State of American Ladies: 2012-13 Season | Page 23 | Golden Skate

State of American Ladies: 2012-13 Season

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Deserves to be quoted and bolded. Got to look at the track record, folks. The stats would indicate that the SA result is a fluke, but it's up to her now to prove that it isn't. Show us at TEB AND AGAIN at Nationals why we should have your name in the ring with Wagner, Gold and Zawadzki. (with her being in college, my expectations remain low)

TEB is looking shaky for Gao at this point...even with the performance she put out at SA (entirely possible to repeat), I wonder if she'll be able to surpass Wagner, Tuktamysheva, and Lipnitskaia to medal. None of them are going to yield an inch if they can help it--Wagner needs to show that she will remain consistently excellent this season now that she's the "leader" of the US ladies; Lipnitskaia will be out for blood after CoC; Tukta will want to medal (maybe even repeat as champion) to make her 0.04-point loss at SC a little more bearable--so it'll be up to Gao to cover the remaining ground.
 
Last edited:

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Speaking of Gracie, hoping the good vibes extend to her twin sister Carly, who will be competing for a Nationals spot at Midwestern sectionals tomorrow and Monday. What a great experience for both of them if Carly got in. ::crossed fingers::

After the SP, Carly is in fifth place, about three points away from the top four. Is it possible that we'll see both Gold sisters at Nats this year?
 

jaylee

Medalist
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
I certainly don't agree with trying to justify all of Christina's mistakes, but this particular explanation isn't too impossible, IMO. Remember that she even considered retiring from figure skating to pursue a full-time college career...clearly, she had some misgivings about whether or not she'd be able to balance school and skating.

It's possible, but unlikely within the context that silverlake22 tries to put Christina's results, in which her own lack of competitive nerve is never to blame (or even questioned) but rather always something else--injury, puberty/growth spurt, illness, getting accepted into Harvard, etc. If a disappointing result just happened once or a few times, then these explanations could each be individually possible, but all together, looking at the results, I think the results show that Christina Gao has not been a consistent competitor during this quad. People give the young Russian ladies skaters a hard time for being inconsistent, but at the very least, they've racked up far more titles than Christina has.

Still, I am very curious as to how she'll do at TEB.
 

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
It's possible, but unlikely within the context that silverlake22 tries to put Christina's results, in which her own lack of competitive nerve is never to blame (or even questioned) but rather always something else--injury, puberty/growth spurt, illness, getting accepted into Harvard, etc. If a disappointing result just happened once or a few times, then these explanations could each be individually possible, but all together, looking at the results, I think the results show that Christina Gao has not been a consistent competitor during this quad. People give the young Russian ladies skaters a hard time for being inconsistent, but at the very least, they've racked up far more titles than Christina has.

Still, I am very curious as to how she'll do at TEB.

Christina has been consistent...just not consistently good. Unfortunately, her track record right now points to the "SA was a fluke" option.

The thing about the young Russians--Tukta, Lipnitskaia, Sotnikova--is that they will carry most or all of Russian ladies' figure skating on their shoulders in a few short years. If they're not consistent now, that doesn't show much promise for the future, and these federations don't like to gamble if they can help it. Christina, on the other hand, is most definitely not who the USFSA is depending on right now. Especially not with Ashley Wagner emerging as a clear leader and a very likely Worlds medalist this year, Gracie Gold unsurpassed in the US in terms of technique, and Agnes Zawadzki proving herself an able competitor.

Please see my comment above regarding Gao's chances at TEB.
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Well, I hope appeasing to skating board posters isn't top of mind for Gao. :laugh:
Again, nothing is guaranteed, but I think Gao is at least in the mix to at least maintain her standing at this point, her future performances, namely at TEB will tell how far she could go.

With the medals of Adelina and Gracie, and probably Osmond, not counting, Christina could probably make the GPF with a 3rd or maybe even 4th place showing at TEB. If she manages to do that, I think people will definitely start taking her more seriously. Looking at the field at TEB, it is tough, but 3rd or 4th isn't out of the question, and either way she'd qualify ahead of Kanako, her case would be helped by her silver against someone like Agnes, and with her 4th place even if Tuk gets silver, Christina could still slot in ahead due to the total score tiebreaker. Soo idk. Making the GPF does not seem out of the realms of possibility for Gao, and if she makes it and she and Ashley are the only ones to qualify (I don't expect Agnes to qualify realistically even though I'm very pleased she seems to be getting it together), that should definitely have some pull going into Nats and she might receive more PCS boost there than she would otherwise.
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
I certainly don't agree with trying to justify all of Christina's mistakes, but this particular explanation isn't too impossible, IMO. Remember that she even considered retiring from figure skating to pursue a full-time college career...clearly, she had some misgivings about whether or not she'd be able to balance school and skating.

