Ashley Wagner

R.D. said:

One must understand that I'm not making excuses for Wagner. Yes, in many ways she contributed to the loss of that 3rd spot by being on that ill-fated 2008 team (and doing so poorly). But same for Meissner and Liang, both which disappeared promptly afterward.

It's always somewhat remarkable to me that the skater that ends up doing poorly tends to end up getting what's coming to her. May sound harsh, but consider that Wagner just missed the Oly team- after being 16th at 2008 worlds and losing that 3rd spot in the first place. Last year, Nagasu nearly singlehandedly fails to get the 3rd spot back by making silly mistakes in her free...and here she goes, 3rd place at next year's nats and off the team. Not to mention Czisny doing so poorly at 2010 Nats...man.

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Uh yeah.... I guess the fates missed Rachael Flatt, who also skated even more poorly than Mirai in 2010 and should have shouldered more of the burden as the national champion and the lady who finished 5th at the previous worlds.

If karma had really wanted to give everyone "what's coming to her" maybe Agnes and Christina should have gone to worlds.

I'm hoping beyond hope that Rachel delivers with another top 5 showing at Worlds since, as everyone has pointed out, she has been the one to escape the s**t-storm that has happened in US ladies skating over the past few seasons.

I hope Czisny medals at Worlds so Flatt does not have to place that high to help the U.S retain 3 spots. I dont have alot of confidence in Flatt doing well this year, but she probably wont totally bomb so should be top ten probably, so if Czisny can get even a bronze atleast that should do it.

Layfan said:

what does it mean when you say "sooner." Does that mean sooner in the music/program or sooner while she's getting into the jump?

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I mean if you were to count the entry (1-2-3-turn-1-2-3-pick), the ones that are two footed are 1-2-3-turn-1-2-pick (as an example if you were to count her timing.

pangtongfan said:

I hope Czisny medals at Worlds so Flatt does not have to place that high to help the U.S retain 3 spots. I dont have alot of confidence in Flatt doing well this year, but she probably wont totally bomb so should be top ten probably, so if Czisny can get even a bronze atleast that should do it.

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I will be shocked if Alissa beats her Worlds phobia enough to deliver a bronze, but I think it's very possible for her and Rachael to pull off a 5-7 or 6-7 finish (not sure which is likelier to end up higher) and get the third spot back, in fact I'll be surprised if that doesn't come off. Both will go in with higher rep among the judges than before - Alissa for her strong year and Rachael for her new SP. All they have to do is skate.

Don't hold your breath for Czisny

R.D. said:

Don't hold your breath for Czisny

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I am always nervous when I watch Alissa skate. Ironically, when I watch Mirai skate, I am relaxed and full of confidence ;-)

BackStage Barbie said:

Please don't take this the wrong way because I love Ashley and I don't think that any one person is responsible for losing and failing to regain the third ladies spot. However, the last year the US had 3 ladies slots at Worlds was 2008. Meissner finished 7th, Liang finished 10th, and Ashley Wagner finished 16th. It was a combination of all three of these poor finishes that lost us a third spot, but had Ashley (or Bebe) finished 6th or higher, we would have had 3 spots for 2009, and possibly for the 2010 Olympics. Again, I'm not blaming the loss of the 3rd Olympic slot on Ashley, but I am saying that every top US lady over the past 4 years has had a hand in either losing or failing to secure that third spot. Therefore I don't think it is particularly constructive to say what may have been if we could've should've would've had the third slot. I hope and pray that our ladies place high enough to secure a third spot this year, but I'm of the mindset that when our ladies can prove to international judges that they deserve the third slot, they'll get it back.

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It shouldn't have been put on Ashley's shoulders to have had a top 6 finish at Worlds in 2008. She was only 16 and had no experience compared to the other US ladies. The veteran skaters should have been the ones to secure that 3rd slot not Ashley. That was asking to much of her at the time.

Spun Silver said:

I will be shocked if Alissa beats her Worlds phobia enough to deliver a bronze, but I think it's very possible for her and Rachael to pull off a 5-7 or 6-7 finish (not sure which is likelier to end up higher) and get the third spot back, in fact I'll be surprised if that doesn't come off. Both will go in with higher rep among the judges than before - Alissa for her strong year and Rachael for her new SP. All they have to do is skate.

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I agree with this. I don't think Alissa bombs at Worlds but I think she doesn't medal, I'm thinking she finishes in the 4th-6th range. I know she's improved her headcase ways, but we saw what happened to Kiira and Tomas (both "reformed" former headcases) at Euros - they both were favored to win and had a great shot to do so when no one else was that great, but then they skated, and they didn't bomb, but did make some sizable mistakes and both ended up 3rd. In previous seasons, they probably both would have totally bombed and ended up OTP, but they fought through their free programs at Euros and hung on.

So I see Alissa situation at Worlds similar, she's not a favorite to win gold but she is definitely a favorite to win a medal, so I think the pressure will get to her a little bit. I'd be shocked if she ended up out of the top 10, but I think she probably will be off the podium, but still end up with a pretty good placement because of PCS and the fact that she's better at fighting through a program now.

That's how I see it with all the new and improved headcases. The nerves still affect Alissa, and her jump technique isn't that good that she can just go on autopilot, but she can at least fight and compete now. It's harder when you really want something though - example Kiira and Tomas at Europeans, you could tell they both really wanted to win after having such good GP results, but then they were feeling really off during the FS, and before it would have been a disaster, and now they've made enough progress to prevent the disaster from happening, but the nerves clearly prevented them from skating up to their potential and winning the gold. Same thing happened to Mirai at Worlds last year when she had a good shot to win, she didn't have a complete meltdown in the FS, but made enough mistakes to keep her OTP. Alissa will be safely in the top 10 I am very confident, but not as confident about her getting a medal. Of course it could happen, but idk.

Jammers said:

It shouldn't have been put on Ashley's shoulders to have had a top 6 finish at Worlds in 2008. She was only 16 and had no experience compared to the other US ladies. The veteran skaters should have been the ones to secure that 3rd slot not Ashley. That was asking to much of her at the time.

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If Ashley wants to be considered as a top tier US lady, she should shoulder this expectation.

Perhaps less vlogging and more training is in order?

Jammers said:

It shouldn't have been put on Ashley's shoulders to have had a top 6 finish at Worlds in 2008. She was only 16 and had no experience compared to the other US ladies. The veteran skaters should have been the ones to secure that 3rd slot not Ashley. That was asking to much of her at the time.

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Meissner was the only veteran on that 2008 team. Her teammates were Liang and Wagner- both first-timers on the world stage. So if we had to put it on anyone's shoulders...it was Meissner's. BUT- it was well-known that she was on a downward spiral of epic proportions starting with TEB '07, then falling 3 times at the GPF...only to repeat the feat at Nationals and STILL make the world team because the ones who actually deserved to go were too young.

When one thinks about it, Meissner was really the only one of that team capable of a top 5 finish. Wagner had potential, and yes, she blew it by bombing so hard. I say the only one that met/exceeded expectations was Liang for cracking top 10. Still, that would have required Meissner and/or Wagner to medal, and I think a medal was too much to ask of either skater given the circumstances.

Bottom line: we were screwed whichever way you cut it.

Perhaps less vlogging and more training is in order?

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Huh?? We went nearly the ENTIRE season without a single vlog from her- hell, she never even updated her twitter account- so immediately I shoot down the idea that that notion had anything to do with it.

Vlogging takes about 10 minutes to record the video, and maybe another 20 minutes to upload it, so this is about 30 minutes. She has done about 8 vlogs this season, so that is 4 hours in about 6 months. Not a lot of time.