Plushenko & other Russians comment on the Men's Event | Page 9 | Golden Skate

Plushenko & other Russians comment on the Men's Event

museksk8r

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 31, 2006
Country
United-States
5) I think the kicker truly is that Lysacek isn't the complete skater we want. The N. American media is trying desperately to portray it as a battle between quality vs the quad, and while they have a true member of the latter category, they don't the former. And that's an issue. The fact is, Evan doesn't have the musicality, choreography, or the pure skating skills of a clean Takahashi, Lambiel or Chan (yes, I said Chan). You notice how many people praise his work ethic above all else? It's almost a backhanded compliment at this point (no, he doesn't have the pure natural talent of some of the best, but he's worked so much harder to get to where he is now). But he clearly has a strong work ethic, drive to be the best, and a great team who worked to help him win gold. Is it a victory I love? Nope - watching the youtube videos of Yagudin and Kulik makes me wish I had a stronger understanding of figure skating then so I could cherish their victories more. Do I wish that Lambiel/Takahashi/Chan/Abbott/Verner/Oda etc had skated better and perhaps podiumed like they have the talent for (in Takahashi's case, outright victory)? Yep. My nightmare podium was Plushenko-Joubert-Lysacek, so this really isn't that much better, but I'll take it.

Thank you! I would also add Abbott and Kozuka to the skaters that I have bolded in your quote. Evan's skating is too robotic to ever be honestly thought of as well-balanced and artistic. Sadly, every American media commentator is neglecting that fact.
 
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Alatariel

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 15, 2010
3)... but the quad. Oy vey, the quad. The impression I've been getting from you, from Alatriel, from watchvancouver, is that there's only one way to be come a memorable men's champion, and that's the quad. Doesn't matter what you're lacking (see your "flip or no flip" comment), as long as you have the quad, that's the true road to a masculine championship and not to being a "talentless drone." (Note: no one competing in the Olympic Games is a talentless drone, and you make yourself look stupid, Alatriel, by suggesting otherwise). The quad should probably be worth more, but the unearned bonus you get in terms of higher PCS more than compensates for it.

4) Doesn't quality itself matter? Plushenko didn't have his best jumps in the free program. He didn't have the best jumps period. Should he get bonus points for essentially landing upright despite the fight (which indicates that the jumps themselves aren't the highest quality?

It's obvious you can read so the only thing remaining is that you pick and chose what you want from it and spin it to fit your own agenda.

I've repeatedly said two things - the person I most loved on the night was Dai. He went at it with the spirit of a true Olympic champion knowing that it's a huge risk to take. He didn't make it but he went for it. He was the person I rooted for the most on the night and though he could have won easily if he skated a clean program without the quad - huge respect for the man, huge. Second, Plushenko, regardless of the whole Evan issue, lost it on his own because he missed out on the second landed quad - why I have no idea, though my personal opinion is that he is getting old and simply can't do them.

The reason I call Evan a talentless drone and the reason why I am up in arms for the quad is simple - when the other side exaggerates I will have some fun and exaggerate as well. Lysacek is not a great talent, he is though a hard worker who pushed himself up due to it and also had the luck of skating at the time he did. He still made the best of what he had and that's brill of him. On the other hand, the whole Eurostrash, villain, commie etc nonsense is fine for some people so I am going to call Lysacek a talentless drone as long as the other is ok too. It's just tit for tat, nothing more.

Two things - I'd love a quote where I said that a quad is the be all end all. I do hold the view of it being a necessity in today's skating and I hold the view that it should be marked higher than it is. Those who take risks and pull it off should be rewarded. I remember someone doing a calculation here over what a skater would get with a highly difficult combo and other jumps and with a 'standard' set of jumps if combined properly but one more - almost equal. No reward at all. That is bull.

Second, another reason why I call Lysacek as I do is something I've written oh about a dozen times - he is not the all round skater everyone is touting him to be. No, this is not a valid argument at all and again, as long as people use this nonsense as an argument, without bothering to address the facts once pointed out to them, then the only thing that remains is to have a bit of fun by pulling their chain. It's no use trying to explain your point when people don't want to read what you have actually written ... so since this is the internetz and I like being in a good mood and do not take this seriously ... the drone ah, the drone.
 

Sk8n Mama

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 23, 2004
because figure skating is a sport, not a show

Really? Is that what he believes? Is that why he did all the silly pose striking in front of the judges? If anyone tried to turn it into a 'show' it was Plushenko. It's not a "show", either, it's where art meets sport & sport does not just mean jumps.

