WTT Ladies SP | Page 8 | Golden Skate

WTT Ladies SP

gmyers

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 6, 2010
Russia should just have really withdrew from this competition when they had to send the men they did. No one wants to be there or skate to their even minimum ability and it has produced these awful showings of Leonova and Sotnikova.
 

let`s talk

Match Penalty
Joined
Sep 10, 2009
I saw Gold live first time. I understand why she get some wows from American fans. Her jumps are higher than US ladies' jumps. But they are not high for the rest of the world. They are usual. But her skating skills are not good at all. Too many strokes, as if she is at practice skating her stuff and the music is playing as some background. There is no program. She does need someone who can help her to develope her PCS, because it doesn't look like her current coach can give her anything else except his russophobic rants a la benderovets. Adelina looks much more mature and feminine compared to Gracie. I like Kanako's high long jumps and speed, but her skating has juniorish flavour. In general the result in ladies is fair I think.
 

Leonardo

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
I saw Gold live first time. I understand why she get some wows from American fans. Her jumps are higher than US ladies' jumps. But they are not high for the rest of the world. They are usual. But her skating skills are not good at all. Too many strokes, as if she is at practice skating her stuff and the music is playing as some background. There is no program. She does need someone who can help her to develope her PCS, because it doesn't look like her current coach can give her anything else except his russophobic rants a la benderovets. Adelina looks much more mature and feminine compared to Gracie. I like Kanako's high long jumps and speed, but her skating has juniorish flavour. In general the result in ladies is fair I think.

I really loved Akiko's performance and I thought she had the best interpretation and performance/execution of the night. Caro's pcs and akiko's could be closer, IMHO.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
It's worth noting that Gracie had the highest base value of the ladies tonight. This reflects that:

1.) Her content is the most difficult
2.) She did not UR or have edge problems
3.) She hit her levels on her non-jump elements

Let's give Gracie credit for that. From where I sit this shows solid technique and ability. She has been 8/8 (mskater93 can confirm) on her 3F-3T with no UR/edge call. That is amazing consistency.

Gracie now needs to work on polish and presentation. That is not surprising from someone who is still very new to the international scene. I think she knows what feedback she is getting and I could see even in this performance a concerted effort to project herself to the audience.

I think PCS/+GOE is next. But I think she will get there.
 

mskater93

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 22, 2005
She is 10/10 with this SP for her 3F+3T, Mrs. P! Going back over the last year: Northern Blast, Skate Milwaukee, Skate Detroit, Glacier Falls, Greater Chicagoland Fall Invitational, JGP-Estonia, Midwestern Sectionals (J), Nationals (J), Junior Worlds, WTT. She's getting + GOE when she hits her jumps, she lost all her jumping +GOE from the flip out of the Lz today...
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
She is 10/10 with this SP for her 3F+3T, Mrs. P! Going back over the last year: Northern Blast, Skate Milwaukee, Skate Detroit, Glacier Falls, Greater Chicagoland Fall Invitational, JGP-Estonia, Midwestern Sectionals (J), Nationals (J), Junior Worlds, WTT. She's getting + GOE when she hits her jumps, she lost all her jumping +GOE from the flip out of the Lz today...

Thanks for the info.

That's right! So if she got "0" on the 3Z, she would have scored +2.26 GOE. That said, she probably can stand to improve +GOE on her non-jump elements. And PCS.
 

Jenny81

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Well done. Carolina & Akiko.

BTW... What happened their pcs??

- Carolina : 30.74 (2012 Worlds) -> 33.14 (2012 WTT)
- Akiko : 28.71 (2012 Worlds) -> 31.03 (2012 WTT)
:unsure:
It's just unbelievable.


