Countdown to Sasha's Return | Page 10 | Golden Skate

Countdown to Sasha's Return

Wicked

Final Flight
Joined
May 26, 2009
I will agree that Mirai has star power, but I don't think she is the only one.

Sasha Cohen has wonderful presence and is a genuine star on the ice. I hope the US has some other ladies who can follow in her footsteps. The only one who strikes me as a possibility right now is Mirai. Who else do you see? And which programs best illustrate their talents? I'm not seeing it and I hope I'm missing something.
 

prettykeys

Medalist
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Ouch! That fellow doesn't mince words.

But he has a point. The motivation/agenda was never clear. :p
It's not a "fellow"/"he". Can't you tell? :p

It's got all the signs of a cattiness that comes from someone of the estrogen-dominated sex.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
It's got all the signs of a cattiness that comes from someone of the estrogen-dominated sex.

Yeah, I guess the Pepto-Bismol bit should have given it away. Then, I looked at the name and I couldn't tell at first glance what gender name it was.
 
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PolymerBob

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2007
Sasha Cohen has wonderful presence and is a genuine star on the ice. I hope the US has some other ladies who can follow in her footsteps. The only one who strikes me as a possibility right now is Mirai. Who else do you see? And which programs best illustrate their talents? I'm not seeing it and I hope I'm missing something.

You may be missing the programs that got standing ovations at Four Continents and the World Team Trophy.
 

Bennett

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Now that I see the schedule for Skate America, it becomes clear how much USFS was counting on Sasha. With no short programs on Thursday, and the ladies skating in prime time Saturday and on Siunday afternoon, it is clear that NBC television is running the show, arranging the event so as to maximize viewership.

This is also what was behind the decision to hold Skate America later in the year this season, instead of first.

They could have had three top U.S. ladies. (Alissa, Rachael and Caroline seemed liike the best bets at the time the selections were made.) By reserving a spot for Sasha and a TBA just in case Michelle came back, they are now left with a dud as far as attracting U.S. viewers.

To change the dates of SA and the date of ladies short primarily to feature Sasha in the prime time? Would the USFS believe so strongly that Sasha could have people who never watch FS but the Olympics turn on TV that they made all these arrangements at the costs of possible risks?

It actually has a negative effect on skating popularity when the star skater does not do well in the featured prime time. This happened with Miki last year or two years ago when she had a meltdown at NHK. The hype turned out to be like a funeral.
 
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prettykeys

Medalist
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
To change the dates of SA and the date of ladies short primarily to feature Sasha in the prime time? Would the USFS believe so strongly that Sasha could have people who never watch FS but the Olympics turn on TV that they made all these arrangements at the costs of possible risks?

It actually has a negative effect on skating popularity when the star skater does not do well in the featured prime time. This happened with Miki last year or two years ago when she had a meltdown at NHK. The hype turned out to be like a funeral.
Mathman's words were, "to maximize viewership." ;)

Yes, I think they were banking on Sasha to be able to do it. Who else could?
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
Mathman's words were, "to maximize viewership." ;)

Yes, I think they were banking on Sasha to be able to do it. Who else could?

Actually, mathman made a point about the "tba" skater along with Sasha would have boosted ratings.

In this case, it is clear mathman meant "tba" = Michelle

He is right and having both of them back would have definitely raised interest for US skating fans and even casual viewers of figure skating.
 

fairly4

Medalist
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
well i know i am not going to buy pepto bismol because of her.
but you should here how pg people talk about athletels or people of different race, religion creed, on the bus to/from work. you might be surprised at what they really think of people that dont fit into their way of thinking or lifestlye.

tanith-white/sasha white.
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
well i know i am not going to buy pepto bismol because of her.
but you should here how pg people talk about athletels or people of different race, religion creed, on the bus to/from work. you might be surprised at what they really think of people that dont fit into their way of thinking or lifestlye.

tanith-white/sasha white.

Do you realize how strange your post sounds? :scratch:

To not acknowledge Michelle in the equation defies all logic. ...:sheesh::eek:hwell:
 

prettykeys

Medalist
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Actually, mathman made a point about the "tba" skater along with Sasha would have boosted ratings.

In this case, it is clear mathman meant "tba" = Michelle

He is right and having both of them back would have definitely raised interest for US skating fans and even casual viewers of figure skating.
I do not know what your correction to my words are.

My post was in response to Bennett, who said,
Bennett said:
...the costs of possible risks?