I'm so tired of hearing what the Russian Federation has to say about it, and bringing up Salt Lake just irritates me even more. Apparently the Russians believe that, if the Russian doesn't win, it was unfair. How many times have we, in North America, watched a Russian win and truly think it was unfair? How many times in the ice dance? I hope Scott and Tessa win the ice dance now so it can be just more sour grapes and 'they only won because they're Canadian.' IMO, the Russian have only won because they were Russian many times. And, no, Evan was not gifted; he knows how to read and, apparently, Plushenko cannot.

Lysacek is not a great talent,

I am shockingly going to somewhat agree with something you're saying and I do get your point about Evan: he has some poor jumping technique, I find his footwork choppy and his arm movements jerky. But he won because he maximized every point he could get according to CoP, and was the only contender to have the skate of his life. And I get upset about the whole aftermath because, though I do not care for Evan as a skater, I feel he won fair and square and all this controversy robs him of a tiny bit of his victory, and he doesn't deserve that.
 
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janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
Evan's skating is too robotic to ever be honestly thought of as well-balanced and artistic. Sadly, every American media commentator is neglecting that fact.

That is just your opinion and your taste which you and others are entitled too.

As an example, I would agree with comments here that Evan just uses the music without really being musical.
OK, that is an opinion and I can see how some feel that way.

Here is another opinion. For long portions of his program Plushy completely ignores the music and just skates like it is not even there.

I prefer Evan atleast using the music too a skater who completely disregards it for such long stretches.

This was noticed by ISU judges who used Plushy's Torino LP to demonstrate a skater not only without transitions but also to clearly show skating with a complete disconnect from the music.

The biggest irony of this is not whether Evan or Plushy won - but Mishin and Plushy's remarks that Evan is a retro skater and Plushy's skating is somehow futuristic.

Sorry - but that is laughable. No skater in Men's event is more retro in style than Plushy. Even Johnny, showing great artistry has a much CoP friendlier program than Plushy.

Please, we are not blind and we know what we saw.
Plushy was pretty good - but not great. His program showed a lack of understanding CoP and the truth is that it was terribly outdated. It was frontloaded, lacked transitions, and had some old fashioned spins and footwork.

Plushy skated to a Tango - but like Evan he used the music rather than interpreted it.

In no way did Plushy take skating forward. His almost pure 6.0 style represented the past.
Since he was overmarked on the pcs he could have won with his 6.0 skating if he had executed his jumps better, or done anything in the last minute. He did not show a full set of triples either and one quad is not the future. Three quads were done in 2002.


I suspect maybe Plushy did the best he could do although I think he jumped better at Euros. I don't know if Plushy can land big jumps in the second half of a program or if he really can match Evan or Dai on other elements.

His comeback was amazing and maybe sooner or later he will realize it and accept that under CoP he finished 2nd.
 

nastasi1212

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 19, 2010
PLushu was first under CoP in 2006 with personal best! Why do you have such short memory??

All NA people and media pushed Abbott for favourite and claimed Lysacek was a talentless skater, and all of a sudden he became the one and only all-rounded skater?

Forums were full of people bashing Lysacek and suddenly he is everyone's favourite...
This is very hypocritical...
 
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oxade21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 24, 2004
plushu was first under cop in 2006 with personal best! Why do you have such short memory??

All na people and media pushed abbott for favourite and claimed lysacek was a talentless skater, and all of a sudden he became the one and only all-rounded skater?

Forums were full of people bashing lysacek and suddenly he is everyone's favourite...
This is very hypocritical...

ita!
 

BigJohn

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Host: Thank you for honoring us with your presence in this interview, Mr. Plushenko.

Plushenko: I agree that it is a great honor for you.

H: Mr. Plushenko, you surprised everyone by deciding to take on professional boxing. Why did you do that again?

P: The sport I used to do before, there is not enough competition in it. It's not men figure skating, it is woman skating.

H: So you've beaten by a woman in your last Olympics?

P: No it was a man but he did not do the most difficult jump. The quad. I did it.

H: I had no idea figure skating is judged only on one jump.

P: No, you have two programs, you jump many different jump, spins, you dance, you entertain.

H: So how do you know who wins?

P: Judges decide who wins.

H: How do they do that?

P: They look and give points. Quad is worth most points. I did the quad.

