What's Your Take on the USA Team for Worlds?

Joesitz said:

Don and Hunt, imo, are America's hope for Pairs.

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Joe,
ITA- It was one of the major disappointments of nationals for us that they didn't do better. It's a shame, because they've really got the goods. Too bad he was out sick so long this season, but then, she's the one that missed all her triples! And then came out the next day in singles and hit them! Go figure.

They really do have the goods though: skate really fast, a 3-2 combo (maybe), INCREDIBLE lifts... and they have personality on the ice, too.

Already looking forward to their skates next season.

Skatefanconvert - Sorry I missed you in Atlanta. I really would like to meet up with GS Members to chat LIVE on what's going on. I keep saying this, but I am going to see what we can do about getting T-shirts so when we are strolling around the arenas we can spot each other.

I only saw Johnny do the Quad miss at practice. A guy beside me said he landed it 5 minutes ago. So I just said 50-50 which is not enough in a conservative performance. However from what you have said, and if he wants to take a more riskier approach, I'm all for it. He has incredible basics which should open the eyes of the judges. I think Priscilla Hill, his coach, will adivse him what to do depending on what order he is to skate and what will have happened to his competitors before he skates (oh, I'm using the future perfect like I know what I am doing).

Check out the Euros coming up sooon. Plushy is the favorite and rightly so but I see him as being vulnerable at times. The other two places are up for grabs: Joubert, Klimkin, Griazev, Lambiel, and of course, Van Der Perren. 5 guys battling out for 2 places. However, ALL will go to Worlds. I hope Johnny studies this contest.

Jennifer Don can be a little dynamo in singles but in my group at Atlanta we want her to work on Pairs. There is greatness there. Oh how I wish Moskvina would take them on.

Joe

Joesitz said:

Skatefanconvert - Sorry I missed you in Atlanta. I really would like to meet up with GS Members to chat LIVE on what's going on. I keep saying this, but I am going to see what we can do about getting T-shirts so when we are strolling around the arenas we can spot each other.

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T-shirts are a great idea! Or we should see about getting a hospitality suite one evening.

I only saw Johnny do the Quad miss at practice... However from what you have said, and if he wants to take a more riskier approach, I'm all for it. He has incredible basics which should open the eyes of the judges. I think Priscilla Hill, his coach, will adivse him.

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The press I've read said 'his coach said' that we might see it at worlds, but they didn't have a direct quote. We'll see. I'm just happy it's in the works, because I think he's got everything else necessary for competing (and winning) at the world level.

Check out the Euros coming up sooon.

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Yes, I think the wake up call that Yevgeny got at GP final will spur him on. He's been missing Alexei, I think.

Jennifer Don can be a little dynamo in singles but in my group at Atlanta we want her to work on Pairs. There is greatness there. Oh how I wish Moskvina would take them on.

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I have to agree. The girl's just got so much personality! She definitely loves to skate. After the pairs final, my partner said he wasn't going to cheer for her because he didn't want to encourage her singles skating. But he couldn't help himself and ended up cheering anyway. Hope we get to see some of her at 4 Continents.

Moskvina as their coach- that would be something!

?: how many points for 3 at Worlds?

Can someone tell me what the requirements are to qualify 3 skaters for worlds? What do the men have to do to keep their 3 spots? Is it the same in pairs and dance?

sk8fanconvert said:

Yes, I think the wake up call that Yevgeny got at GP final will spur him on. He's been missing Alexei, I think.

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I think Plushenko was just as tired as everyone else by GPF, although I agree not having a formidable rival like Yagudin along with an injury must make it hard to be prime for every competition. Had he not violated the rules, he would have won GPF, and that was without the second 3A and the missing 3S. I just can't see him being that worried about anyone else catching up to him with full jump arsenal, especially under the 6.0 system.

Plushenko was superb in the Russian Nationals -- there's a videoclip of it at rinkside -- probably the best I've seen this program performed. With rest I don't see anyone touching him at Euros or Worlds, unless he has an '04 Nationals Goebel-like SP. Abt is out, Klimkin is still (sadly) weak on his toe jumps, the judges are not giving Joubert much presentation credit for his Matrix program, Lambiel has only one quad on his plate, Li's primarily a technician, and Honda's carriage and line doesn't hold a candle to Plushenko's.

In a feeble attempt to go back to the original topic, I don't think that Weir or Weiss will challenge Plushenko, although Weir's presentation may have a different effect if he skates cleanly: he will be the first male skater with solid technical skills -- US or otherwise -- in a long while to have the style that European judges love to death, and that should put him in good stead for the future. Setting the table for Worlds 2005, which drives Olympics 2006 qualifications, is key.

I hope that Gregory and Petukhov also make a big splash at Worlds. There are only eight teams that scored better than they did in the FD at GP (the usual suspects), and it looks like they have a chance at one of the final two spots in the top ten, along with Faeilla/Scali, whom they beat at SA, Wing/Lowe, Kulikova/Markov, Domnina/Shabalin, and Petitin/Jost. This is critical, especially if Lang/Tchernyshev don't compete next year.

Can someone tell me what the requirements are to qualify 3 skaters for worlds?

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All disciplines, the top two skaters/pairs must finish with a combined total of not more than 13.

In other words, 2 of the 3 US men must finish no lower than 3rd&10th or 4th&9th or 5th&8th or 6th&7th.