I'm not trying to justify all her mistakes, I was just trying to point out that I don't think her issues last season were particularly puberty related. Anyways, given her abilities and reputation as a skater compared to the Russian girls, it makes sense that she hasn't landed on the podium as many times as they have. Gao is a great jumper but she has a flutz, up until this season the 2a was a big problem, she isn't particularly flexible and her spins and spirals are thus not a strength or big point-getter, and her introverted style doesn't lend itself to huge PCS. Christina frankly needs to skate better than someone like Adelina or Tuk or Julia does to garner the same placement because those three have better and/or more consistent jumps, harder combinations/layouts, more flexibility and better spins and spirals, project more and, whether it's warranted or not, get better PCS. Gao is a very good skater but she's never had a reputation as a wonderbaby and she didn't dominate the JGP at a young age like the Russian girls did, so she never built up the reputation to boost her PCS and that combined with some of her limitations as a skater explain why when she makes mistakes she falls off the podium more easily.

At SA, I definitely saw improvement in Christina's spins, 2a, and overall presentation, but that being said, she earned her silver because she skated 2 clean programs. The GP is very competitive, some people have to skate cleanly to win while others don't and that is just the reality. Also if Adelina continues to bomb and Julia and Tuk's last GP showings come to be more indicative of how they usually skate, we might see their PCS drop a bit and finishing OTP become a more frequent reality for them. I mean, we've seen what's happened to Flatt and Zhang, and even Korobeynikova. I thought she skated pretty well at COR and was a bit surprised by her scores, and I think had she not blown it at Worlds and placed 19th, her scores and PCS and placement would have been a lot higher and the judges would try to protect her with very generous scores the way they did for Adelina and Alena.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
After the SP, Carly is in fifth place, about three points away from the top four. Is it possible that we'll see both Gold sisters at Nats this year?

I think she will be fighting for that fourth spot with Morgan Bell and Nina Jiang (she doesn't look too great right now, but she is the reigning sectional champion, so perhaps she can surprise).
 

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
I think she will be fighting for that fourth spot with Morgan Bell and Nina Jiang (she doesn't look too great right now, but she is the reigning sectional champion, so perhaps she can surprise).

Sadly, while I love to see some new blood in the Nats program, most of us already have a pretty solid idea of who will be on the podium--the "big" names like Wagner, Gold, and Zawadzki.

Edit: I checked, and if Gold had skated cleanly at CoR, it would have put her above 180--or in second place at Nats last season.
 

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
At SA, I definitely saw improvement in Christina's spins, 2a, and overall presentation, but that being said, she earned her silver because she skated 2 clean programs. The GP is very competitive, some people have to skate cleanly to win while others don't and that is just the reality. Also if Adelina continues to bomb and Julia and Tuk's last GP showings come to be more indicative of how they usually skate, we might see their PCS drop a bit and finishing OTP become a more frequent reality for them.

This, I doubt. You saw the look on Julia's face after placing second at CoC, and to the Olympic silver medalist of all people. She's not going to lose that gold medal again. Tuktamysheva should be mostly recovered from injury by TEB and since she is the defending champion, she'll be a favorite to medal as well. I would be very, very shell-shocked if finishing OTP ever became their reality.
 

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
With the medals of Adelina and Gracie, and probably Osmond, not counting, Christina could probably make the GPF with a 3rd or maybe even 4th place showing at TEB. If she manages to do that, I think people will definitely start taking her more seriously. Looking at the field at TEB, it is tough, but 3rd or 4th isn't out of the question, and either way she'd qualify ahead of Kanako, her case would be helped by her silver against someone like Agnes, and with her 4th place even if Tuk gets silver, Christina could still slot in ahead due to the total score tiebreaker. Soo idk. Making the GPF does not seem out of the realms of possibility for Gao, and if she makes it and she and Ashley are the only ones to qualify (I don't expect Agnes to qualify realistically even though I'm very pleased she seems to be getting it together), that should definitely have some pull going into Nats and she might receive more PCS boost there than she would otherwise.

