Do you prefer Michelle Kwan before or after she left Frank+Lori?

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Taan

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Sep 27, 2003

• Oct 6, 2003

• #1

I love Michelle Kwan (who doesnt?) but I keep replaying and enjoying her performances from her frank+lori years circa 96-99 ....its not that I havent enjoyed her after she left her original "team" but I have to say those were clearly her best years/best programs and i just don't see her having that "magic" like back then.....but she is still awesome!

 

Last edited: Oct 7, 2003

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show 42

Arm Chair Skate Fan

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Jul 26, 2003

• Oct 7, 2003

• #2

Hi Taan, and welcome to GS. I too love the Michelle of old, but seeing her progression into a more mature skater is part of the total package that makes her so special..........42

 

Last edited: Oct 7, 2003

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ladybug

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• Oct 7, 2003

• #3

Welcome Taan. I also love Michelle but I see her much happier now since she left Frank and I think that shows in her skating. I think Frank/Lori made all the decisions - progrms, costumes, music etc. Once a person reaches the old age of 21, they want some input into what they do on the ice as well as off.

I think she made the right decision for her.

Ladybug

 

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Skate Sandee

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• Oct 7, 2003

• #4

I'm the opposite. Although I love her 96-00 period, I find that the only performances I've been playing over and over is her 2003 season. She was packaged well under Lori and Frank. But now I get more of sense of Michelle when I watch her skate now. I see her maturity as a woman, her love of the sport, her imperfections, etc.

I never thought I'd connect better with her skating than I did during her 96-00 period, but I do. Although Taj Mahal & Red Violin remain at the top of my list, my preference of MICHELLE herself is definitely her skating from this past year.

I agreed with Dick Button when he said she's risen to a whole other level - which I took to mean her skating mentality. It's refreshing to see her skate now. I have no anxiety, no pressing desire to see her win everything. I'm just in a place where I appreciate her contribution more than I did when she was under Frank and Lori. I just love to watch her skate now - win or lose.

 

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Pookie

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• Oct 7, 2003

• #5

I enjoyed Michelle in her Frank and Lori days very much. She had beautiful programs. But I, like the others have said, enjoy the skater she has become. She has matured and become an even more beautiful skater.

 

Joesitz (RIP)

Joined

Jul 11, 2003

• Oct 7, 2003

• #6

When mother kept bothering me with 'decision making' chores like Which do you like better vanilla or chocolate. I would answer whatever she wanted to hear but secretly, I liked them both.

I liked Michelle with Frank immensely but Tara came on the scene with the 3x3 loop and that bubbly little girl style. Tara began to snatch away a championship here and there, and unfortunately, Frank didn't seem to think it important that MK's technical level needed to be raised. Too bad for MK. However, she continued wowing me and so many others with that incredible flow over the ice with or without 3/3s, despite the Nagano loss of gold.

The break with Frank was healthy but much too impestuous. MK should have searched for a replacement sooner and I think she would have won the SLC gold. She was coming into her own self.

The move to Williams was perfect. Apparently, he knows her style and abilitites and she seems now to skate for herself as a champion whether win or lose. Michelle, imo, has earned the title of PRO in the sportsworld sense of the word. And indeed, she seems to be a happy mature lady.

After all that rambling, I would say I like her NOW and secretly I liked her THEN, too.

Joe

 

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blurrysarah

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Aug 21, 2003

• Oct 7, 2003

• #7

I enjoyed her programs last season, more so than previous years. She seemed really passionate and overjoyed to be skating them (well, from the worlds 03 I saw), she appeared very comfortable. Maybe it was to do with "the change".

 

Ptichka

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• Oct 7, 2003

• #8

I am not a Michelle fan at all. While I could always appreciate her incredible skill, her performances never really touched me. This changed for me with her 2003 Nationals skate. It really moved me! If this was just a start of the post-Lori&Frank Michelle (2002 season does not count) then I really look forward to seeing more.

