Lysacek announces return to competitive skating

Skater Boy · Aug 17, 2012

well Evan is a competitor so it is possible he could be top 3; a bit of luck and Dai, Chan, Kozuka, Hanyu or Oda, Joubert, Brezina, Verner these two are a roll of the dice), injured Plushy, Weir/Abbott all could be booted or fall off the podium. It's a small space on the podium. But the field is deep - I do hope the field shines; like Evan but he has had his time in the sun (maybe he got too much sun lol) Still the dude will be skating in a multi thousand sequined and spandexed outfit. A lot of girls will be envious - wearing a vera wang!

ImaginaryPogue · Aug 17, 2012

1. I was a little surprised last season at the turn of events, and specifically Lysacek's comments to/about Skate America/Nationals. I always perceived him as the good-ole boy of the American men. More heteronormative than Wier or Abbott, more consistent (though not always - recall 2006 Worlds/Olympics), more successful. He had his underdog season in 2005 when he won bronze and continued having success. This does seem more in line.

2. I don't think he'll be as successful now, though. IJS has shifted somewhat. The quad debate is an old one, but the fact is, the quad is worth more now to a program than it was before. Before, a quad skater who had everything else would be the one to beat, but the quad skaters so rarely had anything approaching everything else (and the ones who did: Verner and Ponsero, where shatteringly inconsistent). But not only is the quad worth more now - the quad skaters have a better understanding of the other aspects of skating to make it more than the be-all and end all. For two world championships in a row, all the medalists landed a positive GOE quad in the LP. In Nice, of the top 15 long programs, only ONE didn't contain a fully rotated quad (counting negative GOE'd attempts). This is the new field. I don't doubt Evan's work ethic. I don't doubt his abilities. But he's dealing with a very broad and deep field.

janetfan · Aug 17, 2012

ImaginaryPogue said:
1. I was a little surprised last season at the turn of events, and specifically Lysacek's comments to/about Skate America/Nationals. I always perceived him as the good-ole boy of the American men. More heteronormative than Wier or Abbott, more consistent (though not always - recall 2006 Worlds/Olympics), more successful. He had his underdog season in 2005 when he won bronze and continued having success. This does seem more in line.

2. I don't think he'll be as successful now, though. IJS has shifted somewhat. The quad debate is an old one, but the fact is, the quad is worth more now to a program than it was before. Before, a quad skater who had everything else would be the one to beat, but the quad skaters so rarely had anything approaching everything else (and the ones who did: Verner and Ponsero, where shatteringly inconsistent). But not only is the quad worth more now - the quad skaters have a better understanding of the other aspects of skating to make it more than the be-all and end all. For two world championships in a row, all the medalists landed a positive GOE quad in the LP. In Nice, of the top 15 long programs, only ONE didn't contain a fully rotated quad (counting negative GOE'd attempts). This is the new field. I don't doubt Evan's work ethic. I don't doubt his abilities. But he's dealing with a very broad and deep field.

mathman already posted this link, but here it is again:

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...0120810_1_evan-lysacek-kim-yuna-shep-goldberg

Lysacek's comeback problems last season are unfortunately a common problem with organiztions like ISU and IOC.

Control, control and more control is their credo and athletes and fans be damned.

I agree with some of what you wrote but you seem to assume Lysacek is an ungrateful athlete.

Not sure if that is true but it is easy to see how having an agent like Shep who understands how US Skating and ISU work solved the problem.

Don't confuse Evan with Chan, who has stated for the record he is ungrateful about finanncial rewards and even his status in Canada as WC.

Also, it feels as if you think Evan is coming back quadless. Yet everything we have read implies the opposite.

I seriously doubt if Evan and Frank believe a quadless program this season or next will make the podium at the biggest events.

I can't predict if Evan will be successful but I know he and Frank are not dummies.

They know what the deal is.....

emdee · Aug 17, 2012

Don't confuse Evan with Chan, who has stated for the record he is ungrateful about finanncial rewards and even his status in Canada as WC.

It is you who confuse Chan.

Dont use Chan's stream of consciousness comment to indicate he is someone whom he is not. He is a gracious and incredibly polite person who made some unguarded " what would it be like IF" comments that most people succumb to at some time or another. The problem is that his meanderings were used against him just prior to a major competition for maximum effect. I am sure he had a harsh lesson to learn here but I would take his frank and open comments before others politically correct comments at any time.

Also, to set you correct, he has NEVER stated he is ungrateful about financial rewards nor did he state that he is ungrateful about his status as WC. All he stated was that there were not too many financial rewards available to skaters in Canada these days. Which is so true and quite sad.

janetfan · Aug 17, 2012

emdee said:
It is you who confuse Chan.

Dont use Chan's stream of consciousness comment to indicate he is someone whom he is not. He is a gracious and incredibly polite person who made some unguarded " what would it be like IF" comments that most people succumb to at some time or another. The problem is that his meanderings were used against him just prior to a major competition for maximum effect. I am sure he had a harsh lesson to learn here but I would take his frank and open comments before others politically correct comments at any time.

