State of American Ladies: 2012-13 Season | Page 22 | Golden Skate

State of American Ladies: 2012-13 Season

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
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Dec 27, 2009
Speaking of Gracie, hoping the good vibes extend to her twin sister Carly, who will be competing for a Nationals spot at Midwestern sectionals tomorrow and Monday. What a great experience for both of them if Carly got in. ::crossed fingers::

Carly sounds optimistic, according to her tweet:
Having great practices! Ready for my short tomorrow!!! :) #Midwesterns2013

ETA: Midwesterns looks like a blood bath -- probably good Gracie got a bye by being at COR -- one more much needed spot for the senior girls. Also Hannah Miller would have been at Mids if it wasn't for her bye from making the JGPF.
 
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ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Speaking of Gracie, hoping the good vibes extend to her twin sister Carly, who will be competing for a Nationals spot at Midwestern sectionals tomorrow and Monday. What a great experience for both of them if Carly got in. ::crossed fingers::

Carly sounds optimistic, according to her tweet:


ETA: Midwesterns looks like a blood bath -- probably good Gracie got a bye by being at COR -- one more much needed spot for the senior girls. Also Hannah Miller would have been at Mids if it wasn't for her bye from making the JGPF.

Agree about Gracie's bye through Midwesterns -- it gives one more spot to the senior ladies and will increase the competition at Nats. I feel that Gracie should've competed at a JGP or two, just to get some practice running through her programs. It might've made Skate Canada less painful to watch...
 

Skater Boy

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Feb 24, 2012
Agree about Gracie's bye through Midwesterns -- it gives one more spot to the senior ladies and will increase the competition at Nats. I feel that Gracie should've competed at a JGP or two, just to get some practice running through her programs. It might've made Skate Canada less painful to watch...

Good point but I don't think you can do both SGP and JGP. Or is it that once you skate SGP you can't go to Jr world's?
 

ForeverFish

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Aug 21, 2012
Good point but I don't think you can do both SGP and JGP. Or is it that once you skate SGP you can't go to Jr world's?

Christina Gao did both SGP (5th at CoC and 10th at CoR) and Jr Worlds (7th) last season, so I don't think that's it. I'm not sure about JGP and SGP, but as far as I can find the only rule is that of the age requirement.
 

R.D.

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Jul 26, 2003
I feel that Gracie should've competed at a JGP or two, just to get some practice running through her programs. It might've made Skate Canada less painful to watch...

No, let her deal with and get used to the pressure. It's only going to intensify.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
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Christina Gao did both SGP (5th at CoC and 10th at CoR) and Jr Worlds (7th) last season, so I don't think that's it. I'm not sure about JGP and SGP, but as far as I can find the only rule is that of the age requirement.

There's a new rule in effect this year that states that a team cannot do both JGP and SGP.

I don't see the point of sending Gracie to junior world's later in the season either. If she doesn't get a Worlds berth, they should send her to 4CC instead.
 

silverlake22

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Joined
Nov 12, 2009
There's a new rule in effect this year that states that a team cannot do both JGP and SGP.

I don't see the point of sending Gracie to junior world's later in the season either. If she doesn't get a Worlds berth, they should send her to 4CC instead.

Yes but if she is say 5th or 6th (I don't expect it but it isn't out of the question that she'd place behind Wagner, Zawadzki, Gao, Nagasu and/or Czisny at Nationals) she wouldn't make the 4CC team most likely, and USFS would probably give her JW as she'd have a good chance of winning and the ISU championship points would help her WS and she'd get another shot to improve her SB. I think she will probably make Worlds and/or 4CC most likely, but if she doesn't, I do think she will be sent to Junior Worlds again.
 

silverlake22

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Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Gold actually completed the 3F-1L-3S combo at Skate Detroit and at U.S. International Classic. She probably would have done it here if not for the wonky landing of that particular flip.

I say we see where Gao is next week before we make any sweeping judgements. Gao has gone through a growth spurt in the last year or so and I think that really held her back last season. Gao is a year older than Gracie, but for some reason her visit with the puberty monster came later.

Gao's growth spurt/puberty troubles actually affected her most during the 2010-2011 season. She was strong at her JGP events, but then Orser talked about how she had grown more and it really affected her at the JGPF, then at Nationals she was a bit better but still adjusting, not as strong as at her JGP events and that trend continued on through JW.

Last season Christina's struggles were due to being injured almost the entire summer. I remember she just started jumping right before Champs Camp and did watered down programs there. CoC wasn't bad considering she was just getting off an injury, but then she got a virus and that was likely why she bombed so terribly at COR. Nationals she seemed better and skated quite well, then I think by the time JW rolled around she was maybe a bit discouraged/frustrated by having placed 5th at Nationals and getting sent to JW for the 3rd year in a row, plus she had been accepted to Harvard by then and was likely very caught up in the whole graduation/college/deciding her future process so skating might not have been as much of a priority by that time, thus explaining her solid but uninspiring performances there. Christina did go through puberty late, but last season I do not think that was really the issue.

