Caroline Zhang's 2009-10 season

krenseby said:

And her chances for Sochi as well ;-) That Vancouver's not an option is already a foregone conclusion.

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I agree about Vancouver, but why Sochi? If she takes some time off to fix her technique, I don't see why she wouldn't have a chance, just like anybody else would. I don't think it's likely that she will make the effort, but who knows.

Right now, I think she's putting way too much pressure on herself. Pressure to fix her crappy technique, pressure to make the Olympic team, pressure just to improve everything. Then even when she thinks she has skated well (like in the SP at TEB), the scores are still low so that probably deflates her and robs her of even more confidence. Something about her this season just doesn't seem right, and I'm not only referring to her skating.

Andalusia said:

I agree about Vancouver, but why Sochi? If she takes some time off to fix her technique, I don't see why she wouldn't have a chance, just like anybody else would. I don't think it's likely that she will make the effort, but who knows.

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She doesn't have a coach to reteach her the technique, and there aren't too many technical coaches available that specialize in that. I don't assume she'll find one. And a total reworking of her basic skating and jumps could fail.

krenseby said:

And her chances for Sochi as well ;-) That Vancouver's not an option is already a foregone conclusion.

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I wouldn't count her out for an event more than 4 years away. If she has the discipline to fix her problems over the next 2 or so seasons, she could be right back in the thick of things. Of course, it depends on her.

Hmm...it now shows a page 68 but nothing happens when I click it...? Is this thread too long now?

I feel so bad about how unhappy she is.
Another mid-season coach change on the horizon?

R.D. said:

I wouldn't count her out for an event more than 4 years away. If she has the discipline to fix her problems over the next 2 or so seasons, she could be right back in the thick of things. Of course, it depends on her.

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Well, when thinking about Caroline, my mind sorta turns to back to Jenny Kirk who was a World Junior Champion and really failed to make an impact on the senior scene. Kinda awkward to be writing about her actually, knowing that she reads these forums, but she is one example of how some skaters never get past the faulty technique acquired in their youth.

jjane45 said:

I feel so bad about how unhappy she is.
Another mid-season coach change on the horizon?

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I just don't think she will leave Mingzhu Li anytime soon. Just a hunch.

do you have to shout "Zhang is out!" "Zhang officially in B-club?" "Zhang off podium" in every thread you posted? I am just saying...

krenseby said:

And her chances for Sochi as well ;-) That Vancouver's not an option is already a foregone conclusion.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BEpXfugukE

I posted this in the GP Ladies LP thread too. Mirai and Caroline after the comp.

ANW said:

do you have to shout "Zhang is out!" "Zhang officially in B-club?" "Zhang off podium" in every thread you posted? I am just saying...

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And on other boards, too. You detest Caroline and her skating, don't wander into this thread.

Also, it is fairly idiotic to say that Caroline doesn't even have the remotest chance of going to Sochi based on 2 bad GP events. Not this far away from 2014.

krenseby said:

I just don't think she will leave Mingzhu Li anytime soon. Just a hunch.

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She really has no choice. We already know she wanted to leave but realized she didn't have time this season. But come April...

demarinis5 said:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BEpXfugukE

I posted this in the GP Ladies LP thread too. Mirai and Caroline after the comp.

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wow! mirai, at the about the 1:30 mark: "i feel that if i'm able to work just a litte bit harder, that i'll be able to, hopefully, blow the competition away..." :chorus:

talk about balls and being unscripted....LOL, LOL the way she says it too, it's just so off the cuff and with a smiling facade.

I've never been a Caroline fan myself, but she does have some positive points that may be worth salvaging. For whatever reason, she is going backwards not improving, and her serious jump flaws may be uncorrectible at this point. I'm not willing to throw her under the bus completely, but in order to ever be competitive in the top levels of skating, she'll need to:

1) Skate at US Nationals and then voluntarily retire from competition for the rest of the season, with the possible exception of 4CC if she skates acceptably enough for USFS to send her. I think her chances of being selected for Olympic or World team in 2010 are slim and none, and slim's out of town. No matter how she skates at US Nationals.

2) Take the entire competitive 2010-2011 season off, and work primarily on technical such as power, speed and of course relearn jumping technique. Her technique problems are so serious that at best it will be difficult to make the fixes needed and I think will take the better part of 2 years and that's if all the planets align and she has a strong technical coach and LISTENS TO THE COACH. There's no way she'll be able to do the necessary fixes if she has to concentrate on practicing programs and then competing at international majors. It ain't gonna work. She would also benefit from a lot of off-ice general and core strength training.

3) Get rid of Mingzhu Li and get a strong technical coach that practices tough-love like Frank is doing with Mirai. For whatever reasons, it's not just Li's coaching skills on question here, but the Caroline-family-coach dynamic that I suspect isn't helping Caroline's progress. These technique issues had to have surfaced back when Caroline was doing doubles, or learning triples, probably by intermediate/novice level. Why the coach didn't put her foot down and insist Caroline fix them is a mystery to me, as Li certainly was able to get the message of decent jump technique across to Lu Chen years ago with great results.

4) None of this will happen unless Caroline herself is willing to bite the bullet and do what it takes to get up there with the best of ladies skaters. With a goal of making her mark in the 2012-2014 period. And she will have to have family support (or at least noninterference) and probably USFS support. She may need to move away from southern Cal, which is feasible for a 16-17 year old.

Unfortunately, the glimpses I see of Caroline's attitude and personality do not make me optimistic she can/will do this. But if she doesn't change course drastically over the next few months, she will likely go down the path of Canada's Mira Leung. This would be a sad waste of talent.

Welcome to Golden Skate (and as we say here, post often, post long! )

krenseby said:

Well, when thinking about Caroline, my mind sorta turns to back to Jenny Kirk who was a World Junior Champion and really failed to make an impact on the senior scene. Kinda awkward to be writing about her actually, knowing that she reads these forums, but she is one example of how some skaters never get past the faulty technique acquired in their youth.

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Jenny won 4CC. She had to deal with the death of her mother as a teenager. No comparison

yelyoh said:

Jenny won 4CC. She had to deal with the death of her mother as a teenager. No comparison

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Agree, not a good comparison. Jenny's technique issues were not ever as bad as Caroline's are now. And once Jenny's mother died, she pretty much lost the will to deal with competitive skating. Also, Jenny was usually a much better performer and more musical than Caroline has ever been--or at least Jenny picked music choices/programs that played to her strengths rather than her weaknesses.

PS to Doris: thanks for the welcome! I've lurked forever at GS but decided to emerge from the shadows.

One thing I've noticed from watching video clips is that Caroline's shoulders have gotten broader. That combined with her injury and increased height and weight must be making the jumps harder to rotate. Could it be that 80% of Caroline's problems can be fixed by simply getting stronger? As soon as her knee allows, she needs to get into the gym and start pumping the iron.

I mean she had the same bad technique several months ago when she trounced Team USA at Four Continents.

PolymerBob said:

I mean she had the same bad technique several months ago when she trounced Team USA at Four Continents.

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? What team was Caroline skating for?

demarinis5 said:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BEpXfugukE

I posted this in the GP Ladies LP thread too. Mirai and Caroline after the comp.

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That hug is heartbreaking...and sweet.

^^I was thinking the same! Both Ladies must have been disappointed but Mirai obviously wanted to comfort Caroline! It must be a difficult friendship, both being under such pressure.