LADIES Long Program | Page 14 | Golden Skate

LADIES Long Program

OS

Sedated by Modonium
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
I don't think Mirai necessarily deserved such low PCS as she received tonight. Sure, she didn't skate with a lot of energy but neither did Phaneuf nor Lacoste and they got much higher PCS. (Also, her SS is WAY better than Leonova's)

I posted this on another board, but I thought her movements were out of sync with the music, i mean Lori can be a bit iffy but surely she's not that bad!! So I decide to compare her performance side by side with her Nebelhorn performance to see if I am right about rushing a bar of music. I think Mirai was rightfully slammed for her PCS mark.

She rushed many elements at the GP performance. Being too nervous or intense, she neglected listening to the music which threw many of her elements out of whack, surely that would affect muscle memory which would explain what we saw as she is trying to retune herself.

Play both clips at 36 seconds mark and see for yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52mq1HV1L_4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSAMlDUTipg
 

burntBREAD

Medalist
Joined
Mar 27, 2010
I posted this on another board, but I thought her movements were out of sync with the music, i mean Lori can be a bit iffy but surely she's not that bad!! So I decide to compare her performance side by side with her Nebelhorn performance to see if I am right about rushing a bar of music. I think Mirai was rightfully slammed for her PCS mark.

She rushed many elements at the GP performance. Being too nervous or intense, she neglected listing listen to the music which threw her elements out of whack, surely that would affect muscle memory which would explain what we saw.

Play both clips at 36 seconds mark and see for yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52mq1HV1L_4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSAMlDUTipg

I agree. For some reason (I watched the streaming practices) Mirai was completely off the music there as well, doing the raising the arm part off in the same way she did it today. She was incredibly tight overall, and it showed.

However, the thing is, there is no PCS mark for being on time with the music. There's at least SS and TR which have nothing whatsoever to do with music and Mirai shouldn't be lower than Leonova in those areas. CH shouldn't have been good anyways because the placement of the elements are weird (that climax of the music is just asking for a spiral, note that Mirai got miniscule GOE today on her spiral, she DEFINITELY would have gotten at least +1 across the board if she did the spiral on that climax).
 

OS

Sedated by Modonium
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
I agree. For some reason (I watched the streaming practices) Mirai was completely off the music there as well, doing the raising the arm part off in the same way she did it today. She was incredibly tight overall, and it showed.

However, the thing is, there is no PCS mark for being on time with the music. There's at least SS and TR which have nothing whatsoever to do with music and Mirai shouldn't be lower than Leonova in those areas. CH shouldn't have been good anyways because the placement of the elements are weird (that climax of the music is just asking for a spiral, note that Mirai got miniscule GOE today on her spiral, she DEFINITELY would have gotten at least +1 across the board if she did the spiral on that climax).

Well how else is she suppose to interpret the work if it is not relate to the music? Music is the spine that hold everything together between the performer, the required elements, the choreography. I think the missing beat for majority of the first half and second half is huge for a sport like figure skating where choreography and required elements must be timed with resting periods in between for impact and effect. She did manage to reclaim some of her key elements during the climax section (though I'd argue she's still behind by half a beat).

I think my gripe about rushing the music by a bar is how it would affect the rest of her performances particularly regarding to muscle memory which would explain for weird mistakes like her spins etc. If she spend half of the time confused about what she is doing, and spend most of her performance trying to catch up and retune to the music, it would obviously have a rippling effect affect the rest of her performances like transitions, interpretation, choreography etc.
 

burntBREAD

Medalist
Joined
Mar 27, 2010
Well how else is she suppose to interpret the work if it is not relate to the music? Music is the spine that hold everything together between the performer, the required elements, the choreography. I think the missing beat for majority of the first half and second half is huge for a sport like figure skating where choreography and required elements must be timed with resting periods in between for impact and effect. She did manage to reclaim some of her key elements during the climax section (though I'd argue she's still behind by half a beat).

I think my gripe about rushing the music by a bar is how it would affect the rest of her performances particularly regarding to muscle memory which would explain for weird mistakes like her spins etc. If she spend half of the time confused about what she is doing, and spend most of her performance trying to catch up and retune to the music, it would obviously have a rippling effect affect the rest of her performances like transitions, interpretation, choreography etc.

