What do you want to see at Worlds for the Men? | Page 2 | Golden Skate

What do you want to see at Worlds for the Men?

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Ah, but I wish to be able to see an interviewer tell Chan that he really needs a Biellmann to win ;) And that won't happen if he is better than 6th. So he needs a lot of falls and every one else to skate great.

OTOH, it is perhaps a bit churlish of me...but he's young and has time. This is about it for Verner, Joubert, Dai & Ryan, so I definitely want them all to go out on their best efforts.

You wished on your list that Patrick Chan fell four times.... yeah, I think churlish covers it. Then again, my list is a little churlish too, so might as well post it.

Gold: Patrick Chan
WHY: Because I think his growth this season has been nothing short of phenomenal and maybe even unprecedented. Because I think to lose he would need an actively mediocre skate (or worse) and I don’t want to see that after all the hype. And here’s the thing: I still revisit the Nationals thread to relive the collective excitement of what he demonstrated in Victoria. I'll rewatch that program as long as I'm interested in the sport.
WHAT NEXT YEAR: SP to Led Zeppelin’s “Moby Dick” (I need to see footwork set to that monster drum solo); LP to “Jupiter: Bringer of Jollity”

Silver: Takahiko Kozuka
WHY: Because while the narrative this season has been the old vs the new (Verner vs. Brezina; Joubert vs Amodio), he’s often been the forgotten one from his nation. I love his range and even if I don’t love his programs this year, I’m noticing improvement in terms of his ice command and performance skills.
WHAT NEXT YEAR: SP to “George’s Waltz” from A Single Man; LP to music from “2046”

Bronze: Daisuke Takahashi
WHY: I entered this season wanting him to win, but he hasn’t quite brought it this year. Plus he doesn’t have a bronze medal from worlds, and I’m big on complete sets (seriously).
WHAT NEXT YEAR: Team up with Stephane Lambiel and create a skating spectacular. Choreograph for other skaters.

Fourth: Nobunari Oda
WHY: Despite his many lovely qualities, his LP is a bore. But he’s at home, so I want him to do well.
WHAT NEXT YEAR: ...learn how to count. A 4-3-3 in competition.

Fifth: Brian Joubert
WHY: Because there’s something really intriguing about his desire to reinvent himself ten years into his senior career. Because I want the passing of the baton to occur next year.
WHAT NEXT YEAR: Comfort zone. 2012 looks like it’ll be your retirement and doing what made you popular is a fine way to go out.

Sixth: Florent Amodio
WHY: He’s a superstar in the making, but I don’t particularly love the direction he went this season with the MJ program (even though it is an entertaining one). Sixth would be a good result and set him on his way to Nice.
WHAT NEXT YEAR: Something a little more lyrical (he can pull it off) and skating-skills-y.

Seventh: Tomas Verner
WHY: You know, he as an enjoyable short but I’m surprised at just how nonplussed I am regarding his LP. I don’t love him a lot either.
WHAT NEXT YEAR: Eh, either way. I don’t know how much longer he’s planning to skate for, but two GP medals and another Euros spot seems like as good a way to head out as any.

Eighth: Michel Brezina
WHY: The injury was such a huge set-back. I think he might be a more talented jumper than Amodio but it’s a shame he wasn’t really able to demonstrate that.
WHAT NEXT YEAR: A quad in both programs. More artistry in general

Ninth: Shawn Sawyer
WHY: I think “Assassin’s Tango” and “Alice in Wonderland” are wonderful programs that if he hits could/should place him in the top ten. It would be such a fantastic ending triumph for him to have a great Worlds experience to follow his stunning Nationals performance
WHAT NEXT YEAR: Join Dai and Takahashi in their Skating Spectacular. You could take over the world

Tenth: Javier Fernandez
WHY: Because it’ll assure Spain two spots for next season and one of the way figure skating grows in non-dominant nations is by having the opportunity to compete at the highest stage. Because he deserves a good result after being set back by injuries. Because I was hoping for the European next generation (Amodio, Brezina, Fernandez, Gachinsky) to have their epic battle royale.
WHAT NEXT YEAR: No Morozov choreography.

And....
  • For the American Men to go down to one spot: This sounds mean and I don’t wish anyone ill will (though I really really don’t care for Bradley’s skating.) but I’m VERY curious if there would be a change in how the selection works. Going down to two isn’t good enough to check. And honestly, I’m not really impressed with Miner or Dornbush to not hope that you know, fifteen skaters don’t beat them. I would be totally fine with the aforementioned ten plus Russell, Contesti, D. Ten, KVDP, Gachinsky, Schlutheiss et al beat Bradley, Dornbush and Miner (presuming they deserved to, of course).
  • For Kevin van der Perren to have a skate that makes his as happy as he was after his Euros SP. His excited expressions are really adorable. Plus I’m surprised he didn’t dislocate his shoulder.
  • A happy Schlutheiss 
 

MrScroogeMcDuck

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
I hope Bradley does extremely well. And, unlike the poster above me, I certainly don't want the American men to go down to one spot. Pfft.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
For the American Men to go down to one spot: This sounds mean and I don’t wish anyone ill will (though I really really don’t care for Bradley’s skating.) but I’m VERY curious if there would be a change in how the selection works.

