Men Short Program

calica · Oct 23, 2009

evangeline · Oct 23, 2009

Medusa said:
I wouldn't call him better than Chan, but I always thought that they are pretty equal. The judges thought the same, till Buttle retired.

Taka is so great, such an amazing skater, I loved those spins today, they were very fast, sharp, well-centered.

I think therein lies the problem: Chan is the #1 Canadian, while Kozuka is the #3 Japanese. It's not fair, it's not right, blah blah blah but these things seem to come into account when judges are handing out scores.

It's like how Alexander Abt always got the shaft when he was the #3 Russian behind Yagudin and Plushenko.

museksk8r · Oct 23, 2009

evangeline said:
I think therein lies the problem: Chan is the #1 Canadian, while Kozuka is the #3 Japanese. It's not fair, it's not right, blah blah blah but these things seem to come into account when judges are handing out scores.

It's like how Alexander Abt always got the shaft when he was the #3 Russian behind Yagudin and Plushenko.

Yes, it unfortunately does happen. Figure skating meets politics and rears its ugly head.

*Sniper* · Oct 23, 2009

at Plushy's score.
Looks like both elder statesmen(women) of figure skating did quite well today. :thumbsup:

evangeline said:
I think therein lies the problem: Chan is the #1 Canadian, while Kozuka is the #3 Japanese. It's not fair, it's not right, blah blah blah but these things seem to come into account when judges are handing out scores.

It's like how Alexander Abt always got the shaft when he was the #3 Russian behind Yagudin and Plushenko.

So does that mean Kozuka probably won't get the credit he deserves unless he bests his countrymen at nationals first?

Medusa · Oct 23, 2009

*Sniper* said:
So does that mean Kozuka probably won't get the credit he deserves unless he bests his countrymen at nationals first?

And even then I am not sure they would give him the monster scores. Lysacek was e.g. third at last US Nationals, but got clearly rewarded with big PCS at 4CC and Worlds, bigger PCS than Mroz and Abbott. Despite the fact that Abbott, even with mistakes, is clearly the superior skater.

Just because you mess up at Nationals, it doesn't mean that the judges don't see you as No.1 of your country.

Buzzz · Oct 23, 2009

Thank you for the links. Still cannot believe Plushy is back after all these years. I would much prefer to see young upcoming talent get their chance, but very well done by him anyway and good luck! :clap:

fairly4 · Oct 23, 2009

Tahiko great program, loved your spings.

Evgeny a bit rusty-maybe but if he keeps improving the OGM from what i have seen so far is his or he will be very tough to beat. (like i said from what I have seen so far)

Great skate evgeny

Johnny--i don't know what to say-- a decent skate (personally can't stand the costume). to me front part of program look like a girl skating type but the end of the short program for me look men type of artistry. keep improving.

Hsuhs · Oct 23, 2009

Takahiko Kozuka is btw the reigning national silver medalist. Last worlds he outskated Nobunari Oda and finished 6th overall. Thanks to Takahiko Kozuka Japan now has 3 entries for the upcoming Olympics.

Blades of Passion · Oct 23, 2009

Plushenko's cannonball sit-spin position is embarrassing. I don't think he interpreted the music very well either.

But...those jumps! Absolutely perfect Quad-Toe combination and Triple Axel. Wow. He still has it.

Hsuhs · Oct 23, 2009

Blades of Passion said:
Plushenko's cannonball sit-spin position is embarrassing.

Not to the judges.
FSSp3 0,2
CSSp4 0,4

Those goes aren't huge, still positive.

Blades of Passion · Oct 23, 2009

Judges don't know how to judge the sport. It's sad. No matter what system is in place, there is always going to be failure in the form of bias and/or idiocy.

Tinymavy15 · Oct 23, 2009

Blades of Passion said:
Plushenko's cannonball sit-spin position is embarrassing. I don't think he interpreted the music very well either.

But...those jumps! Absolutely perfect Quad-Toe combination and Triple Axel. Wow. He still has it.

My thoughts exactly. I have seen 6 year old with better positions on the sitspin. But spins never were his strength.

Blades of Passion · Oct 23, 2009

BTW, Kozuka deserved to win the SP. This guy is amazing. He is currently quite underrated in terms of his artistry. I got chills during his SP.

The Japanese have the strongest 3-man lineup, IMO. One of the best 3-man lineups ever, in fact. Takahashi, Kozuka, and Oda all have the ability to be World Champions.