She kind of caught up after the spiral (the music change definitely -- well hopefully -- cued her in as to where she should be in the choreo, but the thing is -- since she was practicing this program in the exact same way that she produced, did she purposely change? Interpretation is also a part of the PCS, but it is directly correlated to CH and PE. I'd still say that SS and TR are pretty separate but PCS tends to be the same, i.e. we see people with great interpretation still get lowballed on that aspect because the rest of the PCS is lower.

I'm completely agreeing with you that the performance was not good because of how off she was from the music - that probably contributed to how cold and sullen the performance seemed to be...not very Mirai at all. A lot of people are saying this isn't a good vehicle for her, but I think it sort of resembles her LPs.. Coppelia, Caprice Fantastique, and Memoirs all had slow sections, grandiose sections, and playful sections, just like this LP. She just needs to inject her personality into it.
 

OS

Sedated by Modonium
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
She kind of caught up after the spiral (the music change definitely -- well hopefully -- cued her in as to where she should be in the choreo, but the thing is -- since she was practicing this program in the exact same way that she produced, did she purposely change? Interpretation is also a part of the PCS, but it is directly correlated to CH and PE. I'd still say that SS and TR are pretty separate but PCS tends to be the same, i.e. we see people with great interpretation still get lowballed on that aspect because the rest of the PCS is lower.

I'm completely agreeing with you that the performance was not good because of how off she was from the music - that probably contributed to how cold and sullen the performance seemed to be...not very Mirai at all. A lot of people are saying this isn't a good vehicle for her, but I think it sort of resembles her LPs.. Coppelia, Caprice Fantastique, and Memoirs all had slow sections, grandiose sections, and playful sections, just like this LP. She just needs to inject her personality into it.

If she is performing with the mistakes during practice, the Frank should be blamed for not noticing earlier! Shocking neglect! :p

Yeah I agree about interject with her own personality. For any piece of work to be delivered successfully in terms of artistic credibility, the artist need to interject with their own essences of originality or authenticity. Mirai didn't do either, she didn't add anything beyond what is on paper and failed to make the basic connection.

May be they want her to be a roman queen, but she just want to be pirate so she sulked through out! Frank badgering on about 'go out there like the best skater in the world' makes her sheltered her real self and put out a pretense on something she's not (kween/Lysacek intensity). All business and no play is clearly not the Mirai performance that had all the sparkles in the past!
 

genki

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 24, 2010
Akiko's program is so beautiful. I sometimes call her female version of Dai. Good for her. I was not happy last year, because I felt that Akiko was put down unreasonably.
But it is a good start this year. Go Akiko.
 

Sasha'sSpins

Medalist
Joined
Apr 2, 2009
Country
United-States
Mirai needs a new choreographer, a new costume designer and some oomph. This strategy is just not right .

Mirai also needs a good swift kick in the rear end. Girlfriend skated almost zombie-like. And this is coming from a huge Nagasu fan.

Congrats to all the medallists I heart all three of these young ladies! Tiny Tuk what a coming out party! Lovely job by Akiko, and Ashley has won a GP medal! Well done!
 

Sasha'sSpins

Medalist
Joined
Apr 2, 2009
Country
United-States
I agree that Mirai needs to do something different. I would like to see her repeat her pirates program. That was exciting!

I would love it if she brought it back-her 'Pirates' is my favorite SP of hers. She needs something as enchanting for her LP.
 

Sasha'sSpins

Medalist
Joined
Apr 2, 2009
Country
United-States
Well i think its time to sweep the US ladies from 2007-2008 cycle and hope the younger girls can get it together. Rachael, Mirai, Ashley and Caroline have had their chances and haven't got it done.

I'm not quite that pessimistic just yet. The four young ladies you mentioned aren't dead just yet and theirs still a few seasons yet before the Sochi Olympics. Anything can happen between now and then and who knows how the junior phenoms will develop by then?
 

Jammers

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
Do you really think any of those four are going to be factors by Sochi? Caroline is beyond history and so is Rachael judging by the last year and now this performance. And if Mrai can't skate under pressure she will always be a "what if" skater. Ashley looked better here then she has for a long time but i'm not sure about her either. And Alissa will be 27 and how will her weak jumps hold up against the younger girls coming up?
 