** Just for reference...
- Kanako Murakami : 28.06 (2012 Worlds) -> 29.26 (2012 WTT)
- Ashley Wagner : 27.62 (2012 Worlds) -> 28.06 (2012 WTT)
- Yretha Silete : 20.82 (2012 Worlds) -> 23.43 (2012 WTT)
- Valentina Marchei : 24.86 (2012 Worlds) -> 25.37 (2012 WTT)
- Alena Leonova : 29.97 (2012 Worlds) -> 28.20 (2012 WTT)
 

Trewyn

Medalist
Joined
Dec 10, 2008
Well, for Carolina and Akiko: they skated a lot better here than at Worlds in the SP at least. Leonova skated a lot worse (probably should have been even bigger difference in PCS!) and Ashley skated less conservative as well, earning slightly higher PCS.
 

Jenny81

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Well done. Carolina & Akiko.

BTW... What happened their pcs??

- Carolina : 30.74 (2012 Worlds) -> 33.14 (2012 WTT)
- Akiko : 28.71 (2012 Worlds) -> 31.03 (2012 WTT)
:unsure:
It's just unbelievable.


** Just for reference...
- Kanako Murakami : 28.06 (2012 Worlds) -> 29.26 (2012 WTT)
- Ashley Wagner : 27.62 (2012 Worlds) -> 28.06 (2012 WTT)
- Yretha Silete : 20.82 (2012 Worlds) -> 23.43 (2012 WTT)
- Valentina Marchei : 24.86 (2012 Worlds) -> 25.37 (2012 WTT)
- Alena Leonova : 29.97 (2012 Worlds) -> 28.20 (2012 WTT)


Am I the only one who thinks this situation is so weird?
 

RemyRose

YOLO
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 28, 2005
Country
United-States
I don't think its weird. Some skated better than at worlds, some worse and the scores should reflect that which they do.
 

gmyers

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 6, 2010
It's as serious as an event? Judges are being more generous? Kostner was better here than at worlds but overall judges were just giving higher scores here than the judges at worlds.
 

Jammers

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
I saw Gold live first time. I understand why she get some wows from American fans. Her jumps are higher than US ladies' jumps. But they are not high for the rest of the world. They are usual. But her skating skills are not good at all. Too many strokes, as if she is at practice skating her stuff and the music is playing as some background. There is no program. She does need someone who can help her to develope her PCS, because it doesn't look like her current coach can give her anything else except his russophobic rants a la benderovets. Adelina looks much more mature and feminine compared to Gracie. I like Kanako's high long jumps and speed, but her skating has juniorish flavour. In general the result in ladies is fair I think.

I disagree. Gracie has perhaps the most difficult 3-3 in the world already and her jumps are much higher and more powerful then someone like Suzuki and she doesn't have thew wonky entrance to her jumps that someone like Kanako has.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
Although Gracie is not Lucinda Ruh, she did hit level 4 on all her spins here. And level 3 on her step sequence.

She wasn't doing that in Juniors, so she's made great improvements already.

Yes, she needs polish, but the basics are all there already. And she's still quite young; she has some time to polish.
 

Jammers

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
One thing is for sure with her great jump technique and big jumps it makes her competitive already.
 

FlattFan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
I saw Gold live first time. I understand why she get some wows from American fans. Her jumps are higher than US ladies' jumps. But they are not high for the rest of the world. They are usual. But her skating skills are not good at all. Too many strokes, as if she is at practice skating her stuff and the music is playing as some background. There is no program. She does need someone who can help her to develope her PCS, because it doesn't look like her current coach can give her anything else except his russophobic rants a la benderovets. Adelina looks much more mature and feminine compared to Gracie. I like Kanako's high long jumps and speed, but her skating has juniorish flavour. In general the result in ladies is fair I think.

