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Art&Sport

Medalist
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
I wouldn't even compare Chan with Takahashi or Hanyu. I just question the 'absolute' value of his IN, which is 9.21. That is higher than any other scores he got for other components. OK, his SS is great but that is 9.11. Honestly what is so special about his interpretation? I re-read the definition in the rules:
The personal and creative translation of the music to movement on ice.
To reward the skater who through movement creates a personal and creative translation of the music.
As the tempo binds all notes in time, the ability to use the tempos and rhythms of the music in a variety
of ways, along with the subtle use of finesse to reflect the nuances of all the fundamentals of music:
melody, rhythm, harmony, color, texture, and form creates a mastery of interpretation
.
I don't get any feeling, evocation, color, or texture from his skating about this espagnol music.
I may be old fashioned but compare John Curry's Olympic EX and his little piece on Carmen. That IS interpretation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o26Bb8bh3EM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=syYlSFtQjoo

Thank you, Stella Campo!

And, Becki: Chan will win and continue winning, with or without dignity, clean or not. ISU Judges have spoken and they are not finished sending us the message yet.
 

Becki

Medalist
Joined
Nov 28, 2011
Thank you, Stella Campo!

And, Becki: Chan will win and continue winning, with or without dignity, clean or not. ISU Judges have spoken and they are not finished sending us the message yet.

No, if you look at the scores today, the gap wasn't insurmountable. Yuzuru's PC improved dramatically, and I believe he will only continue to challenge Patrick technically and artistically. There is no doubt that Yuzuru is the most talented 17 year old male skater in the world today, and will just continue to get better with time.

Someone mentioned Daisuke looked rather scared when Yuzuru's name was announced for the podium.....in a season or two, Yuzuru might overtake Daisuke to become Japan #1...
 

sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
No, if you look at the scores today, the gap wasn't insurmountable. Yuzuru's PC improved dramatically, and I believe he will only continue to challenge Patrick technically and artistically. There is no doubt that Yuzuru is the most talented 17 year old male skater in the world today, and will just continue to get better with time.

Someone mentioned Daisuke looked rather scared when Yuzuru's name was announced for the podium.....in a season or two, Yuzuru might overtake Daisuke to become Japan #1...

I have no doubt Hanyu will surpass Dai soon,
the only question is will it be after 2014 ?
 

mikeko666

Final Flight
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
For once, I felt sorry for Chan. The crowd was just so rude, it was horrible. He didn't give himself those scores. And he landed two clean quads. The audience needs to educate themselves and understand where Chan is separating himself from everyone else.

ISU and Chan supporters have the option to ignore the voice of the public and yell at them "you are a bunch of fools who know nothing about COP". Just don't expect this sport get any more popular than it is.
 

evangeline

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 7, 2007
No, if you look at the scores today, the gap wasn't insurmountable. Yuzuru's PC improved dramatically, and I believe he will only continue to challenge Patrick technically and artistically. There is no doubt that Yuzuru is the most talented 17 year old male skater in the world today, and will just continue to get better with time.

Someone mentioned Daisuke looked rather scared when Yuzuru's name was announced for the podium.....in a season or two, Yuzuru might overtake Daisuke to become Japan #1...

Daisuke will improve too. He went from falling, two-footing and under-rotating on all his quads for every international event this season to cleanly landing two of them at Worlds. I expect his quad rate will improve next year....
 

treeloving

Medalist
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
I have no doubt Hanyu will surpass Dai soon,
the only question is will it be after 2014 ?

Well, people say the same thing about Kozuka last year (and Arthur too).

Nothing is predictable, next season he may be up or may be down; but I will always remember the spirit he has display throughout this year and how he always is a true fighter.

And in my heart I still want Dai or him to win Sochi, so I hope Dai keep improving as well.
 

Becki

Medalist
Joined
Nov 28, 2011
Well, people say the same thing about Kozuka last year (and Arthur too).

Nothing is predictable, next season he may be up or may be down; but I will always remember the spirit he has display throughout this year and how he always is a true fighter.

