn't win he will get a contract with Babyface (I heard that too). I also think Clay will get a contract if he doesn't win, just not with Babyface. I also totally agree that one good ending note does not a "winning performance" of "Bridge" or any other song make. But who knows "wazzup" with Simon, anyway.

Guinevere,
Great review. You reminded me of Tamyra Gray's performance of "House is Not a Home" and boy, are you right. She blew the roof off the place when she sang that. People have been saying how much better the overall quality of the singers are this year and if you take the group as a whole, I agree. There were some real clunkers last year. But in terms of the top two, which last year SHOULD have been Kelly and Tamyra, I don't think Clay and Ruben are as good. I think Kelly and Tamyra sang like seasoned professionals from about the third week on, except for Tamyra's clunker "Runnin' Hot, Runnin' Cold." Those women had great range, control, the ability to sing a variety of styles, and could really communicate the heart of a song. (What was with Paula Abdul and the "matrix" of a song? Puh-lease.) I think that overall Kelly and Tamyra were stronger than Clay and Ruben, but that this year's entire group was better than last year's.

ITA with what you said about "Bridge." Even more than Broadway, it sounded like a Branson, Missouri version. And wow, you got through four times in the first hour and then "repeatedly" at 11:45pm? You must have killer repeat speed dial:lol:

BTW, I love the word "twee." I rarely hear or use it, but seeing it reminded me how much I like it.

Bottom line, these guys both have it made. Now they just need the cooperation of the singing gods. They've the AI tour coming up and I have no doubt that whoever wins, they will both get contracts. After that, it's a matter of getting the right producer and some top vocal training.

Rgal, believe me, if it was up to me I'd have you as the vocal coach on AI in a heartbeat. But I was at least glad to see that whoever the vocal coach is, s/he is giving these singers at least some Rgal advice.

So tonight be ready for almost two hours of AI group singing and reminiscing before we hear who won.
Rgirl

Re: Hey, did ya think I had no opinion?????

Clay was amazing... started his first one timidly... but went right into it... and never looked back... Ruben was awfully gratey last night

all and all I think Clay should win... if he doesn't... well... Ruben's done well too...

Re: Hey, did ya think I had no opinion?????

Last night was a tough one to call. Ruben and Clay were definitely the best this year. And I agree with Rgirl that Kelly and Tamayra are better than these 2, but this year's group as a whole is better.

BTW, I'm watching the final final show right now. Entertaining, but TONS of fluff and promos during the 1st 45 minutes.

Re: Hey, did ya think I had no opinion?????

<em><span style="color:teal;font-family:comic sans ms;font-size:small;">"So far I'm putting my money on the dweeby redheaded guy in the funny clothes who looked liked Howdy Doody with a bad haircut. But he could actually sing."</span></em>

<span style="color:navy;font-family:comic sans ms;font-size:small;">For those of you who guessed that these words belonged to our very own MATHMAN, you were RIGHT!</span> :lol:

One for mathman

I did a little calculation...

Out of Approximately 25 million votes cast for the final round, Clay lost to Rueben by appox 135,000. In raw data tems that means there was around 0.00054 % difference between the two. Good luck to both these IMMENSElY talented young men.

Re: One for mathman

it's just not fair Clay was so consistant

however in the long run he really doesn't "belong" to RCA for too much longer... whereas Ruben has a full year at least... Clay can go back in the fall and finish college or continue his music career... in the long run Kelly was worn out before recording her album even started and set her back a ways... whereas Justin is right on track... Ruben is showing signs that he's straining his voice as well... it's not a good sign for him... but a great one for Clay...

Clay was such a gentleman in defeat... I love him...

Re: One for mathman

Hi sk8m8. Well, there's still a tiny little question about that pesky decimal point. It's 0.54% (about half of one per cent of the vote).:lol:

RealtorGal -- Would I say such an uncharitable thing? But I have to agree with Simon. Look how handsome they turned Clay out once they got him to Hollywood.

Actually, Howdy Doody was my favorite television star. After Buffalo Bob died there was a big custody battle over Howdy. The Detroit Museum of Art got him.

Clay sang his heart out in this competion. (Or as Randy said, he sang his face off. Or as Paula said, he got down into the matrix of the song.) He deserved to win. So did Ruben. It was a great competition.

Mathman

Re: One for mathman

I just heard some interesting gossip on TV. An interview with Randy and Simon where Simon revealed that Clay saw the results card 5 minutes before the rest of us knew. I did knida think that his reaction was weird! Poor Clay. Release a nice, classy Frank Sintara or Josh Grobin type Cd, and I'll be buying it!!!

Re: One for mathman

there's also rumor that it was rigged... that Ruben would have won no matter what

hope that's not true... it'd be bigger than the olympics scandal

Re: One for mathman

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>"So far I'm putting my money on the dweeby redheaded guy in the funny clothes who looked liked Howdy Doody with a bad haircut. But he could actually sing."[/quote]
I thought Clay looked more like Dilly Dally than Howdy with just a touch of Alfalfa. If anyone knows who I am talking about you're showing your age just like me.:lol: :lol:

I would have been happy with either Clay or Ruben winning. I was really cheering for Ruben and thought Clay would win. I am really happy for Ruben.

Dee