H: And yet you did not win. Why is that?

P: Rules don't give enough points for quad.

H: May I see those rules (host being handed rule book, flips through it) Well there appears to be in here many other way to get points. Other jumps, spins, transitions, choreography... Your last Olympics, did you do well in those elements?

P: Not necessary, I did quad.

H: But there is more to the sport than that, it is right there in the rules...

P: I DID QUAD

H: OK...Back to tonight's fight. You started the night standing still, then did some flailing with your arms, blew kisses to the judges, did an impressive quad and then got knocked out by the first punch. What have you learned from this loss?

P: Loss? What you mean? I won the fight.

H: No, you have lost, unable to finish the fight, you lost.

P: Did the other guy do the quad?

H: Let's ask him, he's right beside you. Mr. Klitschko, did you do the quad?

K: What? No...

P: Haha!!! See, he did not do quad. He not real champion. It's like woman boxing. I did quad, I won the fight.

K: Did you just call me a woman?

P: No quad, it's like ice dancing! I did quad. You dance like a woma.. (K knocks out P in one punch.)

H: Well that was a nice punch. Mr. Klitschko, you have won a second time.

(Klitschko blows kisses to the host)

(the end)

Pure insult to a great athlete!

(I added the quote because I love the ! at the end.)
 
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Sk8n Mama

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 23, 2004
Host: Thank you for honoring us with your presence in this interview, Mr. Plushenko.

Plushenko: I agree that it is a great honor for you.

H: Mr. Plushenko, you surprised everyone by deciding to take on professional boxing. Why did you do that again?

P: The sport I used to do before, there is not enough competition in it. It's not men figure skating, it is woman skating.

H: So you've beaten by a woman in your last Olympics?

P: No it was a man but he did not do the most difficult jump. The quad. I did it.

H: I had no idea figure skating is judged only on one jump.

P: No, you have two programs, you jump many different jump, spins, you dance, you entertain.

H: So how do you know who wins?

P: Judges decide who wins.

H: How do they do that?

P: They look and give points. Quad is worth most points. I did the quad.

H: And yet you did not win. Why is that?

P: Rules don't give enough points for quad.

H: May I see those rules (host being handed rule book, flips through it) Well there appears to be in here many other way to get points. Other jumps, spins, transitions, choreography... Your last Olympics, did you do well in those elements.

P: Not necessary, I did quad.

H: But there is more to the sport than that, it is right there in the rules...

P: I DID QUAD

H: OK...Back to tonight's fight. You started the night standing still, then did some flailing with your arms, blew kisses to the judges, did an impressive quad and then got knocked out by the first punch. What have you learned from this loss?

P: Loss? What you mean? I won the fight.

H: No, you have lost, unable to finish the fight, you lost.

P: Did the other guy do the quad?

H: Let's ask him, he's right beside you. Mr. Klitschko, did you do the quad?

K: What? No...

P: Haha!!! See, he did not do quad. He not real champion. It's like woman boxing. I did quad, I won the fight.

K: Did you just call me a woman?

P: No quad, it's like ice dancing! I did quad. You dance like a woma.. (K punches P in one punch. P knocked out)

H: Well that was a nice punch. Mr. Klitschko, you have won a second time.

(Klitschko blows kisses to the host)

(the end)

:rofl::rofl::rofl:Whew. My sides hurt.
 

gfskater

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 4, 2009
Host: Thank you for honoring us with your presence in this interview, Mr. Plushenko.

Plushenko: I agree that it is a great honor for you.

H: Mr. Plushenko, you surprised everyone by deciding to take on professional boxing. Why did you do that again?

P: The sport I used to do before, there is not enough competition in it. It's not men figure skating, it is woman skating.

H: So you've beaten by a woman in your last Olympics?

P: No it was a man but he did not do the most difficult jump. The quad. I did it.

H: I had no idea figure skating is judged only on one jump.

P: No, you have two programs, you jump many different jump, spins, you dance, you entertain.

H: So how do you know who wins?

P: Judges decide who wins.

H: How do they do that?

P: They look and give points. Quad is worth most points. I did the quad.

H: And yet you did not win. Why is that?

P: Rules don't give enough points for quad.

H: May I see those rules (host being handed rule book, flips through it) Well there appears to be in here many other way to get points. Other jumps, spins, transitions, choreography... Your last Olympics, did you do well in those elements.

P: Not necessary, I did quad.