Based on the observation that he is a true fighter, I think there is no where to go but UP =] Remember he said his goal this season is to go to GPF, and make the world team? He said it was going to be hard, but he's going to fight for it. And he did, with a bronze medal to go with it. I don't see that fighter in Artur or Kozuka, unfortunately.
 

Art&Sport

Medalist
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
:laugh: The sport should be divided into 2 divisions --

One: those with artistry and the ability to land basic jumps, including 3-axels for men which will score highly if executed well and placed well within the choreography; at least 2 double axels (one in combination) will also suffice but the key will be whether the jumps are used effectively within the program, in addition to execution; one quad only in fp is okay if a competitor desires, but it is not required, not recommended and does not count greatly in the overall judging -- the main criteria will be creativity in program theme, choreography, costume, as well as the placement and usage of the jumps and other elements within the program to fully express the music.

Two: those with superior SS and technical ability who can land 2 or more quads and quads are required, but competitors must also be able to land 2 or more 3-axels (2-axels count very little for the men) -- artistic skills? meh, this division is about he-man jumping skills only -- the competitors are allowed to fall forward during landings, turn-out and 2-foot as much as they want, fall even, just as long as they make those revolutions.

Guess which arena will be filled to capacity?
 

derplutz

Rinkside
Joined
Dec 5, 2011
Good for Joubert. Didn't know he had that in him. Impressed with Hanyu's fight too.

Chan skated great, of course we're all going to remember that fall/whatever that was because it was basically the last thing he did in the program... you have to give him credit though for doing two absolutely perfect quads and his overall quality of the skate.
 

Art&Sport

Medalist
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
No, if you look at the scores today, the gap wasn't insurmountable. Yuzuru's PC improved dramatically, and I believe he will only continue to challenge Patrick technically and artistically. There is no doubt that Yuzuru is the most talented 17 year old male skater in the world today, and will just continue to get better with time.

Someone mentioned Daisuke looked rather scared when Yuzuru's name was announced for the podium.....in a season or two, Yuzuru might overtake Daisuke to become Japan #1...

Yeah, but please Becki. Shortening the gap between Chan and his measly competitors who are "not in the same league" with him (according to one Canadian writer), was planned in advance. The shortening of the gap was planned to satisfy the criticisms and outcries over the judges' scoring, but it didn't work.
 

skatinginbc

Medalist
Joined
Aug 26, 2010
you have to give him credit though for doing two absolutely perfect quads and his overall quality of the skate.
And the judges certainly did with a lot of GOEs. That's something amazing and admiring about Chan. Whatever he did well, he did really really well. Even if he screwed up here and there, he somehow could hold it together and never give up.
 

Medusa

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 6, 2007
Someone mentioned Daisuke looked rather scared when Yuzuru's name was announced for the podium.....in a season or two, Yuzuru might overtake Daisuke to become Japan #1...

Somehow I sincerely doubt that. He just doesn't seem like that kind of person. Dai's career had so many ups and downs, he hasn't got many world medals so far, he tends to be inconsistent, he also survived several talents like Oda and Kozuka.

I just love Dai's skating, he is truly artistic in my eyes and pushes the sport artistically. I also think Chan pushes the sport technically with that incredible intricacy he has. He just needs some, I don't know, artistic vision? I don't think he has an artistic direction, he dazzles with his technical skills to rousing music, which is a skill in its own right. I'd just really like it if he managed to develop further, adapt his skating to different genres. But then again, Plushy never did that and is doing / did just fine with that.
 

let`s talk

Match Penalty
Joined
Sep 10, 2009
What a "drama". When did we last have a world champion that was boo-ed? Congrats to Chan on making one more Guiness record. And congrats to ISU on one more fat nail in the coffin "Popularity of FS". Poor Patrick. He couldn't collect the audience in his training rink in Colorado. He is as "popular" in Russia as Evan. Now he lost his business in Japan too. Who wants to see such an umai-ne-champ for 20, 000 yen for a ticket :disapp:. I almost pity him.