Anyways is Gracie still growing? A lot of posters keep saying she looks very coltish and all-limbs, I don't really see it, to me she looks grown and her body type is just not a curvy one. Her limbs don't seem that long for her body compared to skaters like Polina K, Polina S, Christina, etc. It's true she doesn't have any hips so maybe that would mean she is still going through puberty but she isn't flat chested so to me she just seems to have more of a typical gymnast build. But so many others say she's coltish I'm probably biased and she could grow more and that could affect the jumps.
 

jaylee

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Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Last season Christina's struggles were due to being injured almost the entire summer. I remember she just started jumping right before Champs Camp and did watered down programs there. CoC wasn't bad considering she was just getting off an injury, but then she got a virus and that was likely why she bombed so terribly at COR. Nationals she seemed better and skated quite well, then I think by the time JW rolled around she was maybe a bit discouraged/frustrated by having placed 5th at Nationals and getting sent to JW for the 3rd year in a row, plus she had been accepted to Harvard by then and was likely very caught up in the whole graduation/college/deciding her future process so skating might not have been as much of a priority by that time, thus explaining her solid but uninspiring performances there. Christina did go through puberty late, but last season I do not think that was really the issue.

Wow, you have a seemingly logical explanation to justify every one of Christina's poor placements. :rolleye: I can accept the injury explanation, but then you justify her poor performance at 2012 JW as having gotten "accepted to Harvard...likely caught up in the whole graduation/college/deciding her future process." :laugh: Just a wee. bit. overboard. Maybe Christina just hasn't brought her best to the biggest competitions, to Nationals and Junior Worlds? That would explain why she's frequently faltered at each, and never been higher than 5th at Nationals, and why she's never even been the top ranked American at Junior Worlds.

Many other ladies skaters have gone through puberty, injuries, and other external factors, and still managed to make international podiums, which Christina didn't in the previous two seasons, aside from two JGP events with very weak fields. It's not like Adelina didn't have her own struggles with puberty and injuries and pressure last season, but she pulled it together and managed to podium at 2012 Junior Worlds. Given the amount of hype and publicity Christina received in the summer of 2010, it was expected that she would have accomplished more by now. But she really didn't make her mark. The silver at Skate America is the first major accomplishment that she's had since her bronze medal at the 2009 JGPF. It's a great accomplishment, but you can't just discount how lackluster her previous record was; you still have to wonder if her previous record is more indicative of Christina's potential or if this one event is. I agree that we should wait and see with TEB, and obviously Nationals.

Her record aside, my problem with Christina is her artistry, which just hasn't progressed enough. Her SP is fine, though not groundbreaking, but her FS is really unsuited for her, she can't express the tango music at all. After Skate America, I wondered if I had been too hard on her in the past. But compare her FS to Kanako Murakami's, and Kanako's just blows Christina out of the water in terms of interpretation. And I watched Akiko Suzuki's Libertango from years ago, and the first 30 seconds of her program she expresses more of the music than Christina does in her entire FS. :p
 

drivingmissdaisy

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Feb 17, 2010
My only skepticism about Christina is that she has skated ONE good senior event, and a few decent junior events. Her biggest win has been the Junior Midwestern Sectionals in 2008-09. I don't think she she would be part of the conversation if the US women weren't so weak (aside from Ashley and Gracie). Her programs at Skate America were very good but she doesn't have any sort of history being able to deliver that level consistently.

I only bring this up because people are assuming she has gotten everything sorted out based on one good result.
 

Jammers

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Gao's growth spurt/puberty troubles actually affected her most during the 2010-2011 season. She was strong at her JGP events, but then Orser talked about how she had grown more and it really affected her at the JGPF, then at Nationals she was a bit better but still adjusting, not as strong as at her JGP events and that trend continued on through JW.

Last season Christina's struggles were due to being injured almost the entire summer. I remember she just started jumping right before Champs Camp and did watered down programs there. CoC wasn't bad considering she was just getting off an injury, but then she got a virus and that was likely why she bombed so terribly at COR. Nationals she seemed better and skated quite well, then I think by the time JW rolled around she was maybe a bit discouraged/frustrated by having placed 5th at Nationals and getting sent to JW for the 3rd year in a row, plus she had been accepted to Harvard by then and was likely very caught up in the whole graduation/college/deciding her future process so skating might not have been as much of a priority by that time, thus explaining her solid but uninspiring performances there. Christina did go through puberty late, but last season I do not think that was really the issue.

Anyways is Gracie still growing? A lot of posters keep saying she looks very coltish and all-limbs, I don't really see it, to me she looks grown and her body type is just not a curvy one. Her limbs don't seem that long for her body compared to skaters like Polina K, Polina S, Christina, etc. It's true she doesn't have any hips so maybe that would mean she is still going through puberty but she isn't flat chested so to me she just seems to have more of a typical gymnast build. But so many others say she's coltish I'm probably biased and she could grow more and that could affect the jumps.
Gracie lost some weight compared to last season but she's not any taller then last season.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
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Dec 27, 2009
My only skepticism about Christina is that she has skated ONE good senior event, and a few decent junior events. Her biggest win has been the Junior Midwestern Sectionals in 2008-09. I don't think she she would be part of the conversation if the US women weren't so weak (aside from Ashley and Gracie). Her programs at Skate America were very good but she doesn't have any sort of history being able to deliver that level consistently.

