- Joined
- Jun 3, 2009
1. The US Federation on selecting athletes etc
a) Skate America can withdraw an entire team if they want to.
ICMS - International Committee Management Subcommittee - this group are the people that, by applying previously established criteria, choose the athletes to skate in international competitions.
Somewhat intriguing to me is that only for the Olympic Games do we have a check up by medical personnel mentioned as a prerequisite
This is presumably where Flatt went wrong. I haven't found that contract, but I'd be interested to read what it says. But it's worth mentioning that they only specified withdrawl of an entire team, not a specific athlete, at the behest of hte federation
2. More Thoughts therein
Realistically, though, if your federation tells you “You’re too injured to go compete” I doubt you ignore them and compete anyway. The risks are too great. Additionally, I think a federation would actually be more inclined than an athlete to send themselves out to competition. In most cases, it’s unlikely that the next in line is of equal ability. For example, in 2009, if Lysacek withdrew, Ryan Bradley would replace him. In 2008, Lysacek (two time medalist and fifth in 2007) was replaced with Carierre.
Furthermore, it’s not like it’s a guarantee that the next in line would’ve been able to go. According to the link posted on page 18, Flatt found out on April 22 that she had a stress fracture. The event was on April 29th. So, she notifies on April 22 (a Friday, I might add)... This is how the conversation goes, I expect.
Flatt: “I have a stress fracture in my leg, but I still feel I can skate”
US Fed: “A stress fracture. In your leg? I doubt you can compete with THAT.”
Flatt: “Should I withdraw?”
US Fed: “No. Go to Russia. We’ll notify Team Nagasu and have them in place just in case.”
It’s unlikely Nagasu even applies for the visa until Monday, April 25 – How fast do we seriously think they can expedite the application? Meanwhile, a team doctor from the US federation monitors Flatt’s practice sessions. If her practices go like her SP did, the team doctor likely gives her the unconditional go-ahead. Nagasu watches from the audience. If her practices resemble her LP, the doctor says “I don’t think she’ll do well, we should take her out.” Do they actually withdraw her if there’s not a guarantee that Nagasu can get to Moscow? I love Czisny, and am entirely confident she would’ve been top ten regardless of the drama surrounding her countrymate (thus assuring two spots), but would they?
So that’s why this whole circus seems, to me, to be a lot of smoke and mirrors. I sincerely doubt the outcome (anyone other than Flatt and Czisny skating) would’ve been changed. Even if you believe Carroll when he says that Nagasu was ready, there’s no guarantee that she would’ve even made it to Moscow in time. Now, if you believe that as soon as she had the injury (before diagnosing what it was) she should’ve notified the US Fed and Team Nagasu, I’d point out that skaters get injured all the time and I personally don’t know what level of injury (pre-diagnosis) is a good standard to expect that from.
Team <insert name>: “I got a papercut”
Team <competitor>: “Oh, better get that Visa. A papercut can be deadly” (no, you know what’s deadly? A cardboard cut. Hate those).
3. The team
Team USA, in figure skating, as only been a team once. At the World team trophy in 2009. It doesn’t exist as an entity. That’s not to say that the team construct isn’t a valuable ethos to have around, for both athlete and spectator (indeed, as Hernando exemplifies, it’s practically mandatory for a spectator to get involved in any international sport).
But when I cheer for track and field, I don’t cheer Jamaica. I cheer for Usain Bolt. When I cheer for tennis, I don’t cheer for Slovakia, Spain, and Belgium. I cheer for Djokovic, Nadal, and Clijsters. Conversely, when I cheer for hockey, I cheer for Team Canada or the Vancouver Canucks (regardless of the last two weeks) or Montreal Canadians. I don’t cheer for Sidney Crosby, the Sedin twins, or whomever plays for Les Habitents. The difference? The Sedin twins are teammates. Flatt and Nagasu competitors – they compete against each other.
So, for fans of US figure skating who hope to see more American competitors on the circuit/at worlds, it’s easier to operate as if they are teammates – the 13 points required for a third spot. For any federation, it’s better to invoke that feeling – it allows fans to root via patriotism if they lack knowledge (not a bad thing. It’s a hook most of us got caught on). And we see them do that with things like team leaders, team photos, etc.
But, for the athlete, I believe it’s different. There’s no such thing as “All for one and one for all.” Flatt specifically doesn’t get to share in the achievements of Alissa Czisny, Mirai Nagasu or any other American skater. She can applaud them, be happy for them, etc, but they aren’t hers because she competes under the same flag as they do. And those four minutes on the ice don’t belong to the nation, to the coach or choreographer or physiotherapist... they belong to her.
Should she have withdrawn? Maybe. But nothing to do with team spirit. If she thought she couldn’t compete, she should have withdrawn. If she could’ve done more damage to her health, she should have withdrawn.
As Olympia quoted, the past is prologue.
a) Skate America can withdraw an entire team if they want to.
The ICMS may withdraw the U.S. Team from a previously selected
international competition for reasonable cause at any time during the course of the
skating season.
ICMS - International Committee Management Subcommittee - this group are the people that, by applying previously established criteria, choose the athletes to skate in international competitions.
Skaters meeting the above criteria who did not compete or complete competition in
the current U.S. Figure Skating Championships due to injury or illness, verified by
U.S. Figure Skating personnel, may be considered for selection. In addition, U.S.