Also, to set you correct, he has NEVER stated he is ungrateful about financial rewards nor did he state that he is ungrateful about his status as WC. All he stated was that there were not too many financial rewards available to skaters in Canada these days. Which is so true and quite sad.

Did I hit a nerve?
Sorry about that but pretty sure it was Chan, and not Evan who complained about his financial situation as a champion figure skater.

And we all know it was Chan who said things would be better for him if he represented a different federation.

I can never recall Evan saying "if only I was Russian or Chinese".....

Let's keep it real here........and leave odd excuses like "stream of consciousness" out of it and stick to the facts.

Believe it or not, I admire Patrick for being so HONEST.
Skating needs more of that.

I will never hold it against Patrick for truthfully stating life as a Canadian CoP champion kind of sucks.

I do believe Patrick is one of the greatest skaters who ever lived......but he is not competing in a time or country that cares like they did in the past.

And even Patrick said " I remember when programs were epic."
I give him credit for accepting that he is skating for points ........and not legend status.

If I recall the legendary Toller Cranston said the same thing.

emdee · Aug 17, 2012

Believe it or not, I admire Patrick for being so HONEST.

I do believe Patrick is one of the greatest skaters who ever lived......but he is not competing in a time or country that cares like they did in the past.

Good to know that Janetfan.

However, if you read the interview then you will recall that it was a SofC statement....

janetfan · Aug 17, 2012

emdee said:
However, if you read the interview then you will recall that it was a SofC statement....

Isn't that the point of any interview? :think:

Well maybe not Fox News

Bluebonnet · Aug 17, 2012

janetfan said:
Did I hit a nerve?
Sorry about that but pretty sure it was Chan, and not Evan who complained about his financial situation as a champion figure skater.

And we all know it was Chan who said things would be better for him if he represented a different federation.

I can never recall Evan saying "if only I was Russian or Chinese".....

Let's keep it real here........and leave odd excuses like "stream of consciousness" out of it and stick to the facts.

janetfan said:
Believe it or not, I admire Patrick for being so HONEST.
Skating needs more of that.

I will never hold it against Patrick for truthfully stating life as a Canadian CoP champion kind of sucks.

I do believe Patrick is one of the greatest skaters who ever lived......but he is not competing in a time or country that cares like they did in the past.

And even Patrick said " I remember when programs were epic."
I give him credit for accepting that he is skating for points ........and not legend status.

If I recall the legendary Toller Cranston said the same thing.

So contradicting yourself!

emdee · Aug 17, 2012

Actually janetfan I think only a certain type of interviewer would want to get an interior monologue and the workings and meanderings of a subject's mind. These workings are often without logic or real connective thoughts and are mired with self perception. The line between perception and reality is blurred in these cases.

I think some of the posts in GS also fall into this category. Perception suddenly becomes reality for some posters.

janetfan · Aug 17, 2012

Bluebonnet said:
So contradicting yourself!

I don't think so.

Can you elaborate?

It is possible to point out things and then agree or disagree with them.

Not a contradition just freedom of thought.

janetfan · Aug 17, 2012

emdee said:
Actually janetfan I think only a certain type of interviewer would want to get an interior monologue and the workings and meanderings of a subject's mind. These workings are often without logic or real connective thoughts and are mired with self perception. The line between perception and reality is blurred in these cases.

Was it Huxley or Morrison who said “I believe in a long, prolonged, derangement of the senses in order to obtain the unknown.”

In this case I believe "the unknown" is the same as the truth.

Lord help us if we ever hear from Patrick after a psychedelic experience :laugh:

plushyfan · Aug 17, 2012

janetfan said:
What part of that remains a mystery to the great Plushenko's army of fans?

Maybe Evan is also a fan of Plushy.

Look at his face!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5CxQq1vsRU

http://www.pressball.by/pbonline/other/76679
"У него уже есть три олимпийские медали. Вероятнее всего, Евгения ждет еще одна награда в Сочи. Поэтому мне будет очень интересно навязать ему борьбу. Считаю, он величайший фигурист."

translating: "He already has three Olympic medals. Most likely, Evgeni is waiting for yet another award in Sochi. So I will be very interesting to impose the fight. I think he is the greatest skater."

emdee · Aug 17, 2012

Was it Huxley or Morrison who said “I believe in a long, prolonged, derangement of the senses in order to obtain the unknown.”

I believe it was Morrison but these enhanced sensations are not what is on topic here.
We are talking instead of a more natural stream that is an innate part of his self.

Lord help us if we hear from any skater after a psychedelic experience.

janetfan · Aug 17, 2012

emdee said:
I believe it was Morrison but these enhanced sensations are not what is on topic here.
We are talking instead of a more natural stream that is an innate part of his self.

Lord help us if we hear from any skater after a psychedelic experience.