What if only 1 skater is an entry and he places 3rd in the competition, does that allow for extra skaters in the folloiwng year? I'm thinking Kostner and Lambiel. Will Italy and/or Switzerland be allowed to have an additional skater in the next Worlds?

Joe

World Berth

World Berth is always dependent on how the skaters of that country placed in the previous year

An example, in 1994 world when Michelle Kwan was hyped as the future of US skating, she was the only skater there (Nicole Bobek dropped out?) Michelle placed 8th, i.e. top 10 that secured 2 slots for the USA in 1995

If only one skater is represented he or she has to place top 10 for that country to get 2 spots the next year.

When 2 or 3 skaters go to worlds, then the top 2 must have a combined score of 13?

USA has been fortunate enough to hav 3 slots in the most recent years. Japan is doing very well too.

Joesitz said:

What if only 1 skater is an entry and he places 3rd in the competition, does that allow for extra skaters in the folloiwng year? I'm thinking Kostner and Lambiel. Will Italy and/or Switzerland be allowed to have an additional skater in the next Worlds?

Joe

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As gezando said, as long as the skater places in the top 10, that country is allowed to send two skaters in that discipline to the next Worlds. However, most European federations have additional qualifications for making the World team, which usually has to do with placing above a certain position at Europeans. For example, last year's German champion Smalun did poorly enough at Euros that the German Federation held a skate-off to determine who would go to Worlds, and even though they qualified for one spot for Ladies and, maybe two spots for Dance, they sent no one in either discipline to Worlds last year, based on Dytrt's performance at Euros, and injuries to their top two dance teams.

The Swiss Federation may decide not to send another man and the Italian Federation may decide not to send another woman to Worlds, even though that skater 's placement wouldn't jeopardize sending two skaters in 2005, as long as Lambiel and Kostner place in the top ten this year. It doesn't make sense to me when a Federation does this. If nothing else, that skater would know how to deal with credentials and security, learn the ins and outs of practices at a Worlds event, and gain experience. That skater might be able to pass this on to skaters s/he later mentors or coaches. I'm sure Bin Yao learned a lot just by being entered in World competition, and that helped his skaters as he launched a coaching career.

According to Kristi's Skating for Dummies:

If 3 entries, total placement of
6 -21 = 3 for next year
22-33 = 2 for next year
otherwise 1.

If 2 entries, total placement of
3 -13 = 3 berths
14-22 = 2 berths,
otherwise 1.

If 1 entry, placement of
1-10 = 2 berths,
otherwise 1.
It's not possible to earn 3 berths.

Placements below 16th place and withdrawls equals 16.

In 94, the US was only allowed 2 entries because of Nancy's dismal performance at 93 World's.

I think Bobek didn't get past the qualifying rounds at World's in 1994. She stopped training after not making the Oly/World team. Since MK was the only qualified skater for 94 World's, she had to finish in the top 10.

I think it's a little different for pairs and dance, now. There aren't as many participants; so, the ISU encourages participation by allowing more teams.

I hope the US pairs do well enough to get 2 berths for next year.

The number of entries each country has for this year's ISU championships (i.e., Four Continents, Europeans, and Worlds) is available in PDF format from the ISU Communications page:

Entries ISU Championships 2004 (scroll down past the speed skating stuff)

Finding the rules is difficult. I found the rules they used for the Olympic games here in PDF or HTML, and they seem to be similar to what is applied for Worlds and Europeans. Here's what I found.

Four Continents

The Four Continents Championships will have open entries with each Member entitled to enter up to a maximum of three (3) entries for each event.

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Olympics, Worlds, and Europeans
(with some slight edits)

The number of skaters per discipline (Ladies, Men, Pairs) a Member may enter in this year's championship is determined in accordance with the following diagram:

Code:

No. of skaters    Pts required    Pts required
in Prev Year's    for 3 entries   for 2 entries
Championship                                                             
Two (2)         No more than 13   No more than 28
One (1)         No more than 2    No more than 10

The above-mentioned points are calculated by the addition of placements at the previous year's Worlds for this Year's Worlds or Olympics or at the previous year's Europeans for Europeans. If three (3) skaters participated in the previous year's championship, only the two (2) best placed count for points.

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Examples: Last year, the US ladies finished 1st-Michelle Kwan, 4th-Sasha Cohen, 6th-Sarah Hughes at Worlds. Only the top two results count. We add those placements 1+4=5, which is less than the 13 required to keep 3 entries for this year's Worlds. On the other hand, our pairs finished 9th-Scott/Dulebohn, 10th-Inoue/Baldwin, and 16th-Orscher/Lucash, so the total of the two best placements 9+10=19, while not enough to keep the 3 slots, was still less than the 28 required to secure 2 spots for this year's Worlds. Finally, last year Japan gambled and sent only Takeshi Honda for the men's event, reasoning that while Honda alone could secure two spots by finishing higher than 10th while possibly getting three spots if others faltered and Honda finished 2nd. As it happened, he got 3rd, and Japan has 2 spots for the men's event this year.


InsecureEdge

Spirit said:

Michelle will fall, Sasha will fall, Fumie will fall and Shizuka will fall. Jenny Kirk will win Worlds.

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hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm I like that idea... Jenny for 2004 World Champ!