ISU Where Will Worlds BE (formerly) JAPAN QUAKE FOR WORLDS

Joesitz (RIP) · Mar 27, 2011

Olympia said:
I'm here for the music. Seriously, it's the amalgam of sport and art that makes skating so wonderful to me. The grace in skating is of an entirely different quality from the grace in a sport like half-pipe or the 110-meter hurdle. In addition to all that Mathman has brought up, here's another thought: what would be the reason to skate with graceful arm movements or extended limbs, or pointed toes, if there were no music and only the jumps, turns, and so on were being judged?

There are opinions including mine. When you cite the skating music for the best reason for appreciating skating, does it mean you do not go to concerts to hear complete musical creations? Surely you could attend. It may be that the music is not so important. It could be the interpretation that grabs you as Tara did (with her 3R x 3R.) OK to each his own.

By the way, the originator of skating to music, was Jackson Haines who used it as a non-competitive extravaganza. It was money that brought it to competitive sport. and we all bought it.

Also Check out the snap shots of other sports players in action. The amalgamate covers all dance movements especially in the arms.

The swoop across the ice for that one trick is pure skating. I still call it The Presentation portion of musical skating. Sorry, I just do not see it as comparable to great Dancers.

Olympia · Mar 27, 2011

I'd never presume to compare skaters to ballet dancers, Joe. But in answer to your thought about music, I am familiar with the complete classical works that skating adapts. I don't get to a lot of live concerts, alas (and for that I envy you), but I have a large collection of recordings of symphonic and chamber music and a few operas. I consider the musical adaptations done by choreographers a kind of riff on the original works, and they work for the context. I enjoy listening both to Michelle's "Song of the Black Swan" and to the Dvorak "Dumky" trio from which her piece originated. (And the Villa-Lobos piece that starts her program.) So to me this is not an issue.

And I certainly don't expect you to agree with me. Vive la difference!

Joesitz (RIP) · Mar 27, 2011

Olympia said:
And I certainly don't expect you to agree with me. Vive la difference!

Olympia - I truly apologize for the rash statement, and agree whole heartedly with you that we will differ between Artistic and Presentation.

janetfan · Mar 27, 2011

Bowling.

I like that bowling is a sport that that provides music even John Cage would be envious of.

I love the indescribable sound a bowling ball makes rolling down the lane.

And what about the sound a ball creates when it strikes the pins. :rock:

Part of the genius of bowling is that the better you roll the ball down the alley the more glorius a sound the ball makes when it strikes the pins.

Ever notice the artful way a strike sounds better than when you only knock down half the pins?

A sound I am all too familiar with is the hollow staccato-like sound heard from a 7-10 split. :disapp:

The fullness and rich symphonic texture we hear from a strike is clearyl evident for those with sophisticated and highly cultured ears.

Seems to me any sport that provides as many unique sounds as bowling ventures beyond mere sport into the realm of art. And not just everyday run of the mill art, I'm talking high art here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVyxRzH2HGw&feature=related

Thanking the gods for YouTube

Mathman · Mar 27, 2011

Hernando said:
Some fans might think "Bond Girl" was hip although I think it was "campy."

James Bond is camp. I thought the choreographer (David Wilson) nailed it..

Actually, I have to wonder what Yu-na herself made of the whole thing. She couldn't have "got it" to the same degree as, say, Bette Middler, voicing the title character in last year's cartoon feature The
Revenge of Kitty Galore. :laugh:

Mathman · Mar 27, 2011

I think we can all agree that figure skating is not as hoity-toity as opera and ballet. I think we can also agree that it is a little more hoity-toity than soccer and hockey. You pay your money and you take your choice. :yes:

About music in floor exercises for ladies gymnastics, that is an interesting comparison. As far as I can tell female gymnasts do not make any use of their music at all. They do a couple of cutsy-wootsy poses (cutsy-wootsy is not to be confused with hoity-toity

), then they get down to business and do their tumbling passes.

Is ladies figure skating in danger of becoming like that?

janetfan · Mar 27, 2011

Mathman said:
I think we can all agree that figure skating is not as hoity-toity as opera and ballet. I think we can also agree that it is a little more hoity-toity than soccer and hockey. You pay your money and you take your choice. :yes:

About music in floor exercises for ladies gymnastics, that is an interesting comparison. As far as I can tell female gymnasts do not make any use of their music at all. They do a couple of cutsy-wootsy poses (cutsy-wootsy is not to be confused with hoity-toity ), then they get down to business and do their tumbling passes.