I think it's ok to be skeptical, but I think wait and see applies the other way -- I think Christina has a very good coaching environment in Boston right now and I think she is thriving having a more active training base as opposed to the few elite skaters at the private club in Toronto. Again, I'm going to wait to see how she does in TEB....but she looked the best I've seen her at SA.
 

Jammers

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No, let her deal with and get used to the pressure. It's only going to intensify.

Agreed. Going back to Junior Worlds really doesn't do anything for Gracie at this point. She'S a Senior Lady now and needs to get used to it. Just look at how the experience at SC helped her at COR.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Gao's growth spurt/puberty troubles actually affected her most during the 2010-2011 season. She was strong at her JGP events, but then Orser talked about how she had grown more and it really affected her at the JGPF, then at Nationals she was a bit better but still adjusting, not as strong as at her JGP events and that trend continued on through JW.

Last season Christina's struggles were due to being injured almost the entire summer. I remember she just started jumping right before Champs Camp and did watered down programs there. CoC wasn't bad considering she was just getting off an injury, but then she got a virus and that was likely why she bombed so terribly at COR. Nationals she seemed better and skated quite well, then I think by the time JW rolled around she was maybe a bit discouraged/frustrated by having placed 5th at Nationals and getting sent to JW for the 3rd year in a row, plus she had been accepted to Harvard by then and was likely very caught up in the whole graduation/college/deciding her future process so skating might not have been as much of a priority by that time, thus explaining her solid but uninspiring performances there. Christina did go through puberty late, but last season I do not think that was really the issue.

:laugh: You know, this reminds me so much of the vocal Czisny fans that keep making excuses for her every time she screws up. Happened as recently as last season after Worlds.


My only skepticism about Christina is that she has skated ONE good senior event, and a few decent junior events. Her biggest win has been the Junior Midwestern Sectionals in 2008-09. I don't think she she would be part of the conversation if the US women weren't so weak (aside from Ashley and Gracie). Her programs at Skate America were very good but she doesn't have any sort of history being able to deliver that level consistently.

I only bring this up because people are assuming she has gotten everything sorted out based on one good result.

Deserves to be quoted and bolded. Got to look at the track record, folks. The stats would indicate that the SA result is a fluke, but it's up to her now to prove that it isn't. Show us at TEB AND AGAIN at Nationals why we should have your name in the ring with Wagner, Gold and Zawadzki. (with her being in college, my expectations remain low)
 
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Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
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Deserves to be quoted and bolded. Got to look at the track record, folks. The stats would indicate that the SA result is a fluke, but it's up to her now to prove that it isn't. Show us at TEB AND AGAIN at Nationals why we should have your name in the ring with Wagner, Gold and Zawadzki. (with her being in college, my expectations remain low)

Well, I hope appeasing to skating board posters isn't top of mind for Gao. :laugh:
Again, nothing is guaranteed, but I think Gao is at least in the mix to at least maintain her standing at this point, her future performances, namely at TEB will tell how far she could go.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
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Ha, you know what I mean. In layman's terms, she's still got a LOT to prove.

Yeah I knew what you meant, mainly commented for levity. :) Yes, she's got much to prove. But I think she can stand up to the challenge.
 

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Anyways is Gracie still growing? A lot of posters keep saying she looks very coltish and all-limbs, I don't really see it, to me she looks grown and her body type is just not a curvy one. Her limbs don't seem that long for her body compared to skaters like Polina K, Polina S, Christina, etc. It's true she doesn't have any hips so maybe that would mean she is still going through puberty but she isn't flat chested so to me she just seems to have more of a typical gymnast build. But so many others say she's coltish I'm probably biased and she could grow more and that could affect the jumps.

No, I don't think so. She's seventeen--everyone is different, but most girls have stopped growing by that age. I certainly don't think she looks coltish--especially not when compared to Julia L & Co.--but she isn't heavy, either. Her build is fine for a figure skater (esp. the long, lean legs) and the fact that she doesn't have much excess weight around her chest and hips makes jumping and spinning much easier.
 

ForeverFish

Medalist
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Aug 21, 2012
Wow, you have a seemingly logical explanation to justify every one of Christina's poor placements. :rolleye: I can accept the injury explanation, but then you justify her poor performance at 2012 JW as having gotten "accepted to Harvard...likely caught up in the whole graduation/college/deciding her future process." :laugh: Just a wee. bit. overboard.

I certainly don't agree with trying to justify all of Christina's mistakes, but this particular explanation isn't too impossible, IMO. Remember that she even considered retiring from figure skating to pursue a full-time college career...clearly, she had some misgivings about whether or not she'd be able to balance school and skating.
 
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