Miki Ando may attempt a quad jump at 2009 Grand Prix Final!! | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Miki Ando may attempt a quad jump at 2009 Grand Prix Final!!

Tango_D_R

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 24, 2009
If her attempt to do the 4S is purely based on the fact that she can land consistently and feels confident about them in practice, of course, why not! go for it!

But if she's thinking, 'I HAVE TO get this in order to win over Kim at the Finals' or
'To win the VC Oly, I REALLY need to land those quads' , then No.. that is not the right answer. It could as well turn out to be something similar to today's Mao's 3A case, and might work against her.. and could end up like her 2006 Olympics.

From what I've seen so far, before talking about the quads she really needs to get the 3Lz-3Lo done right(which she's totally capable of).
Even her 3-2 looks far from solid so far.. then why trying to focus on the quads? 3Lz-3Lo is still a very difficult combination for the ladies and as well appreciated by scores when executed right.
Besides Kim, she could easily stay top of the game with her 3Lz-3Lo, 2A-3T, no need to rush for 4S until she nail those combinations. I would rather appreciate a clean 3-2 than a shaky 4S.
Again.. quad is not the golden ticket for winning.

However, as I mentioned, if her intent is solely based on her practice results, I'm all there for her :rock:
She is after all, the only lady who landed them in competition :clap:



Looking back... I really think this post would mean just as much to Mao's case ;)
 
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museksk8r

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 31, 2006
Country
United-States
Biggest. mistake. ever! Why would she want to give up the possibility of an opportunity to finish a solid 2nd (I imagine she and Joannie (if she qualifies) will be vying for that placement behind Kim) when she could attempt a quad, fail miserably on it, and be shaken by it the whole program and risk finishing out of the medals altogether. Ando hasn't been very solid this season despite the two GP golds and I think it's way too risky for her and her health to try the very likely downgradeable quad. She should focus on getting that 2Axel+3toe done successfully, which hasn't happened yet this season. Very nice improvement on the 3loop though at NHK! :)
 
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chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
The last time Miki landed a ratified quad, she was 14 years old. She's now nearly 22, and she hasn't been credited with a successful quad attempt since then. Considering that some of her triples have been downgraded lately, she has zero chance of having a 4S ratified.

As other posters have mentioned, every time she has gone for the quad, the rest of her program disintegrated. A quad attempt would be a desperate move that Miki would do well to avoid.
 
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Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Country
France
As far as the Salchow is concerned, I wonder why she doesn't practice a 3Sal-3Loop? It seems like that would be more consistent than the 3Lutz-3Loop for her.

She could use that combination for her SP too and then do a Lutz as her solo jump, which would additionally let her forget about her nemesis jump (the Flip).

3Sal-3Loop and 3Lutz would have the same base value as what Yu-Na does in the SP.
 
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Bennett

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
If her attempt to do the 4S is purely based on the fact that she can land consistently and feels confident about them in practice, of course, why not! go for it!

But if she's thinking, 'I HAVE TO get this in order to win over Kim at the Finals' or
'To win the VC Oly, I REALLY need to land those quads' , then No.. that is not the right answer. It could as well turn out to be something similar to today's Mao's 3A case, and might work against her.. and could end up like her 2006 Olympics.

From what I've seen so far, before talking about the quads she really needs to get the 3Lz-3Lo done right(which she's totally capable of).
Even her 3-2 looks far from solid so far.. then why trying to focus on the quads? 3Lz-3Lo is still a very difficult combination for the ladies and as well appreciated by scores when executed right.
Besides Kim, she could easily stay top of the game with her 3Lz-3Lo, 2A-3T, no need to rush for 4S until she nail those combinations. I would rather appreciate a clean 3-2 than a shaky 4S.
Again.. quad is not the golden ticket for winning.