I, too, don't wish anyone any bad luck, but I agree that this would provide an interesting scenario. I am, however, quite sure that the USFSA would not consider making any changes in the selection process even if all three of their guys finished last.

Stuff happens, ice is slippery, we'll get 'em next time, onward and upward! The next year they would wrap the U.S. champ up in the flag and ship him off to worlds to do his best.

For Kevin van der Perren to have a skate that makes (him happy).

:rock:
 
Joined
Mar 14, 2006
whole post esp.

[*]Daisuke to dance his socks off [...]
and

[*]Nobu NOT to jump too many combos!

[*]All young skaters to show us that they are the future of figure skating;

[*]All experienced skaters to go home believing they are not finished yet and determine to continue for another year;

[*]All skaters to have clean skate and wonderful time, and enjoy Japanese spring (which I miss!)
[/LIST]
What a lovely post.

And Layfan, I feel exactly the same way about Brian.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
And....
  • For the American Men to go down to one spot: This sounds mean and I don’t wish anyone ill will (though I really really don’t care for Bradley’s skating.) but I’m VERY curious if there would be a change in how the selection works. Going down to two isn’t good enough to check. And honestly, I’m not really impressed with Miner or Dornbush to not hope that you know, fifteen skaters don’t beat them. I would be totally fine with the aforementioned ten plus Russell, Contesti, D. Ten, KVDP, Gachinsky, Schlutheiss et al beat Bradley, Dornbush and Miner (presuming they deserved to, of course).


  • 1.) For the one spot to happen the following scenarios would have to happen from least likely to most likely.
    a. All three guys don't qualify for the LP. This is really unlikely. All three would have to miss all their jumps and botch a few spins in the process.
    b. two skaters miss the LP and the skater that does ends up finishing outside the top 10.
    c. One doesn't qualify, and the two remaining skaters end up finishing below 14th place.
    d. All three qualify for the LP, but all end up finishing below 14th place.

    Out of all those choices, I say C and D are the most likely scenarios, should such a scenario happens.

    But here's some things to consider.
    1.) Ryan Bradley, with an injured foot and a non-existent triple axel still managed to finish in 18th place.
    2.) Miner did not do well at the GP, but people forget that he was AT the GP. His eh-ish short program score will easily be enough to make the LP.
    3.) Dornbush, I think has the capacity to surprise. His season's best score from the JGPF is just outside the top 10 (11th) despite high scores at 4CC.

    Can they finish worse? Yes. Can they finish better, definitely Yes.


    Also IP, I don't understand why you're so about the USFSA changing their system when Skate Canada pretty much does the same thing. I mean in 2004 they left Buttle at home for a skater name Ben Ferreira. Granted Buttle was only 15th in Worlds the previous year, but he did have a successful GP series.

    But then again, I don't know the innerworkings of Skate Canada, so maybe there's something I don't know about.
 
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Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
I realized, I never gave my list:

1.) Takahashi -- Love the comeback he's been having since his sub-par GPF.

2.) Chan -- Think he's gotten all the falls out of his system and he's the only top skater who has done a quad consistently.

3.) Kozuka -- He is a great skater, and when he's on, he's on.


4.) Oda -- I'd like him to podium too and I love his 4-3 combo. So I guess those two are interchangeable.

5.) Amodio -- He's been pretty consistent all season. Not crazy about all the pelvic thrusts, but he's been great with the jumps and he made GPF and is Euros champion.

6.) Dornbush -- I think if any one can sneak to the final group, it's this guy. As I said before, he's 11th on the the SB's list, and three of the folks above him won't be at Worlds. Verner and Joubert will be his main competition, me thinks, but I think he has the skill and tech content to beat them.

7.) Verner -- That said, I do like the comeback story and he's had a good season -- Winning TEB, making the GPF and a bronze at Euros, not bad after that disaster of a year last year.

8.) Joubert -- He's had an up and down season, but he did finish with a silver at Euros. Plus I really like to see his LP clean! It's a winner.

9.) Bradley -- He tech content is very competitive and while his skating skills and speed is not as good as the top men, I think it's no worse than the likes of KDVP, Contesti and others. This placement will also keep 3 spots for the U.S.