H: But there is more to the sport than that, it is right there in the rules...

P: I DID QUAD

H: OK...Back to tonight's fight. You started the night standing still, then did some flailing with your arms, blew kisses to the judges, did an impressive quad and then got knocked out by the first punch. What have you learned from this loss?

P: Loss? What you mean? I won the fight.

H: No, you have lost, unable to finish the fight, you lost.

P: Did the other guy do the quad?

H: Let's ask him, he's right beside you. Mr. Klitschko, did you do the quad?

K: What? No...

P: Haha!!! See, he did not do quad. He not real champion. It's like woman boxing. I did quad, I won the fight.

K: Did you just call me a woman?

P: No quad, it's like ice dancing! I did quad. You dance like a woma.. (K punches P in one punch. P knocked out)

H: Well that was a nice punch. Mr. Klitschko, you have won a second time.

(Klitschko blows kisses to the host)

(the end)

You forgot one part:

H: In the 2006 Olympics you won the gold.

P: Yes, I did Quad

H: Did the other guy.

P: Well, uh, um, yea that Buttle guy, he did 2 quads.

H: And you did one and you beat him.

P: Yea I won gold but my other jumps and skills were better.

H I see, now I understand, makes perfect sense
 
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nastasi1212

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 19, 2010
Host: Thank you for honoring us with your presence in this interview, Mr. Plushenko.

Plushenko: I agree that it is a great honor for you.

H: Mr. Plushenko, you surprised everyone by deciding to take on professional boxing. Why did you do that again?

P: The sport I used to do before, there is not enough competition in it. It's not men figure skating, it is woman skating.

H: So you've beaten by a woman in your last Olympics?

P: No it was a man but he did not do the most difficult jump. The quad. I did it.

H: I had no idea figure skating is judged only on one jump.

P: No, you have two programs, you jump many different jump, spins, you dance, you entertain.

H: So how do you know who wins?

P: Judges decide who wins.

H: How do they do that?

P: They look and give points. Quad is worth most points. I did the quad.

H: And yet you did not win. Why is that?

P: Rules don't give enough points for quad.

H: May I see those rules (host being handed rule book, flips through it) Well there appears to be in here many other way to get points. Other jumps, spins, transitions, choreography... Your last Olympics, did you do well in those elements?

P: Not necessary, I did quad.

H: But there is more to the sport than that, it is right there in the rules...

P: I DID QUAD

H: OK...Back to tonight's fight. You started the night standing still, then did some flailing with your arms, blew kisses to the judges, did an impressive quad and then got knocked out by the first punch. What have you learned from this loss?

P: Loss? What you mean? I won the fight.

H: No, you have lost, unable to finish the fight, you lost.

P: Did the other guy do the quad?

H: Let's ask him, he's right beside you. Mr. Klitschko, did you do the quad?

K: What? No...

P: Haha!!! See, he did not do quad. He not real champion. It's like woman boxing. I did quad, I won the fight.

K: Did you just call me a woman?

P: No quad, it's like ice dancing! I did quad. You dance like a woma.. (K knocks out P in one punch.)

H: Well that was a nice punch. Mr. Klitschko, you have won a second time.

(Klitschko blows kisses to the host)

(the end)

With this tasteless post, IMHO you are discrediting a great champion and of course yourself as a figure skating fan.
WHatever you say you can not persuade us that Evan, the utterly ungraceful skater, has better artistry than Evgeni or that Evgeni is only about the quad.
I feel sorry for you.
 

jennylovskt

Medalist
Joined
Oct 20, 2006
Host: Thank you for honoring us with your presence in this interview, Mr. Plushenko.

Plushenko: I agree that it is a great honor for you.

H: Mr. Plushenko, you surprised everyone by deciding to take on professional boxing. Why did you do that again?

P: The sport I used to do before, there is not enough competition in it. It's not men figure skating, it is woman skating.

H: So you've beaten by a woman in your last Olympics?

P: No it was a man but he did not do the most difficult jump. The quad. I did it.

H: I had no idea figure skating is judged only on one jump.

P: No, you have two programs, you jump many different jump, spins, you dance, you entertain.

H: So how do you know who wins?

P: Judges decide who wins.

H: How do they do that?

P: They look and give points. Quad is worth most points. I did the quad.

H: And yet you did not win. Why is that?

P: Rules don't give enough points for quad.

H: May I see those rules (host being handed rule book, flips through it) Well there appears to be in here many other way to get points. Other jumps, spins, transitions, choreography... Your last Olympics, did you do well in those elements?