Dai looked incredibly handsome and happy. He said to Fuji TV that of course he is glad that he got a silver medal but still he regrets that he didn't get a gold one. Next time he will do his best to get the gold. He also was very grateful to the French audience for all the support that they expressed to him :). Dai-dude, they are French for a reason, with their taste in perfumes, fashion, wine and food. Of course they couldn't not fall in love with you. Enjoy it! ;)

Yuzuru was overjoyed like a real 17yo kid. He said to TV that he still can't believe that he got a medal. He was very happy to be on the world podium together with Dai and Chan, this success gave him confidence and that since now and then he will try to be on the podium every time :thumbsup:! Well, he joined the noble company of Plush and Yag who both won a bronze medal on their first appearance at Wolds. Btw, for those who don't remember, when Plush was asked who he thinks can win the Worlds, he gave exactly these three names. And he was right. :p
 

La Rhumba

Supporting All British Skaters!
Medalist
Joined
Aug 9, 2006
Country
United-Kingdom
It s not just the naive audience disagreeing about the pcs margin, examiner and John Kerr just tweeted about it and they know about fs right? Examiner is a huge fan of chan anyway.. it will be others too commenting on it..

Add to that the British Eurosport commentators - one of whom, Chris Howarth, is a Figure Skating Coach in the USA - the other, Simon Reed, has been commentating on the sport for 30 years.
They were both totally perplexed and outraged that Chan was 1st on the Free, and his PCS was completely overscored.

I found Chan's performance today boring, he had no facial expressions and the same arm and body movements all the way through with no variation. I don't care how brilliant his edges are - Skating should be a whole package of everything. The audience were not wrong.
 

Violet Bliss

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
As a Chan supporter I am happy for what he was able to accomplish at this Worlds. The pressure and the difficulty of defending the title were tremendous and he succeeded. It is an experience that will help him greatly next time.

Both Takahashi and Hanyu peaked at the right time and showed us their best. Kudos to them as well as a number of skaters who brought their games today.

I had to be away from the computer right after Patrick finished and came back to read about the booing and the expected complaints. I hope this experience will have similar effect as the Olympic debacle to spur Patrick on to soar higher from here.
 

Art&Sport

Medalist
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
Spots for 2013:
Three spots: Canada, Japan and France
Two spots: USA, Kazakhstan, Italy and Czech Republic
Lost spots: Russia and Spain (down to 1 spot)

Thanks for the tally. Abbott and Rippon did not do what they could here, and no excuses. Seriously, tho' who is the third guy going to be for France? I'll bet even Abbott and Rippon not at full strength and confidence could beat whoever that is. Even the U.S. men's 3 to 9 place guys could probably beat France's third.

With Worlds in their home country, Joubert and Amodio over-achieved and were rewarded. Neither of them are actually better than Abbott and Rippon, but it was up to Abbott and Rippon to show what they can do and they failed. The judges were fairly generous to both Abbott and Rippon in the sp, but understandably judges weren't about to help them out in the fp with other guys stepping up to skate more cleanly, even without the same above average artistic skills. Gosh, did Czisny's problems work on Abbott and Rippon and their coaches? Waayy too bad for the Detroit crew. Jeremy and Adam are so much better than they were able to show here. And there will be no do-overs. Confidence must somehow be accessed when you have the kind of talent that Adam and Jeremy possess.

The problem for AdaRipp and Jere is that the U.S. has a deep field of guys on the senior level and more are coming up from juniors too. Unlike such countries as France where Joubert can be sent to Worlds year after year after year, whether or not he is at full strength or hobbling on both legs.
 
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let`s talk

Match Penalty
Joined
Sep 10, 2009
I think the main problem is the incredibly STUPID corridor. If a judge dares to send a message, and his/her marks are out of the corridor, they face the fact that they might never judge again, and I think a big part of the problem lays right here. I know several judges, and they are scarred to death of the corridor. :bang:

Oh hell. What an excuse. Why they became judges in the first place. No other job market options?
 
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