However, as I mentioned, if her intent is solely based on her practice results, I'm all there for her :rock:
She is after all, the only lady who landed them in competition :clap:



Looking back... I really think this post would mean just as much to Mao's case ;)

The obsession of Miki and Mao with 4S or 3A seems to be more to do with their athletic spirit, rather than an irrational belief that it is the magical ticket to win.
Shizuka aged 24 yrs old was able to calmly let go of the second triple of 3S-3T when her landing on the first triple was not secure. She just prioritized getting more points than doing 3-3.
But these two ladies do not seem to be afraid of the high risks as much as they might be if their only concern were to get more points. Morosov stops Miki most of the times anyway though. Yet, Miki said at NHK that she could not focus because she followed the advice to play safe doing 3-2 instead of 3-3.
 

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Country
France
As other posters have mentioned, every time she has gone for the quad, the rest of her program disintegrated.

Not completely true. There was one time where it worked out, at least in terms of the performance. She attempted and LANDED the Quad at the GPF last year (very, very slightly short of hitting the 1/4 turn mark on rotation) and went on to execute 5 Triples and 2 Double Axels.

It was a very successful performance but unfortunately CoP screwed her over. The Quad (along with several other jumps) was downgraded, so her marks suffered big time.

She placed last (6th) at that GPF, but deserved the Bronze...
 

Tango_D_R

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 24, 2009
The obsession of Miki and Mao with 4S or 3A seems to be more to do with their athletic spirit, rather than an irrational belief that it is the magical ticket to win.
Shizuka aged 24 yrs old was able to calmly let go of the second triple of 3S-3T when her landing on the first triple was not secure. She just prioritized getting more points than doing 3-3.
But these two ladies do not seem to be afraid of the high risks as much as they might be if their only concern were to get more points. Morosov stops Miki most of the times anyway though. Yet, Miki said at NHK that she could not focus because she followed the advice to play safe doing 3-2 instead of 3-3.


I wouldn't say irrational belief.. more like a wrong approach to me.
Make sure to do what you can do and then challenge yourself, that was my basic point.
Also, I wouldn't say getting more points is their *only* concern.. but to certain amount, definitely. Let's say Kim is not competing in this era.. would Mao put three 3axels in her programs in current conditions? I don't think so. At least she would limit the numbers down until she gets stable practice results. After all it IS the Olympic season and the color of the medals DO matter especially for the top skaters, and it could easily make them anxious.
I'm not trying to bash on Miki's attempts to do the 4S but more like concerned. :no:

As for the interview, this was not a good answer from Miki. Had she made the 3-2 effortlessly, then I would be convinced that she was well ready to execute 3-3 in NHK. After all Mosorov is her coach and probably knows her jumps and conditions better than anyone. I'm sure he would've made that decision based on her current forms and practice results. This interview gave me some slight feelings that she was blaming him for her falls. Even if she felt that way, I don't think it's the best way to show it in an interview.. but that's my thought :)


BTW if I didn't care for Miki I wouldn't be rambling about her in the first place. I hope Miki's fans won't take this the wrong way :bow:
 

Bennett

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Not completely true. There was one time where it worked out, at least in terms of the performance. She attempted and LANDED the Quad at the GPF last year (very, very slightly short of hitting the 1/4 turn mark on rotation) and went on to execute 5 Triples and 2 Double Axels.

It was a very successful performance but unfortunately CoP screwed her over. The Quad (along with several other jumps) was downgraded, so her marks suffered big time.

She placed last (6th) at that GPF, but deserved the Bronze...

I could be wrong in my memory but was that the competition in which she looked really great in bare eyes, but many of her jumps were dinged for URs?