Ok, fair enough :agree:

On the other hand I sometimes wonder about Johnny, not to forget the late Chris Bowman

And to be honest I don't think it would be so bad to hear Evan open up the way Patrick has over the years

seniorita · Aug 17, 2012

I ve never heard an interview of Bolt, I only saw him breaking records and playing with camera, I dont know what he thinks of his competitors or if he was born poor, I dont know the voice of Uchimura and tha same with ten dozen star athletes I followed in summer olympics. Fans we should stop to tear apart every single word figure skaters say like it is a beaty pageant competition that they need to fake smile and wish world peace, maybe we start facing them just like athletes? For the same reason I found inexcusable the whole drama of Douglas hair and her mum's financials, media and fans couldnt wait her to finish competition and let her enjoy the best moment in her career, we had to learn the whole reality story behind it.

janetfan · Aug 17, 2012

seniorita said:
I ve never heard an interview of Bolt, I only saw him breaking records and playing with camera, I dont know what he thinks of his competitors or if he was born poor, I dont know the voice of Uchimura and tha same with ten dozen star athletes I followed in summer olympics. Fans we should stop to tear apart every single word figure skaters say like it is a beaty pageant competition that they need to fake smile and wish world peace, maybe we start facing them just like athletes? For the same reason I found inexcusable the whole drama of Douglas hair and her mum's financials, media and fans couldnt wait her to finish competition and let her enjoy the best moment in her career, we had to learn the whole reality story behind it.

Not to worry about Gabby or her mum.
They will hopefully not have to worry about money again and will have a nice life.

Gabby is good as gold in USA right now........and nice to see her hard work and family sacrifices pay off.

I went to buy her cereal box yesterday and couldn't find it. Somebody told me it is sold out.

ETA: Here is something from the USA Greek reporter you might enjoy:

http://images.search.yahoo.com/imag...b=13divmmrk&sigi=11kv8oq15&.crumb=RaZwFqJchuD

seniorita · Aug 17, 2012

janetfan said:
ETA: Here is something from the USA Greek reporter you might enjoy:

http://images.search.yahoo.com/imag...b=13divmmrk&sigi=11kv8oq15&.crumb=RaZwFqJchuD

Not only do I enjoy it but I have it as a poster in my bedroom next to The Spice Girls. Thanx

gmyers · Aug 17, 2012

janetfan said:
mathman already posted this link, but here it is again:

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...0120810_1_evan-lysacek-kim-yuna-shep-goldberg

Lysacek's comeback problems last season are unfortunately a common problem with organiztions like ISU and IOC.

Control, control and more control is their credo and athletes and fans be damned.

I agree with some of what you wrote but you seem to assume Lysacek is an ungrateful athlete.

Not sure if that is true but it is easy to see how having an agent like Shep who understands how US Skating and ISU work solved the problem.

Don't confuse Evan with Chan, who has stated for the record he is ungrateful about finanncial rewards and even his status in Canada as WC.

Also, it feels as if you think Evan is coming back quadless. Yet everything we have read implies the opposite.

I seriously doubt if Evan and Frank believe a quadless program this season or next will make the podium at the biggest events.

I can't predict if Evan will be successful but I know he and Frank are not dummies.

They know what the deal is.....

If Lysacek can come back with quads and do them consistent than he could maybe follow winning in 2010 without quads and than win in 2014 with quads. But before they abandoned quads for 2010 said that judges would not give Olympic gold to someone who doesn't do quads and then they switched to saying Lysacek has EVERYTHING jumps and artistry and transitions so quads were irrelevent and only bad skaters did quads. Doing quads meant you were bad at everything else in skating. People post everywhere that Plushenko was very bad at everything in skating but quads so he didn't deserve gold again like he won in 2006.

Without quads Samuel Contesti placed 10th at 2012 worlds. With PCS and GOE and better programs Lysacek could probably place much higher than 10th. It only takes one skater to challenge the conventinol wisdom that doing quads is important in skating.

Tonichelle · Aug 17, 2012

If Lysacek can come back with quads and do them consistent than he could maybe follow winning in 2010 without quads and than win in 2014 with quads.

I'd honestly love to see it!

From what I can remember of the short interview, Evan seems very realistic about his comeback. He admitted that he has to look at training differently both due to his age (which they all laughed at) and because of the changes of the sport. I think Evan knows he's got an off chance of making the podium, but there must be something he sees in the competition that makes him think "I can do it." I don't think it's delusions, or denial. Every interview by other skaters about him say no one works harder, and he's a smart competitor. The only thing that could really sideline a decent comeback is injury - which he's been prone to.

janetfan · Aug 17, 2012

plushyfan said:
Maybe Evan is also a fan of Plushy. Look at his face!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5CxQq1vsRU

http://www.pressball.by/pbonline/other/76679
"У него уже есть три олимпийские медали. Вероятнее всего, Евгения ждет еще одна награда в Сочи. Поэтому мне будет очень интересно навязать ему борьбу. Считаю, он величайший фигурист."

translating: "He already has three Olympic medals. Most likely, Evgeni is waiting for yet another award in Sochi. So I will be very interesting to impose the fight. I think he is the greatest skater."

Hear Evan's own words about Plushy.
Chan fans might note this was after winning the OGM, and going for 24 hours without sleep.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6m7CjKFB_o

I think this interview shows the difference between a man and a spoiled athlete.

Like him or not Evan handled himself very well.

Lysacek announces return to competitive skating

Skater Boy

ImaginaryPogue

janetfan

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