Canada's "other" men | Golden Skate

Canada's "other" men

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Chan obviously dominates discussion, but I think it's worth having a thread to discuss the other competitors. Canada doesn't have the field that Japan or the USA has, but it's still quite an interesting one.

Inspired by Anthony Kan and his SP. Gutsy, fascinating, with some truly unique moments.
 

Butterscotch17

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 26, 2012
I like Jeremy Ten and was disappointed that he didn't get a Grand Prix, especially after he was third at Canadian Nationals last year.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Is there any other canadian men other than Chan??? LOL Sadly it is a dessert of talent after Chan. Reynolds has not shown growth artistically, skating skills, spins or for that matter jumps. He isn't more consistent or getting more difficult quads and his pcs have not improved at all. And sadly he is know for his rather asthetically annoying appearance especially his hair. He has had a couple of years to show some development but he hasn't and he can't move out of the 10 to 15th range without some improvement and consistency in those quads and 3A especially if you aren't great pc wise. His packaging is just not overly attractive. Ten had promise but can't jump and he is penalized for his lack of technicality. Rogozoine maybe the best hope. I am not sold on Baldwin? i say bring back Buttle - no seriously.:)
 

blue_idealist

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 25, 2006
I like Jeremy Ten and was disappointed that he didn't get a Grand Prix, especially after he was third at Canadian Nationals last year.

It's too bad Jeremy Ten is injured and he's also really inconsistent, even when not injured. He has a great artistic sense, I think. I still think Rogozine is the best hope though, or maybe Firus.
 
Joined
Mar 11, 2011
It's too bad Jeremy Ten is injured and he's also really inconsistent, even when not injured. He has a great artistic sense, I think. I still think Rogozine is the best hope though, or maybe Firus.

ITA. Will he ever be able to reach the top?
 

nadster

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 1, 2004
It's too bad Jeremy Ten is injured and he's also really inconsistent, even when not injured. He has a great artistic sense, I think. I still think Rogozine is the best hope though, or maybe Firus.

Firus is just as inconsistent as Ten although he is younger than Ten. Still does not have a triple axel though. Firus is good on the PCS side but the jumps still aren't there consistently yet.

Rogozine is very consistent internationally but always seems to come undone at nationals. Still the best bet for now if he can finally show some consistency at nationals.

Still don't think any of these skaters are the next one. I think Nam Nguyen has more potential long term.

It is good that Nam Nguyen has changed coaches and has gotten away from Mcleod. This is a move Kevin Reynolds should do and really he should have done it years ago while he was still competing junior internationally. Nam would have no chance into blossoming into a good senior if he stayed with Mcleod.

Nam is several years off though and is obviously going through growth spurts and technique changes this year.

IMO , the Canadian men's cupboard is even barer than the women. There are at least glimmers of hope among the women and the technical content of the novices and junior ladies is at least improving. The technical content of the Canadian men at the junior and novice levels is going down particularly at the novice level.
 
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chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
I agree that the men coming up behind Chan aren't all that promising.

Reynolds seems stuck in a technical rut that he can't get out of. He's now 22, and it doesn't seem likely that even if he left McLeod, he could successfully re-learn his jump technique.

Ten seems perpetually injured, and even when healthy, he is an inconsistent jumper.

Rogozine is a powerful jumper, but he is more a Stojko type skater than a Browning. His presentation skills need considerable work.

Nam is only 14, so he is still a work in progress. At least he has gotten away from McLeod. Roman Sadovsky is also very young, and does show some promise.

I agree that there are currently more promising young women than men.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
f that's good that Nam his away from McLeod. Sadly for whatever reason she has not been able to fully utilize the talents of her skaters and they tend to have axel problems. I am not sure whose fault but for whatever reason her skaters have all sorts of problems - mentally, jumps, consistency - but show potential - Sandhu, Leung et all.

I am sure this sounds crazy but I actually think Buttle who retired before 2010 could come back and compete and easily win Canada's second men's spot and have a great chance stil lat top 8 despite not training a quad and using the axel in a limited fashion. His PCS imho are equal to Patrick and Daisuke. He won't score as high because of his limited technical skills though. His spins are better than Chan's the only problem would be his limited arsenal of jumps but he still has the triple axel and the triple flip triple toe. Regardless of pcs his tes are still second best to Chan in Canada axel or no axel. He could help Canada at the Oly's by doing a clean short triple flip triple toe, triple lutz and triple axel. Let Chan skate the free. Canada is not like the US which has a huge pool of top level men.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
That's awesome. I still think though that Jeffrey Buttle with his current skates in Japan would be No. 2 in Canada; he should come back even if he couldn't win a medal individually he could win one as a team member. I am just amazed his quality is more than there = it actually competes with Chan and Tak.
 