 

Mathman

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Jun 21, 2003

• Oct 7, 2003

• #9

It is impossible for me to have an objective opinion about this, because Michelle Kwan and Lori Nichol are my two favorite people in skating. It broke my heart when they went their separate ways. What Lori did for Michelle's career, and vice versa, is inestimable.

But now, two years later, I am starting to get over it. They are both doing fine. Michelle's 2003 season comprised some of the finest skating I have ever seen.

Mathman

 

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eliza88

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• Oct 7, 2003

• #10

I remember when MK first came out and was this spindly little jumping bean. The announcers were ga-ga over her and I simply didn't see what all the fuss was about. Then WHAM, the transformation she had in '96 was nothing short of phenomenal. Michelle did great under Lori/Frank--an amazing competitive record. However, for me, nothing can rival her 2003 season. She skated for herself, from her heart, and she showed everything there was to love and enjoy about skating in her programs.

I enjoy rewatching all her programs, however, when I view them I am constantly saying to myself, "Oh I'd love to see her skate to this NOW!"

The only thing I don't like about her skating now is purely selfish--I don't know when I am going to see her skate! Sure, she likes to leave everything vague, take things day to day and see how she feels (sigh...). So I have "Campbell's" TV coverage inked into my calendar, but what next!!? (please oh please skate at Nats)

eliza88

 

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Sk8harvest

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Aug 16, 2003

• Oct 7, 2003

• #11

I loved what she did in the '96 - '99. I loved those Lori Nichols programs. But by 2001 I felt many aspects of her skating seemed stale. I kinda wish she had made the change to Scott Williams earlier than she did. I think last season was brilliant, I loved the energy and passion she showed in both programs at Nats and Worlds. I look forward to seeing what she will do with her new Tosca program and her short program, whatever it will be.

 

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BronzeisGolden

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• Oct 7, 2003

• #12

I'll have to agree with everything that Eliza88 said. Michelle was spectacular from 96-00, but by 2001 things just weren't jiving. Michelle seemed herself to be a bit discouraged and bored. She needed something new and she finally found it last season. She skated with such raw emotion. The only thing I really miss about Nichol's choreography are all of the in-betweens. She always made sure every program she did for Michelle was packed with them. And as for Michelle competing at Nationals.....SHE DAMN WELL BETTER! I just bought tickets last month! LOL...no, if she chooses not to, I'll understand. She's done so much already. It will be worth going just to see Cohen, McDonough, Mok, Kirk and the others. But...if she does skate, I'll probably have to be sedated when she takes the ice in Atlanta!

 

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Rgirl

Joined

Aug 3, 2003

• Oct 8, 2003

• #13

Originally posted by Eliza88:

However, for me, nothing can rival her 2003 season. She skated for herself, from her heart, and she showed everything there was to love and enjoy about skating in her programs.

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ITA. For me, Michelle's transformation came in '03. I was so immensely impressed with the improvements Michelle made in the whole way she moved and as BronzeisGolden said, it was so heartfelt. Although I thought most of Lori's programs were choreographically interesting, IMO a lot of them didn't really seem to be a good fit with Michelle's natural way of moving, which I always found odd since Nichol started out deriving movement for Michelle's first programs from her improvisations. Some suited Michelle very well, like "East of Eden," but especially from '99 on, it seemed as if Lori's choreography became more about getting in a lot of unusual moves and lots of moves per beat rather than about what was best for Michelle as well as what was best for the choreography as a whole. (BTW, I think you can do what's best for a skater and still challenge her/him.) To me "The Feeling Begins" and "Aranjuez" fit Michelle's natural style like a perfectly tailored but very comfortable suit. Plus Michelle's movement and skating became so much more expansive and relaxed that I felt the whole effect was reflective of the "livin' large, know my own mind" 22-year-old Michelle. Interesting movement is great, but what I found both thrilling and moving about "TFB" and "Aranjuez" was the way Michelle transcended her own previous iconic status to become a new and IMO even more exciting icon.

Now if Michelle could either try another costume designer besides Vera Wang or else get Vera off her designer panties and get her to design something besides the basic "Sheh" costume in different colors and fabrics
Rgirl

 

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ladybug

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• Oct 8, 2003

• #14

Without Lori, I am not sure Michelle would have become the skater she is today.