Although I've said in the past that Gracie's jumps aren't as big as people made it out to be, they are quite competitive with the rest of the world. Only few girls who have better jumps. Unless the rest of the world means Miki, Yuna, Mao, Caro, she's high up there.
Adelina doesn't have 3flutz-3loop anymore. Didn't get that combo ratified once this season. Switched to 3T-3T and it wasn't clean either. I thought she was great when she was a junior. Don't think she will be a factor in the future.
Kanako's posture is not good, even Zueva couldn't disguise it with her choreography.
 

fairly4

Medalist
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
actually kostner was a bit better at worlds, she skated nicehere--but good here though. she did get a higher score than at worlds due to triple triple

greatjob all goodluck tomorrow all
 

gmyers

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 6, 2010
These judges also called Sotnikova's flip as wrong. It will be funny if in the LP both her flip and lutz get edge calls.
 

Li'Kitsu

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
FlattFan said:
Adelina doesn't have 3flutz-3loop anymore. Didn't get that combo ratified once this season. Switched to 3T-3T and it wasn't clean either. I thought she was great when she was a junior. Don't think she will be a factor in the future.

How about Junior worlds?
And at the GP, she had trouble with the Lutz - I can remember just one instance, where the 3Lo was underrotated - at nationals.

And she landed the 3T-3T more than once this season - definitly at JW, I think youth olys too.

Jammers said:
Gracie has perhaps the most difficult 3-3 in the world already

Most difficult would be the 3Lz-3Lo, which only Sotnikove even attempts. Next would be 3F-3Lo (which I wouldn't know Gracie could do) and 3Lz-3T - so what 3-3 do you mean?
 

kwanatic

Check out my YT channel, Bare Ice!
Record Breaker
Joined
May 19, 2011
Although I've said in the past that Gracie's jumps aren't as big as people made it out to be, they are quite competitive with the rest of the world. Only few girls who have better jumps. Unless the rest of the world means Miki, Yuna, Mao, Caro, she's high up there.
Adelina doesn't have 3flutz-3loop anymore. Didn't get that combo ratified once this season. Switched to 3T-3T and it wasn't clean either. I thought she was great when she was a junior. Don't think she will be a factor in the future.
Kanako's posture is not good, even Zueva couldn't disguise it with her choreography.

Gracie has nice coverage in her jumps but they're a bit...unattractive to me. She has kinda loose air position on some bigger jumps which does make sense b/c she gets good speed and height which gives her enough time to rotate without pulling the rotation so tight; if she did, she'd end up over-rotating. Tight air position makes it a prettier jump; that's why Carolina's jumps are so pretty. Gracie's landings are kinda weird too. The way she checks her arms on her landings, she goes up at the shoulder instead of out, plus she doesn't control her free leg...it just kinda swings out there. It just looks a bit sloppy to me. Of course this is all nitpicking and preference; I like big, pretty, controlled jumps. But the fact that she lands them well with and speed is all that really matters. ITA about the airplane arms. They are bad but (thankfully) not as bad as Kimmie's. With some work, she'll be able to use her arms more effectively and it won't look like flailing. She's just lacking overall in the aesthetics department for me, but with some work and much better choreography she can turn that opinion around with time.


Saying that Adelina won't be a factor based on one rough season is a little foot-in-mouth IMO. Especially given her results. Despite her less than stellar performances, she hasn't missed a podium all season (2 GP events, Russian nationals, Youth Olympic Games, jr. worlds)...I wouldn't call that a non-factor. Besides, she's only 15 and is still adjusting to her last growth spurt. Her natural jumping ability in combination with her maturity and presence on the ice make her a factor. Flutz aside, her confidence slump is her only weakness right now and that's impressive for someone so young.

I'd give her at least another year (and some much worse results) before I'd deem her a non-factor moving forward...
 
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FlattFan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
How about Junior worlds?
And at the GP, she had trouble with the Lutz - I can remember just one instance, where the 3Lo was underrotated - at nationals.
Oops. Forgot about JW. Anyway, that combo is as unreliable as PCS-judging. She should find another combo that she can hit at least 80% of the times. And a flutz combo, even when fully rotated, will always get -GOE. What is her team thinking? She needs a strategist/coach like Morozov. ;)
 
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