10.) Schultheiss -- Like the others, I want him to be reminded why skating makes him happy.

11.) Sawyer - Love his Alice in Wonderland program. But I think season fatigue is getting to him.

12.) Miner -- If he skates like he did at Nationals, I can see him being in the second to last group.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
IP, I perhaps ought to amend my churlishness: I want either Patrick to skate perfectly (in which case he will of course win, and should win, despite the fact that he bores me to tears) or to fall four times. What I do not want is for him to fall 3 times and win. And based on the way the season has gone, he could fall 3 times and would win. So it has to be 4 times.

I have seen him skate a number of times at Liberty, and he doesn't knock my socks off. He impresses me, and his basic skating has many admirable qualities, but I would not pay to see him skate.
 

gmyers

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 6, 2010
I would like Gachinski to do well and place in the top 10 because the faster Russia has 2 spots the faster it can be on the track to have 3 spots for the 2014 Sochi Olympics. So like maybe this year Gachinksi could could get 2 spots and maybe in 2012 it could be Gachinski and Plushenko (fingers crossed!!!) then maybe they could get 3 and in 2013 it could be Gachinski, Plushenko, Dmitriev and hopefully 3 spots for Sochi!!
 

museksk8r

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 31, 2006
Country
United-States
6.) Dornbush -- I think if any one can sneak to the final group, it's this guy. As I said before, he's 11th on the the SB's list, and three of the folks above him won't be at Worlds. Verner and Joubert will be his main competition, me thinks, but I think he has the skill and tech content to beat them.

9.) Bradley -- He tech content is very competitive and while his skating skills and speed is not as good as the top men, I think it's no worse than the likes of KDVP, Contesti and others. This placement will also keep 3 spots for the U.S.

6 + 9 = 15 = 2 spots. 13 is the number to reach to get 3 spots.
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
IP, I perhaps ought to amend my churlishness: I want either Patrick to skate perfectly (in which case he will of course win, and should win, despite the fact that he bores me to tears) or to fall four times. What I do not want is for him to fall 3 times and win. And based on the way the season has gone, he could fall 3 times and would win. So it has to be 4 times.

I have seen him skate a number of times at Liberty, and he doesn't knock my socks off. He impresses me, and his basic skating has many admirable qualities, but I would not pay to see him skate.

If I recall, Liberty's the only place you've seen him skate, right? Has he ever done well at Liberty? Does he still bore you to tears when he skates like he does 4CC short 2009 or Nationals 2011 LP? I recall you saying you'd prefer to watch Bradley skate, which is fair enough but a gene I don't possess. So if Bradley beats Chan, I might swear off figure skating!

1.) For the one spot to happen the following scenarios would have to happen from least likely to most likely.
a. All three guys don't qualify for the LP. This is really unlikely. All three would have to miss all their jumps and botch a few spins in the process.
b. two skaters miss the LP and the skater that does ends up finishing outside the top 10.
c. One doesn't qualify, and the two remaining skaters end up finishing below 14th place.
d. All three qualify for the LP, but all end up finishing below 14th place.

Out of all those choices, I say C and D are the most likely scenarios, should such a scenario happens.

Agreed, though I think (like you) D is the most likely. But I've copped to it being unlikely. And I've admitted that if it doesn't cause a change in the way the USFSA handles things, then I'd pretend never to have wanted it and root for Dornbush and Miner to come 13th and 15th to get those two spots for the skaters left behind.

But here's some things to consider.
1.) Ryan Bradley, with an injured foot and a non-existent triple axel still managed to finish in 18th place.
2.) Miner did not do well at the GP, but people forget that he was AT the GP. His eh-ish short program score will easily be enough to make the LP.
3.) Dornbush, I think has the capacity to surprise. His season's best score from the JGPF is just outside the top 10 (11th) despite high scores at 4CC.

1. Bradley, when healthy finished in 15th place in 2007. Bradley now is undertrained, with no competitions this season and is an older man with the x-rays of an 80 year old (his quote, not mine).
2. Miner yes, was at the GP. If we take the skaters who skated his two events, and filter out those not at worlds, eight individuals beat him (Takahashi, Amodio, Sawyer, van der Perren, Contesti, Kozuka, Verner, Joubert)
3. Dornbush CAN definitely surprise. And hell, secretly, I'm glad they sent him to senior worlds as it allows Rogozine and Firus the chance to claim three spots at World Juniors for 2012 AND boosts Canada's chances at being top three nations, thus mazimizing JGP possibilities.

Can they finish worse? Yes. Can they finish better, definitely Yes.

Yes and yes.


Also IP, I don't understand why you're so about the USFSA changing their system when Skate Canada pretty much does the same thing. I mean in 2004 they left Buttle at home for a skater name Ben Ferreira. Granted Buttle was only 15th in Worlds the previous year, but he did have a successful GP series.