Is ladies figure skating in danger of becoming like that?

No more than Men's skating

In fact many of the Ladies could take posing lessons from Joubert, Bradley and Plushenko.

dorispulaski · Mar 27, 2011

Hernando said:
No more than Men's skating
In fact many of the Ladies could take posing lessons from Joubert, Bradley and Plushenko.

Indeed they could

Violet Bliss · Mar 27, 2011

What is the appropriate adjective for male skaters' posing, Mathman?

Mathman · Mar 27, 2011

^ Studsy-wudsy.

Violet Bliss · Mar 27, 2011

^^^^

Don't forget Amodio the studsy-wudsy fledgling.

Olympia · Mar 27, 2011

Math, I hope you were laughing as hard when you wrote this as I was when I read it. I immediately had a mental image of Philippe Candeloro in one of his more out-there pro skates.

Seriously, though, I wonder if we could make the case for skating carrying an extra emotional power because of the way the skater interacts with the music. Of course all sport can be incredibly emotional! But musical interpretation (if it's done right; not all skaters hit this mark, of course) adds an emotional level to the skating program that goes beyond just the excitement of seeing a phenomenal jumping pass. I must confess that a gymnastics floor exercise rarely does that for me, largely because as Mathman says the gymnasts don't really make use of the music. (Face it: we think skating programs are restrictive because of their requirements, but gymnastics programs are ten times more demanding. There's no way a gymnast could use a piece such as Gershwin's Piano Concerto in F for a floor exercise.)

heyang · Mar 27, 2011

Hernando said:
No more than Men's skating
In fact many of the Ladies could take posing lessons from Joubert, Bradley and Plushenko.

Ahh, but the Ladies would also need to learn the 'wink and point and nod' flirting that the guys do during their exhibition routines. I always got bored by Elvis, Candleloro and other because their exhibitions consisted of jump, air guitar, wink and point, jump, clap, pump your fist in the air.

aftertherain · Mar 28, 2011

heyang said:
Ahh, but the Ladies would also need to learn the 'wink and point and nod' flirting that the guys do during their exhibition routines. I always got bored by Elvis, Candleloro and other because their exhibitions consisted of jump, air guitar, wink and point, jump, clap, pump your fist in the air.

What? Really? I really loved his performance at the 98 Olympics ...

seniorita · Mar 28, 2011

Mathman said:
About music in floor exercises for ladies gymnastics, that is an interesting comparison.As far as I can tell female gymnasts do not make any use of their music at all. They do a couple of cutsy-wootsy poses (cutsy-wootsy is not to be confused with hoity-toity ), then they get down to business and do their tumbling passes.

just cutsy wootsy poses? (what is that :laugh:

?) ?? Look this, all the program.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYhRIdBpwpg

By the way, from wiki
Boginskaya retired after the 1992 Olympics, but decided to make a comeback in 1995. She said that she was inspired by Katarina Witt who had made a memorable comeback of her own at the 1994 Winter Olympics.

By the way, Bogi was a figure skater before taking up gymnastics. I think we would have seen great things from her if she stayed a skater.

Happy Bday to you and Doris

dorispulaski · Mar 28, 2011

:

Thank you for the good wishes.

Violet Bliss · Mar 28, 2011

Surya Bonaly, on the other hand, was a gymnast before turning to skating.

Joesitz (RIP) · Mar 28, 2011

Enough with the hoity toity established Art forms. What about those skaters who are unable to contort their bodies? Jackson Haines said get ya body into a pretzle shape to the music. You'll wow them in Detroit.

mot · Mar 28, 2011

seniorita said:
:Happy Bday to you and Doris

Happy birthday to you two from me too! (You share birthday with Akiko Suzuki, BTW.)
I would like to use this opportunity to express how much I enjoy reading your posts - they never fail to enlighten and / or entertain me. Many happy returns.

Mathman · Mar 28, 2011

Happy Birthday to you. too, Seniorita.

(Seniorita, Doris and I -- and Akiko

-- all have the same birthday.)

ISU Where Will Worlds BE (formerly) JAPAN QUAKE FOR WORLDS

Joesitz (RIP)

Olympia

Joesitz (RIP)

janetfan

Match Penalty

Mathman

Mathman

janetfan

Match Penalty

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

Violet Bliss

Mathman

Violet Bliss

Olympia

heyang

aftertherain

seniorita

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

Violet Bliss

Joesitz (RIP)

mot

Mathman

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