I wouldn't say irrational belief.. more like a wrong approach to me.
Make sure to do what you can do and then challenge yourself, that was my basic point.
Also, I wouldn't say getting more points is their *only* concern.. but to certain amount, definitely. Let's say Kim is not competing in this era.. would Mao put three 3axels in her programs in current conditions? I don't think so. At least she would limit the numbers down until she gets stable practice results. After all it IS the Olympic season and the color of the medals DO matter especially for the top skaters, and it could easily make them anxious.
I'm not trying to bash on Miki's attempts to do the 4S but more like concerned. :no:

As for the interview, this was not a good answer from Miki. Had she made the 3-2 effortlessly, then I would be convinced that she was well ready to execute 3-3 in NHK. After all Mosorov is her coach and probably knows her jumps and conditions better than anyone. I'm sure he would've made that decision based on her current forms and practice results. This interview gave me some slight feelings that she was blaming him for her falls. Even if she felt that way, I don't think it's the best way to show it in an interview.. but that's my thought :)


BTW if I didn't care for Miki I wouldn't be rambling about her in the first place. I hope Miki's fans won't take this the wrong way :bow:

Thanks for sharing your insights :).

It is an interesting question whether or not Mao would insist on the three-3A programs if she were not competing against Yuna.

Mao says that only two ladies can do 3A; that 3A is her strength; that if she gave up the plan, what she put efforts last year would be in vain; that she has not given up her dream to get OGM; that looking back with a calm mind, there is nothing she cannot do (in her programs); and that she would like to have a 100% success rate in practice.

Miki is one of the most honest athletes who bares her emotions in her interviews. It has worked both positively and negatively for her.
 

Phoenix347

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 24, 2009
I could be wrong in my memory but was that the competition in which she looked really great in bare eyes, but many of her jumps were dinged for URs?



Thanks for sharing your insights :).

It is an interesting question whether or not Mao would insist on the three-3A programs if she were not competing against Yuna.

Mao says that only two ladies can do 3A; that 3A is her strength; that if she gave up the plan, what she put efforts last year would be in vain; that she has not given up her dream to get OGM; that looking back with a calm mind, there is nothing she cannot do (in her programs); and that she would like to have a 100% success rate in practice.

Miki is one of the most honest athletes who bares her emotions in her interviews. It has worked both positively and negatively for her.

That's what I really like about her... her honesty. She may not have to national little sister cutness of Mao or the natural grace of Arakawa, but she has that inner vulnerability that makes her so human.
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
Yuna, Yuna, Yuna :rock:

This sounds like some Federation mind games to me.

Since "Triple Axle Girl" seems to have taken herself out the equation somebody wants to wave the flag for "Quad Girl."

Good luck.
 
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Dominique

Spectator
Joined
Aug 27, 2009
Miki herself has made no mention of quad after NHK Trophy.
It's Morozov who just said,"she needs an opportunity to try a quad (before Olympics), though I'm not sure if she's gonna try it at GPF."
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
Miki herself has made no mention of quad after NHK Trophy.
It's Morozov who just said,"she needs an opportunity to try a quad (before Olympics), though I'm not sure if she's gonna try it at GPF."

I like Miki and everything I have read about her shows that she is not just a great skater but also a very nice young lady. It is easy to root for Miki and I am happy when she does well at competitons.:yes:

I just thought this talk about bringing her quad back - has it been nine years since she landed it in competition - sounded a little odd.

If she tries it - I hope she lands it. But I hope she and others don't become obsessed with it. It just makes me think of Mao and how the 3A'a seeed to have effected her skating.
Go Miki :clap: and Go Mao :clap: - two wonderful skaters :clap: :clap: :yes: :yes:
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
I agree, janetfan. As much as I'd love to see Miki (or anyone, frankly) land the quad, I don't want the quad to become to Miki what the triple axel is to Mao. Miki's not my favourite skater (not by a longshot), but I could see that just wrecking her chance for an Olympic medal.
 

dlgpffps

Final Flight
Joined
Nov 14, 2009
I really enjoy Miki's performances and love Miki as an individual. I agree with everyone here that she's very sincere and honest. I would love to see Miki successfully excecute a quad (esp. in Olympic season), but I think the stakes are too high. Like someone mentioned before, Miki is injury-prone, and an injury now would just break her heart and ruin her chances to win OGM.