P: Not necessary, I did quad.

H: But there is more to the sport than that, it is right there in the rules...

P: I DID QUAD

H: OK...Back to tonight's fight. You started the night standing still, then did some flailing with your arms, blew kisses to the judges, did an impressive quad and then got knocked out by the first punch. What have you learned from this loss?

P: Loss? What you mean? I won the fight.

H: No, you have lost, unable to finish the fight, you lost.

P: Did the other guy do the quad?

H: Let's ask him, he's right beside you. Mr. Klitschko, did you do the quad?

K: What? No...

P: Haha!!! See, he did not do quad. He not real champion. It's like woman boxing. I did quad, I won the fight.

K: Did you just call me a woman?

P: No quad, it's like ice dancing! I did quad. You dance like a woma.. (K knocks out P in one punch.)

H: Well that was a nice punch. Mr. Klitschko, you have won a second time.

(Klitschko blows kisses to the host)

(the end)

Pure insult to a great athlete!

You forgot one part:

H: In the 2006 Olympics you won the gold.

P: Yes, I did Quad

H: Did the other guy.

P: Well, uh, um, yea that Buttle guy, he did 2 quads.

H: And you did one and you beat him.

P: Yea I won gold but my other jumps and skills were better.

H I see, now I understand, makes perfect sense

Go and get your fact straight before you say anything! Your post was the same as the above one.
 

nastasi1212

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 19, 2010
Plushenko is not only about the quad.
He has charisma, command on ice dynamic presence
excellent footwork,
good (not the best) spins,
and overall suberb skating skills
not to mention a to die for jumping ability
and a unique ability to save all the jumps
that's it whether you like it or not
and dont forget
3 time world champion
6 time european champion
1 olympic champion
2 silver medallist in olympics
countless other titles and medals
you should be ashamed, but i guess jealousy is a bad feeling
 

BigJohn

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Plushenko is not only about the quad.
He has charisma, command on ice dynamic presence
excellent footwork,
good (not the best) spins,
and overall suberb skating skills
not to mention a to die for jumping ability
and a unique ability to save all the jumps
that's it whether you like it or not
and dont forget
3 time world champion
6 time european champion
1 olympic champion
2 silver medallist in olympics
countless other titles and medals
you should be ashamed, but i guess jealousy is a bad feeling

After these Olympics, he's also about being a sore loser who skated badly to a badly conceived program and yet was awarded silver anyway.
 

aftertherain

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 15, 2010
i have merged all threads commenting on interviews by russian skaters or officials on the men's event into this thread. This was done because the discussion had split into 4 or 5 different threads, making the board too fragmented. Doris p

thank you.
 

kiz_4Ever

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 24, 2009
After these Olympics, he's also about being a sore loser who skated badly to a badly conceived program and yet was awarded silver anyway.

you cannot deny all his other achievements... wouldn't have been the rivalry between him and yagudin, what would have been fs?

and then, it's not that he clearly lost for let's say about 10 points...he lost for only 1.31 points, it means that a + on some of his jumps (both in SP, when they're way better, or in LP) would have made the difference.
evan didn't clearly dominate the field, otherwise we wouldn't be speaking about it so much...evan did a good CoP program, and won the OGM because he had a more strategic program. evgeni had a less CoP friendly program, but did an amazing jump layout and also sufficiently good other elements. the difference was not so clear since before plushenko's results were announced nobody was really sure of who's gonna be the winner.

compliments to the new OGM, but compliments also to the silver medallist for giving a strong comeback and to both for the great fight! ;)
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
I firmly believe so

Essentially what you're saying is because he's used to getting his way (ie: winning) his juvenile behaviour when he doesn't (ie: loses) is justified. That's behaviour you try to curb in a four year old. He won silver. He acted out because it wasn't gold. You can argue that the system sucks for working against such a strong athlete (and I don't deny that he's an incredible athlete - but I prefer Shen/Zhao if we're talking about three-peaters, Yagudin if we're talking about awesome figure skaters, and Takahashi/Lambiel/Chan et al if we're talking current figure skaters). You can't argue that someone who's lost to Emmanuel Sandhu on a technicality (GPF in 2003/4?) doesn't know how to act when the chips don't go his way. It doesn't compute.

His behaviour isn't becoming an Olympian, let alone one who has scaled the heights of his/her sport.
 
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