Because of Michelle, Lori became very popular and in demand. When that happened it seemed like Michelle just became another skater to her.

It also seemed like Lori took more of an interest in promoting the Canadian skaters which is understandable since she is Canadian herself.

I think Michelle could see that herself and that is why she made the change. Now lets see if NM has also become too popular with too much on his plate. IF we see Michelle at Nationals, that should tell us a lot.

Ladybug

 

VIETgrlTerifa

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• Oct 8, 2003

• #15

Now lets see if NM has also become too popular with too much on his plate.

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I think he already is...

I loved Michelle with Frank and Lori, but I agree with those who think it's better for Michelle to branch out and take more control over her skating.

I just hope Michelle puts more choreography content in her programs, and I also hope that she would get a new choreographer next season. I would love to see Michelle work with other choreographers to soak in their input, and to me...in terms of single skaters, Nikolai Morosov is getting stale fast.

 

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Germanice

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• Oct 8, 2003

• #16

I can't see any difference.

Anke

 

berthes ghost

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• Oct 8, 2003

• #17

I'd like to say that the proof is in the pudding, but as we see above, everyone has their own reading of results.

It's been 6 years since Tara and 2 since Frank, MK has yet to increase her tech content. In fact, the only big post Frank difference I see is that she now does 6 triple programs rather than the 7 triple programs she did with Frank. But, oh yeah, it was Frank holding her back.

She's had at least 3 different choreographers since Lori, but always it's the same program. MM, Schez, Aranchez, Tosca: all bare in the beginning with hardly any of the interesting moves that her earlier work contained. Oh, but it's the choreographers that are making her seem stale.

 

Ogre Mage

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Jul 30, 2003

• Oct 8, 2003

• #18

Michelle

I would divide Michelle's career into roughly 4 periods:

1993-1995, 1996-1999, 2000-2002 and 2003-?

I loved Michelle's programs from 1996-99. They showed an attention to detail, interpetation and sheer artistry which had me watching them again and again. 1996 was definitely a "coming out" year for Michelle, the first time we saw her unleashed artistically. Michelle, Frank and Lori definitely produced some classics.

However, it should be noted that she was also with Frank and Lori in 2000-01 and IMO this was not a great period for her. She at times looked uninspired, technical flaws began to creep into her skating and the level of detail was going down. Sadly, this reached a nadir in 2002, which unfortunately was an Olympic Year. The one good thing I could say was that Michelle picked up her 3rd and 4th world titles during this era, confirming her spot among the all-time greats.

2003 was another "coming out" year for Michelle, similiar and yet different from 1996. While the level of detail had not reappared in the choreography, she looked revitalized, energetic and into her skating. Furthermore, her moves on the ice were in textbook form. It was the first time Michelle could show her "true self," in full control of her skating and career. (2002 doesn't count as much of those programs were dictated by Frank). We saw her transformed -- just as we did in 1996. It was a wonderful rebirth, but whether this period of her career will eventually rival or even surpass '96-'99 remains to be seen.

 

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lavender

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• Oct 8, 2003

• #19

berthes ghost said:

I'd like to say that the proof is in the pudding, but as we see above, everyone has their own reading of results.

It's been 6 years since Tara and 2 since Frank, MK has yet to increase her tech content. In fact, the only big post Frank difference I see is that she now does 6 triple programs rather than the 7 triple programs she did with Frank. But, oh yeah, it was Frank holding her back.

She's had at least 3 different choreographers since Lori, but always it's the same program. MM, Schez, Aranchez, Tosca: all bare in the beginning with hardly any of the interesting moves that her earlier work contained. Oh, but it's the choreographers that are making her seem stale.

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Ok I gotta ask Berthes. Are you being sarcastic?

 

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Bynx

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Jul 29, 2003

• Oct 8, 2003

• #20

Ah!
Doesn't matter what anyone thinks,
Michelle is happier now and what makes her happy
is the best for her!