Actually, I'm rather torn. I haven't seen any videos of her practicing the quad, so I can't say anything for sure. If, however, she's landing those quads with consistency and not suffering for it (no injuries, no pains), I hope she brings it to the GPF and the Olympic Games. I also hope she has no emotional baggage concerning the Olympics. I heard from a Japanese friend that Miki was treated like Mao by the Japanese media (Mao prior to this season, that is) until she ended up 14th (15th?) in the Olympics. After that, Miki lost all shine for the media and public. She was criticized (a lot) and "dumped." My friend used the word "disowned." I was shocked because Miki is a top skater with stellar jumps and personality. I just can't see why anyone would do that. My friend, who's also into figure skating, also said that one of the reasons Miki avoids the quad is exactly that -- the pain she felt after she was "disowned," the fear that it could happen again (she fell on her quad then). Maybe she shouldn't attempt the quad. We've all seen amazing skaters break apart. It might be emotionally overwhelming for her.

But I'd just LOVE to see her do that quad and regain her confidence (even after her two GP wins, she was unhappy because her performances couldn't "compete at the world level"). I don't know. I just want to see her happy.
 
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DragonPhoenix

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 12, 2007
I really enjoy Miki's performances and love Miki as an individual. I agree with everyone here that she's very sincere and honest. I would love to see Miki successfully excecute a quad (esp. in Olympic season), but I think the stakes are too high. Like someone mentioned before, Miki is injury-prone, and an injury now would just break her heart and ruin her chances to win OGM.

Actually, I'm rather torn. I haven't seen any videos of her practicing the quad, so I can't say anything for sure. If, however, she's landing those quads with consistency and not suffering for it (no injuries, no pains), I hope she brings it to the GPF and the Olympic Games. I also hope she has no emotional baggage concerning the Olympics. I heard from a Japanese friend that Miki was treated like Mao by Japanese media (Mao prior to this season, that is) until she ended up 14th (15th?) in the Olympics. After that, Miki lost all shine for the Japanese media. She was criticized (a lot) and "dumped." My friend used the word "disowned." I was shocked because Miki is a top skater with stellar jumps and personality. I just can't see why anyone would do that. My friend, who's also into figure skating, also said that one of reasons Miki avoids the quad is exactly that -- the pain she felt after she was "disowned," the fear that it could happen again. Maybe she shouldn't attempt the quad. We've all seen amazing skaters break apart. It might be emotionally overwhelming for her.

But I'd just LOVE to see her do that quad and regain her confidence (even after her two GP wins, she was unhappy because her performances couldn't "compete at the world level"). I don't know. I just want to see her happy.


My feelings are the same :agree:

And about the quad, I'm same too, torn. It's fantastic if she lands it.
But as you said, the stakes may be too high.
The key is a clean, no injuries, program, that she's happy with.
 

Layfan

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
hmm.. I don't know if this is a good idea or not ... Personally, I'd love to see her land one of course. But her scores in her GP events make me think she shouldn't be thinking so much about challenging Yuna Kim for gold as making sure some come-from-behind skater like Wagner or Akiko doesn't knock her off the Olympic podium altogether.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
...the quad to become to Miki what the triple axel is to Mao. Miki's not my favourite skater (not by a longshot), but I could see that just wrecking her chance for an Olympic medal.

Didn't she go for it in 2006, with disastrous results?

If anywhere, the GPF might be the best place to try it. If it causes her to bomb, then I bet she will go conservative at the Olys. Anyway, part of me thinks it simply all hype and game-talk.

If she wants to maximize her chances at an OGM it would to be solid (like at 2007 worlds) and put the pressure on Rochette and Kim, who could easily falter under Oly pressure, especially if they must skate after a perfect program.
 

herro

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 17, 2009
Hey, if she wants to do it, let her do it. But other than that, I feel nothing special when I think about Miki doing a quad. She's done it before and it's something that she says every season but never actually happens in competition.

Personally, I don't think it's worth the risk because it's not like the quad will be the element that will allow her to beat Kim or Rochette. But hey, if she can land it consistently, why not, right?
 
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