It actually has a negative effect on skating popularity when the star skater does not do well in the featured prime time. This happened with Miki last year or two years ago when she had a meltdown at NHK. The hype turned out to be like a funeral.
That is, Mathman's argument was that the networks were concerned about viewership--not necessarily skating popularity in a more general sense--and that they were counting on Sasha to increase said viewership. And I agreed.

What is incorrect about all this? :rolleye:

The "TBA = Michelle" is more speculation than USFSA/NBC wanting to attract viewers with Sasha; and Bennett, accordingly, did not even mention Michelle.

:banging:
 
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R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
To change the dates of SA and the date of ladies short primarily to feature Sasha in the prime time? Would the USFS believe so strongly that Sasha could have people who never watch FS but the Olympics turn on TV that they made all these arrangements at the costs of possible risks?

It actually has a negative effect on skating popularity when the star skater does not do well in the featured prime time. This happened with Miki last year or two years ago when she had a meltdown at NHK. The hype turned out to be like a funeral.

But didn't SA ALWAYS have this schedule- at least since 2007? IIRC the ladies short was always Sat. afternoon/evening and the free skate live on NBC Sunday afternoon? This is not new for this year. The only thing that's new is the mid-November date (instead of late October).

Looking back, I do think USFS would have been better off inviting the top three US skaters from Nationals (Alyssa/Rachel/Caroline). But I suppose they had to bow to the pressure and give Cohen a spot when she announced the "comeback". I wonder if they told Em Hughes in advance "be ready" just in case Cohen was to bail out. But then again, she has done this late substitute thing before- I just hope she does well for herself. It does NOT bode well for her Oly chances if she bombs...
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
The "TBA = Michelle" is more speculation than USFSA/NBC wanting to attract viewers with Sasha; and Bennett, accordingly, did not even mention Michelle.

I don't know the economics of the USFS deal but I take it SA is really not worth all that much? Most of the promotion (and airtime) is dedicated to US Nationals. So imagine the hype of seeing "Cohen for the first time in 4 years try for an Oly spot" in prime time on NBC Saturday night. Well, it would work until she pulls out on Thursday. :p
 
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Joined
Jun 21, 2003
But didn't SA ALWAYS have this schedule- at least since 2007? IIRC the ladies short was always Sat. afternoon/evening and the free skate live on NBC Sunday afternoon? This is not new for this year.

Oh. Yes, quite so. (I had to look it up.) So NBC did not do anything special this year after all.
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
I do not know what your correction to my words are.

What is incorrect about all this? :rolleye:

The "TBA = Michelle" is more speculation than USFSA/NBC wanting to attract viewers with Sasha; and Bennett, accordingly, did not even mention Michelle.

:banging:

I was making an observation about mathman's earlier post which you commented on.

Maybe I missed something but I believe mm's point was that having both "tba" and Sasha would boost ratings.

Hardly anbody from USA would believe Sasha alone would have much effect on TV viewership but having Michelle and Sasha both back would.

I don't think it is very speculative at all (o% in fact) to connect SA's "tba" with Michelle.

I know you are not a Michelle fan, and you are also not from USA. A Canadian view is as good as any but Michelle trumps Sasha in every possible way, from skating titles to endorsement deals and popularity with skating fans and the biggest area, Michelle's name recognition with the general American public.

I was only adding a comment, I was not criticizing you - but take my remarks anyway you choose to.

And perhaps mathman will clarify who he meant "tba" was being reserved for.

Geez, such a fuss over a contributing type of remark feels strange. I say enough odd and highly opinioned things at GS that I am surprisewd you would be touchy over this. :)

Here is what you said that I commented about in my previous post:

"Mathman's words were, "to maximize viewership."

"Yes, I think they were banking on Sasha to be able to do it. Who else could"


Sorry, but imo the heaviest banking was always on Michelle's possible comeback, not Sasha's.
 
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prettykeys

Medalist
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Maybe I missed something but I believe mm's point was that having both "tba" and Sasha would boost ratings.

Hardly anbody from USA would believe Sasha alone would have much effect on TV viewership but having Michelle and Sasha both back would.

I don't think it is very speculative at all (o% in fact) to connect SA's "tba" with Michelle.

I know you are not a Michelle fan, and you are also not from USA. A Canadian view is as good as any but Michelle trumps Sasha in every possible way, from skating titles to endorsement deals and popularity with skating fans and the biggest area, Michelle's name recognition with the general American public.

Sorry, but imo the heaviest banking was always on Michelle's possible comeback, not Sasha's.
My interpretation and angle is that they were banking on Sasha, and possibly hoping for Michelle.

It doesn't matter that Michelle > Sasha (I agree with it, in terms of both popularity and skater), there was always less certainty with Michelle's return compared to Sasha's announcement in May(?), despite Sasha's questionable ability in or commitment to returning.