Sasha'sSpins

Medalist
Joined
Apr 2, 2009
Country
United-States
Do you really think any of those four are going to be factors by Sochi? Caroline is beyond history and so is Rachael judging by the last year and now this performance. And if Mrai can't skate under pressure she will always be a "what if" skater. Ashley looked better here then she has for a long time but i'm not sure about her either. And Alissa will be 27 and how will her weak jumps hold up against the younger girls coming up?

Yes I think Mirai still is very much in the mix and Alissa and Ashley too. For Alissa age is just a number if she keeps herself in a very good condition and paces herself. Caroline and Rachael-no.

The Olympic trials/U.S. Nationals for Sochi will tell. We'll compare notes then.
 

seniorita

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2008
Thanx for Nebelhorn videos, I think Mirai's both dresses were much better longer and for some reason she cut them short both now, also I think her Lp dress must go, it is indiferent color and design. She always had nice dresses.
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
Sigh...Mirai. I wish she could pull it together.

I have a soft spot for Frank Carroll because of Michelle. He gave her such beautiful technique, and he and Lori Nichol made magic with Michelle in terms of original choreography and music choices. (Interesting that since then, Lori has so often retreated into more conventional musical treatments. I have always thought of Michelle as Lori's muse.) Do you all really think that he isn't working out for Mirai? (I'm not arguing; this just never occurred to me before.) If any of you could "assign" a coach to Mirai given her particular strengths and weaknesses, whom would you choose?

I suppose looking at the skaters who did best with Carroll (Kwan, Lysacek, and Fratianne) one could reason that he does best with workhorses who have a steadier temperament. All three of these skaters strike me as people who aren't easily shaken during a competition and also as people who will give every ounce of their time and devotion to training. But I only know what I hear and have no solid basis on which to evaluate any of this. Any thoughts?
 

bigsisjiejie

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 22, 2009
I am sadly coming to the conclusion that Mirai does not have the mindset of a champion. A champion is relentless, regardless of falls or bobbles in a program, and just doesn't quit. A champion, when technical mistakes esp on jumps happen, can keep things rolling and still make magic with presentation and musical connection..even if if not ending up on the podium. A champion could take program material based on the telephone directory and make it work. Usually by the age Mirai is now, you either see this innate quality or you don't.

I'm not sure Frank Carroll is the problem here. I definitely think Mirai should be looking at other choreographers.
 

OS

Sedated by Modonium
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
I am sadly coming to the conclusion that Mirai does not have the mindset of a champion. A champion is relentless, regardless of falls or bobbles in a program, and just doesn't quit. A champion, when technical mistakes esp on jumps happen, can keep things rolling and still make magic with presentation and musical connection..even if if not ending up on the podium. A champion could take program material based on the telephone directory and make it work. Usually by the age Mirai is now, you either see this innate quality or you don't.

I'm not sure Frank Carroll is the problem here. I definitely think Mirai should be looking at other choreographers.

Reading this really makes me miss Yuna Kim. She never give up, injuries, training problems, emotional upsets, pressures etc. Perhaps Mirai would be interested to look for a role model for mental strength and competitive spirit too! As well as Michelle who she said look up to.

So she hit a new low in her career (Although someone said she would have got a bronze at Skate America), but really she could still rise above it at Cup of China just like what she did at 4CCs after the US nationals.

Agree about change in choreographers, she need someone to tap into her personality and bring out a program she can connect with and skate with joy again.
 
Last edited:

seniorita

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2008
I just watched Leonova and felt sorry for her. For all the critics against Morosov, it was clear he was clever enough to make programs that gather points just not my cup of tea, but Leonova's (and Amodio's Lp) is not this year even good. He cant give a piece like that to Alena, she is not Ando who had a gentle physique and kind of skate, this program is very wrong for her. And he added a cut of Requiem to make things worse. By now he should have known that requiem is not carmen that can be skated again and again, I mean if I was a judge I would have requiem allergy after Vancouver.
I feel sorry for Alena in case she is paying Morosov a lot of money. And Rachel if she paid Lori to give her a microwaved firebird.
 
Last edited:
Top