waxel

Final Flight
Joined
Jun 18, 2005
I've always liked Ten too. If he could ever put it all together ... how many times have we said that about how many skaters?
 

geoskate

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 22, 2005
Time to bump this up, since two of the 'other men' competed at Skate Canada - Eladj Baldé and Liam Firus. Eladj skated well in the short program, where he met the ISU technical requirements standard for Worlds, and less well in the long program, where he missed the ISU long program standard by about 4 points. His skates met the ISU technical 4CC standards in both the short and long programs, however. Liam had already met the ISU long program standard for 4CC at Salt Lake City, but not the short program standard. He made that here. (He probably met that standard last season already. I haven't checked). He did not meet the Worlds technical standard in either the short or the long program.

Right now for the 'other men' that have skated internationally this season the ranking by scores is (leaving out Patrick Chan):
1. Eladj Baldé 199.94 (Skate Canada)
2. Andrei Rogozine 196.27 (Nebelhorn)
3. Kevin Reynolds 192.12 (Ondrej Nepala)
4. Jeremy Ten 172.96 (Salt Lake City)
5. Liam Firus 169.67 (Skate Canada)

All of these men, plus Patrick Chan, have met the ISU 4CC technical standard. However, only three men have met the Worlds standard: Patrick Chan, Kevin Reynolds (last season) and Andrei Rogozine. I suppose if Eladj, Jeremy or Liam make the podium at Canadians, they would still have a chance to meet the ISU standard at 4CC or at one of the other Senior Bs.

(and I suppose we could throw in Nam Nguyen at 171.56, from JGP Istanbul, although he's been skating on the junior circuit and would not be eligible for 4CC because of age, I believe).
 
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museksk8r

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 31, 2006
Country
United-States
That's awesome. I still think though that Jeffrey Buttle with his current skates in Japan would be No. 2 in Canada; he should come back even if he couldn't win a medal individually he could win one as a team member. I am just amazed his quality is more than there = it actually competes with Chan and Tak.

IMO, Jeffrey Buttle > Patrick Chan.
 

geoskate

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 22, 2005
The revised list after Cup of China is:

1. Kevin Reynolds 202.07 (Cup of China)
2. Eladj Baldé 199.94 (Skate Canada)
3. Andrei Rogozine 196.27 (Nebelhorn)
4. Jeremy Ten 172.96 (Salt Lake City)
5. Liam Firus 169.67 (Skate Canada)

Kevin Reynolds doesn't have as much of a lead on the other men as I expected he would have based on last season. If either Eladj or Andrei can add a quad to their programs, they could both become definite threats to Kevin's second place ranking in Canada. Jeremy's progress is hard to predict, since he always seems to be fighting injury.
 

nadster

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 1, 2004
Kevin Reynolds doesn't have as much of a lead on the other men as I expected he would have based on last season. If either Eladj or Andrei can add a quad to their programs, they could both become definite threats to Kevin's second place ranking in Canada. Jeremy's progress is hard to predict, since he always seems to be fighting injury.

I can just say that Andrei just landed a fully rotated quad toe in the Central Ontario sectional competition. Granted there was no pressure on him, as he would have a bye to nationals anyway. He messed up the flip combo but landing a quad in competition is a big step for him.

Hopefully Andrei can skate well at nationals as historically he has struggled there even with amazing international performances. I think that he and Kevin will finish 2nd and 3rd at nationals in some order provided that Andrei does not bomb nationals. Andrei has never skated well in senior nationals even in the year when he won JW.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Surely someone including Skate Canada must be scratching their heads and talking to Reynolds and or his coach. Artistically he has not improved. His techincal elements are consistently inconsistent and this needs to be addressed. He has to have those quads with so little else going for him. For a while it seemed more logical for him to do 2 quad sals in the long and skip the triple axel. I am not sure why he can't see some of the things that have been very apparent - Joanne MacLeod for whatever reason can't develop champions, for whatever reason the axel is a problem with her students as well as jump consistency. I wonder if it is money - Kevin lives in Port Coquitlam BC and BC isn't know for its coaches so much right now. It is too bad he couldn't work with Orser and some of those choreographers like Wilson and Nichol. A stylist (Skater Boy will do it for free) might help too even though I appreciate it may be his look - sometimes one's individuality has its costs. How about a jazzy short program. I always hoped jeremy ten might make his move but that seems less and less likely - a lot of these skaters other than Nam are older than Chan or around his age. And those younger aren't that much. I have to say if Chan places say 4th at worlds this year Canada will likely be down to 2 skaters. It really is unfair to put so much pressure on Chan to win to save 3 spots - the no 2 and no 3 guys have to step up to the plate (Jeffrey if your are listening the ice is calling you!!!!)
 
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