And believe it or not, I actually had a Michelle SP (Rachmaninoff 1998) somehow Favourited in my YouTube list without remembering the program or when I did it. So do away with the need to lecture me about Michelle's greatness.
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
My interpretation and angle is that they were banking on Sasha, and possibly hoping for Michelle.

It doesn't matter that Michelle > Sasha (I agree with it, in terms of both popularity and skater), there was always less certainty with Michelle's return compared to Sasha's announcement in May(?), despite Sasha's questionable ability in or commitment to returning.

And believe it or not, I actually had a Michelle SP (Rachmaninoff 1998) somehow Favourited in my YouTube list without remembering the program or when I did it. So do away with the need to lecture me about Michelle's greatness.

Forget Michelle's "greatness" because you or anyone else can make an argument that perhaps she is overrated. I don't have any problem with that and it gets discussed at GS from time to time.

As far as the degree of "speculation" you could also raise a point.
But after Michelle's comments at '09 Worlds there was a great degree of speculation over whether she would return. Her apearance at Yun'a summer show only fueled that speculation.
There were announcemnets from US Skating that a deadline would be given to Michelle regarding the timing of her announcement about whether she would return to compete again or not.

That is how I remember it, and if mm cares to join in I believe he alone can say who he believed the "tba" for Skate America was created for.

Knowing mathman he will probably say it was reserved for Dorothy Hamill's comeback :biggrin:
 

Bennett

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Oh. Yes, quite so. (I had to look it up.) So NBC did not do anything special this year after all.
Okay. I was surprised to read your original post. But they are not doing anything special then.
I feel that Emily Hughes is one of the names that people may recognize.
 

prettykeys

Medalist
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
But after Michelle's comments at '09 Worlds there was a great degree of speculation over whether she would return. Her apearance at Yun'a summer show only fueled that speculation.
There were announcemnets from US Skating that a deadline would be given to Michelle regarding the timing of her announcement about whether she would return to compete again or not.

That is how I remember it, and if mm cares to join in I believe he alone can say who he believed the "tba" for Skate America was created for.

Knowing mathman he will probably say it was reserved for Dorothy Hamill's comeback :biggrin:
I feel like I have to be extremely literal and state everything in order to make myself clear, which annoys me.

I know that Mathman said he believes the TBA was meant for Michelle (I can read.)

In case that isn't clear, I will say it another way. It is obvious to me that Mathman said he thinks SA's TBA spot was in hopes of Michelle showing up.

Secondly, in my mind, Michelle's announcement in early August that she would retire did not fuel speculation that she would compete in 2010 Oly's; it dampened it (or rather, in my case, eliminated it) and her participation in the Ice Show with YuNa a few weeks after did not affect this impression of mine. I also do not believe it changed most people's ideas of Michelle returning to competition.

Third, R.D.'s pointing out the previous SA primetime scheduling of Ladies' Figure Skating may have disproved the original notion that they made a huge setup for Sasha's appearance. No biggie. Bennett's skepticism is now realism.
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
I feel like I have to be extremely literal and state everything in order to make myself clear, which annoys me.

I know that Mathman said he believes the TBA was meant for Michelle (I can read.)

In case that isn't clear, I will say it another way. It is obvious to me that Mathman said he thinks SA's TBA spot was in hopes of Michelle showing up.

Secondly, in my mind, Michelle's announcement in early August that she would retire did not fuel speculation that she would compete in 2010 Oly's; it dampened it (or rather, in my case, eliminated it) and her participation in the Ice Show with YuNa a few weeks after did not affect this impression of mine. I also do not believe it changed most people's ideas of Michelle returning to competition.

Third, R.D.'s pointing out the previous SA primetime scheduling of Ladies' Figure Skating may have disproved the original notion that they made a huge setup for Sasha's appearance. No biggie. Bennett's skepticism is now realism.

Good points. I think we agree and just had a misunderstanding.
Bennet is right about the TV - just as mathman might have been right about the more important issue - the timing of SA, which is usually first and not so late in the GP season.

Michelle did announce her retirement publicly shortly after the deadline US Skating had asked for. But earlier US skating also had asked to move SA back.
I will "speculate" to give Michelle more time to prepare - Sasha , who had been skating in shows was believed to be further along and was assigned to the 1st GP of the season, TEB.

The rest, as we know is history. Michelle did not "unretire" and Sasha is still bedeviling her fans and giving much fodder to her detractors.
Sometimes the more things appear to change the more they stay the same.
 
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