The same can be said of Abbott, Weir, and Lysacek on the American side...but they aren't as consistent overall.

prettykeys · Oct 23, 2009

I don't know about placement, but I was left feeling underwhelmed by Evgeni also. Perhaps rustiness or being out of training for a while left him a bit sapped for energy during his step sequence (so it's understandable)...but he's still doing that thing where he packs all his jumps in at the very beginning of the program with deadspace in between them.

With nothing left to prove, and no missing golds, I wish he'd found more motivation to experiment artistically rather than doing the tactical thing.

Kozuka - what a charming performance.

Nadine · Oct 23, 2009

I just have to say that was one for the ages for me personally as a long-time Evgeni Plushenko Fan!!!!!!!! :clap:

:thumbsup:

And like I mentioned earlier this morning I'm in love with the guy from Japan ~ WOW!!!!! :bow:

:thumbsup:

oxade21 · Oct 23, 2009

Rustiness, my @#$!!!! and judges agree. If not for Plushenko, we might soon have men and women competitions combined. Welcome back, Plushy!!!!!!!

gracefulswan · Oct 23, 2009

regarding evgeni's spins, i'm wondering if that supposed cannonball sit-spin was not really the spin he was trying? maybe he wished to keep his foot off of his knee instead of on it? new style perhaps? lol. it was lower than the usual such sit-spins and he held his foot the whole time.... so i think it wasn't supposed to be a conventional cannonball sit-spin.

Blades of Passion · Oct 23, 2009

I hope the Plushenko apologists don't drive me mad this season.

His performance here was not a great one. He did an excellent Quad-Triple combination and an excellent Triple Axel. He is showing great promise of returning to the level he used to skate at, but there was really nothing else to be excited about in this performance. He was overscored because of his name and there are a lot of things he should be working on in his skating.

prettykeys said:
I don't know about placement, but I was left feeling underwhelmed by Evgeni also. Perhaps rustiness or being out of training for a while left him a bit sapped for energy during his step sequence (so it's understandable)...but he's still doing that thing where he packs all his jumps in at the very beginning of the program with deadspace in between them.

With nothing left to prove, and no missing golds, I wish he'd found more motivation to experiment artistically rather than doing the tactical thing.

Completely agree.

janetfan · Oct 23, 2009

Blades of Passion said:
His performance here was not a great one. He did an excellent Quad-Triple combination and an excellent Triple Axel. He is showing great promise of returning to the level he used to skate at, but there was really nothing else to be excited about in this performance. He was overscored because of his name and there are a lot of things he should be working on in his skating.

Am curious - if he had done a decent 3L what would his score have been today? Pretty close to his score in Torino?
He is obviously doing more than enough to score very well under Cop vision of skating - whether it was the '06 version or today's version.
Why should he bother to change, other than cleaning up a few things here and there when he is the apparently the ideal skater of the new scoring system?
This can be considered a rhetorical post as I do not want to sound like a big wiseguy. But if you are not happy with his score and the placements today you need to be honest and I think it goes past reputation alone.

herios · Oct 23, 2009

Blades of Passion said:
BTW, Kozuka deserved to win the SP. This guy is amazing. He is currently quite underrated in terms of his artistry. I got chills during his SP.

The Japanese have the strongest 3-man lineup, IMO. One of the best 3-man lineups ever, in fact. Takahashi, Kozuka, and Oda all have the ability to be World Champions.

The same can be said of Abbott, Weir, and Lysacek on the American side...but they aren't as consistent overall.

I was so upset by Kozuka's marks that it ruined my day. Not the fact that they put him second, I was expecting that, but to give a 6.75 edge to Plushy that is a madness. He was trumped in LA as well, now this is his second year in a row, I cannot get it. Someone here says he is ranked 3rd in Japan, what the hell that has to do with it? This is a sport not a monarchy where you have to wait your turn to get on the throne. Have we not seen sweeps before?

Yes, Japan has the strongest line-up in men's skating right now and the judges should treat them fairly if they compete well.
I looked at his face and he clearly was dissapointed by his marks. If you look at the breakdown, he was especially hit in Interpretation and performance. I would like to hear those judges, what was he supposed to do better to increase his marks on such a rock piece?

Men Short Program

calica

evangeline

museksk8r

Sniper

Medusa

Buzzz

fairly4

Hsuhs

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be

Hsuhs

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be

Tinymavy15

Sinnerman for the win

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be

prettykeys

Nadine

oxade21

Match Penalty

gracefulswan

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be

janetfan

Match Penalty

herios

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