Figure Skating medical personnel must verify that the athlete(s) will be physically
ready to compete at the Olympic Games. The complete USOC approved Team
Selection procedures will be posted on the U.S. Figure Skating website at
usfigureskating.org.
Somewhat intriguing to me is that only for the Olympic Games do we have a check up by medical personnel mentioned as a prerequisite
Permission to compete in any competition specified in ICR 2.02 (E), ICR
2.03 (B) and ICR 10.25, is a privilege predicated upon the athlete signing the
appropriate U.S. Figure Skating contract or agreement and thereby agreeing to abide
by the official rules of U.S. Figure Skating and the USOC if appropriate, and any
other such rules, regulations, obligations and codes of conduct contained in the
contract or agreement.
This is presumably where Flatt went wrong. I haven't found that contract, but I'd be interested to read what it says. But it's worth mentioning that they only specified withdrawl of an entire team, not a specific athlete, at the behest of hte federation
2. More Thoughts therein
Realistically, though, if your federation tells you “You’re too injured to go compete” I doubt you ignore them and compete anyway. The risks are too great. Additionally, I think a federation would actually be more inclined than an athlete to send themselves out to competition. In most cases, it’s unlikely that the next in line is of equal ability. For example, in 2009, if Lysacek withdrew, Ryan Bradley would replace him. In 2008, Lysacek (two time medalist and fifth in 2007) was replaced with Carierre.
Furthermore, it’s not like it’s a guarantee that the next in line would’ve been able to go. According to the link posted on page 18, Flatt found out on April 22 that she had a stress fracture. The event was on April 29th. So, she notifies on April 22 (a Friday, I might add)... This is how the conversation goes, I expect.
Flatt: “I have a stress fracture in my leg, but I still feel I can skate”
US Fed: “A stress fracture. In your leg? I doubt you can compete with THAT.”
Flatt: “Should I withdraw?”
US Fed: “No. Go to Russia. We’ll notify Team Nagasu and have them in place just in case.”
It’s unlikely Nagasu even applies for the visa until Monday, April 25 – How fast do we seriously think they can expedite the application? Meanwhile, a team doctor from the US federation monitors Flatt’s practice sessions. If her practices go like her SP did, the team doctor likely gives her the unconditional go-ahead. Nagasu watches from the audience. If her practices resemble her LP, the doctor says “I don’t think she’ll do well, we should take her out.” Do they actually withdraw her if there’s not a guarantee that Nagasu can get to Moscow? I love Czisny, and am entirely confident she would’ve been top ten regardless of the drama surrounding her countrymate (thus assuring two spots), but would they?
So that’s why this whole circus seems, to me, to be a lot of smoke and mirrors. I sincerely doubt the outcome (anyone other than Flatt and Czisny skating) would’ve been changed. Even if you believe Carroll when he says that Nagasu was ready, there’s no guarantee that she would’ve even made it to Moscow in time. Now, if you believe that as soon as she had the injury (before diagnosing what it was) she should’ve notified the US Fed and Team Nagasu, I’d point out that skaters get injured all the time and I personally don’t know what level of injury (pre-diagnosis) is a good standard to expect that from.
Team <insert name>: “I got a papercut”
Team <competitor>: “Oh, better get that Visa. A papercut can be deadly” (no, you know what’s deadly? A cardboard cut. Hate those).
3. The team
Team USA, in figure skating, as only been a team once. At the World team trophy in 2009. It doesn’t exist as an entity. That’s not to say that the team construct isn’t a valuable ethos to have around, for both athlete and spectator (indeed, as Hernando exemplifies, it’s practically mandatory for a spectator to get involved in any international sport).
But when I cheer for track and field, I don’t cheer Jamaica. I cheer for Usain Bolt. When I cheer for tennis, I don’t cheer for Slovakia, Spain, and Belgium. I cheer for Djokovic, Nadal, and Clijsters. Conversely, when I cheer for hockey, I cheer for Team Canada or the Vancouver Canucks (regardless of the last two weeks) or Montreal Canadians. I don’t cheer for Sidney Crosby, the Sedin twins, or whomever plays for Les Habitents. The difference? The Sedin twins are teammates. Flatt and Nagasu competitors – they compete against each other.
So, for fans of US figure skating who hope to see more American competitors on the circuit/at worlds, it’s easier to operate as if they are teammates – the 13 points required for a third spot. For any federation, it’s better to invoke that feeling – it allows fans to root via patriotism if they lack knowledge (not a bad thing. It’s a hook most of us got caught on). And we see them do that with things like team leaders, team photos, etc.
But, for the athlete, I believe it’s different. There’s no such thing as “All for one and one for all.” Flatt specifically doesn’t get to share in the achievements of Alissa Czisny, Mirai Nagasu or any other American skater. She can applaud them, be happy for them, etc, but they aren’t hers because she competes under the same flag as they do. And those four minutes on the ice don’t belong to the nation, to the coach or choreographer or physiotherapist... they belong to her.
Should she have withdrawn? Maybe. But nothing to do with team spirit. If she thought she couldn’t compete, she should have withdrawn. If she could’ve done more damage to her health, she should have withdrawn.
As Olympia quoted, the past is prologue.