But then again, I don't know the innerworkings of Skate Canada, so maybe there's something I don't know about.

Nor do I. For all the accusations of mafia style corruption and political chicanery, I've always assumed the Skate Canada would exert more control over the process. If they are strict Nationalists (sorry), I'd like to see that change. The difference is that I don't see that making much difference. That you have to go back to 2004 is a pretty good statement that it doesn't.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
What I would like to see is Chan to skate like he did at Canadians and still lose to Takahashi who skates the performance of his life and gets a bit of home town boost (which negates some of what I call the automatic Chan boost in scores) and Chan then runs his mouth off like a spoiled brat like he did many times the last 2 years.
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Heh. Actually, what you really want is him to win w/ four or five falls, so you can keep complaining!:biggrin:
 
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bsfan

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 10, 2011
I would like Gachinski to do well and place in the top 10 because the faster Russia has 2 spots the faster it can be on the track to have 3 spots for the 2014 Sochi Olympics. So like maybe this year Gachinksi could could get 2 spots and maybe in 2012 it could be Gachinski and Plushenko (fingers crossed!!!) then maybe they could get 3 and in 2013 it could be Gachinski, Plushenko, Dmitriev and hopefully 3 spots for Sochi!!

This will be the best result.
 

emma

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 28, 2004
I've tried three times to respond to this thread - and every time I do, I get stuck or change my mind. I can't believe how many men will skate who I want to see do their very best AND if they do their very best could be a medalist or at least in the top five.

So, like always - the disclaimer - I want them all to skate their best and feel good about it.

That said: I have a real soft spot for some of the "older" guys who might be winding down or retiring as well as some of the guys that just don't seem to do in comps what we all know they can do and will definitely be rooting for all of them. This includes Dai who might be retiring from comps soon - and if he were to shine at home that would be so, so wonderful (and I'm an "uber" fan of his).

Of course, if Oda could land his jumps AND NOT do too many, that would be so cool. And, I'm such a huge fan of T. Kazuka that I simply cannot wait to see his skates and really hope he does well. So, I love the Japanese men and since it is in Japan - I will be totally rooting for them too.

If Chan could repeat his Can Nat LP - that would be cool beyond words (just the accomplishment of that), although then it messes with the first two groups of men I am rooting for - and then the list goes on (I will totally root for the "newbies" too)....

Basically, I don't know what to really wish for other than great skates and cannot wait!
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
6 + 9 = 15 = 2 spots. 13 is the number to reach to get 3 spots.

Opps, yeah I knew that. My math was fuzzy late in the night!

That said, I still wouldn't change my wish placements for either Dornbush (6th) or Bradley (9th), even if in my scenario it would mean losing a spot.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
Agreed, though I think (like you) D is the most likely. But I've copped to it being unlikely. And I've admitted that if it doesn't cause a change in the way the USFSA handles things, then I'd pretend never to have wanted it and root for Dornbush and Miner to come 13th and 15th to get those two spots for the skaters left behind.

1. Bradley, when healthy finished in 15th place in 2007. Bradley now is undertrained, with no competitions this season and is an older man with the x-rays of an 80 year old (his quote, not mine).
2. Miner yes, was at the GP. If we take the skaters who skated his two events, and filter out those not at worlds, eight individuals beat him (Takahashi, Amodio, Sawyer, van der Perren, Contesti, Kozuka, Verner, Joubert)
3. Dornbush CAN definitely surprise. And hell, secretly, I'm glad they sent him to senior worlds as it allows Rogozine and Firus the chance to claim three spots at World Juniors for 2012 AND boosts Canada's chances at being top three nations, thus mazimizing JGP possibilities.

1.) But IMO this Bradley, unlike the 2007 Bradley, this one has the Triple Axel that has plagued him throughout his career. And he has a quad, which is noteworthy considering that on Chan and a few of the European men have consistently done it. Granted the Triple Axels may go by the wayside when it comes for international competition, but there's something to be said about inner resolve, and I think Bradley has it this year.
2.) As others have established here as well as Miner, that was not his best performance. Consider this: Miner had not competed since the 2009 season. He had an injury in the 2009-2010 season that kept him from competing. It's a similar scenario to Daisuke last year. When you haven't competed for an entire season, it will be a rough road those first few competitions. (Actually you can apply Patrick Chan in this category as well as he came to Skate Canada off an injury). I think his Nationals performance is an indication of things to come rather than the fluke everyone is seeing it as.
3.) Well, glad that Canada gets some gain out of Dorbush's victory. :) That said the international judges clearly like this guy. When you have the 11th highest score from a junior competition, that fares well for your chances.
 
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