Third is unlikely for her, IMO, unless she can pull herself together and defeat Wagner, Tuk, and Lipnitskaia. I just don't see it happening, even if all three potential medalists skate imperfectly. Gao lacks the PCS necessary to surpass them. Fourth is possible.

We've still got NHK after TEB, and I think that Suzuki will earn at least a silver medal there, putting her in the territory for the GPF. Judging based on previous consistency and first-GPs, here's who I predict will qualify for the GPF, in no particular order:

1. Ashley Wagner (needs a medal - has gold)
2. Julia Lipnitskaia (needs a medal - has silver)
3. Kiira Korpi (already established - gold & bronze)
4. Elizaveta Tuktamysheva (needs gold or silver - has 4th)
5. Mao Asada (needs a medal - has gold)
6. Akiko Suzuki (needs a medal - has silver)
 
Last edited:

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
If you told me at the beginning of the season Korpi and Machida were gonna qualify, I would've laughed at you. Just sayin'
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
Sadly, while I love to see some new blood in the Nats program, most of us already have a pretty solid idea of who will be on the podium--the "big" names like Wagner, Gold, and Zawadzki.

Edit: I checked, and if Gold had skated cleanly at CoR, it would have put her above 180--or in second place at Nats last season.

Well sure, but that's not what I was talking about....
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
As I keep saying, Wagner needs help on top of the American pyramid. So far, only Gold seems determined to join her up there, although Gold still needs to do a better job in the freeskate.

Zawadzki's still a bit shaky in the FS...she can be a solid SP skater, though, so don't be shocked if she's in the lead again at Nationals. I also think a solid SP is essential for Gold if she is to contend. The FS is where Wagner is most consistent so the others don't have much room for error there. The reason why Wagner kept getting beat year after year at Nationals was because her competition not only nailed their SP, but their FS as well and left no room at all for her to make up any ground.
 

mskater93

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 22, 2005
Gold actually completed the 3F-1L-3S combo at Skate Detroit and at U.S. International Classic. She probably would have done it here if not for the wonky landing of that particular flip.
Yes, she released her checking shoulder anticipating the 1/2 loop take off here which is what caused the double three out. She nails that sucker at home REPEATEDLY, so expect to see it at Nationals.
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Sadly, while I love to see some new blood in the Nats program, most of us already have a pretty solid idea of who will be on the podium--the "big" names like Wagner, Gold, and Zawadzki.

I think 3rd is up for grabs. Agnes winning 3rd last year was a bit of a surprise (a lot of us predicted Mirai on the podium) and she could certainly repeat. Christina, Angela or Mirai also have a shot at the podium.
 

Sk8Boi

Match Penalty
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Czizny, Flatt, CaroLINE Zhang and Nagasu all need to retire from competitive skating. This would certainly allow USFS to focus on the future of Ladies' Skating in the US.

Czizny is too old, too injured and a inconsistent in competition. She had years of USFS support and did not perform competitively at the international level in any consistent way. No World medals, one GPF medal.

Flatt is now too busy, too injured and too disrespected on an international level (low low low PCS) to continue.

Zhang is too out of shape, too slow and too disrespected (low low low low PCS) on an international level to continue.

Nagasu is too poor a jumper and isn't improving in regard to being competitive for the US to continue.

USFS should cut off all support for these four skaters, now past their dates in showing potential or championship medal, and focus on skaters with potential who can actually develop into winners.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
As I keep saying, Wagner needs help on top of the American pyramid. So far, only Gold seems determined to join her up there, although Gold still needs to do a better job in the freeskate.

Zawadzki's still a bit shaky in the FS...she can be a solid SP skater, though, so don't be shocked if she's in the lead again at Nationals. I also think a solid SP is essential for Gold if she is to contend. The FS is where Wagner is most consistent so the others don't have much room for error there. The reason why Wagner kept getting beat year after year at Nationals was because her competition not only nailed their SP, but their FS as well and left no room at all for her to make up any ground.

I think (hope) Gold will be working hard on her FS these next two months leading into Nats...she has the beautiful lines and the technique under her belt, so the main focus should be on interpretation--skating TO the music--and, of course, plopping in that 3-1/2-3 somewhere. I don't think she'll have any problem nailing the SP, especially on home turf and in front of an enthusiastic crowd, and she can score massive points if everything is there. Unless a SC-scale meltdown occurs again, I don't doubt we'll be seeing her on the podium.
 
Top