Plushenko plans to compete in team & individual events in Sochi

Mathman said:

I. Rock musicians on tour must take uppers before every performance because otherwise it is impossible to generate the energy that audiences expect night after night.

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There is no must about this for rock musicians. The only rock musician whose habits I know anything about (and he is not a relative-he's the long time SIL of a friend) cultivates the appearance of taking drugs for his audience, but is in fact, always sober, especially when performing.

I really like what Robeye said about the connotations of the word headcase, and indeed that is how I always use the term. It does not imply any kind of mental illness or, as Robeye points out, moral weakness. Some people are just more sensitively calibrated than others. (I count myself among them.) Others are cool as a cucumber under pressure or might even be energized by the pressure. Katarina Witt was certainly one of the latter, while someone like Emanuel Sandhu (for whatever reason) might appear to be one of the former. No other term we've come up with seems to be equivalent in terms of describing this, though I continue to be open to suggestions. Consistency in and of itself isn't the issue. Some very calm people are inconsistent because (a) they haven't trained enough; (b) they don't have good basic technique; (c) they're going through body changes because of puberty and haven't yet gained a sense of their new capacities; or (d) something else.

Many skaters learn to overcome this weakness, just as a skater can learn to overcome some shortcoming based on muscle, flexibility, or other physical cause. Carolina Kostner certainly seems to be a different skater in competitions these days. (And isn't it wonderful to see?) Whatever degree of the trait Sasha had, she rose above it in that tense long program at the 2006 Olympics. In the old days, she would have melted down after the first fall. This time, she picked herself up and kept going. To this day I'm still grateful that I didn't chicken out and leave the room after that second stumble, because I would have missed the way she persevered to the end of the program with such grit.

Olympia said:

Hmm. I respect your reasoning, Doris, and I'd like to agree with you, but I can't think myself all the way there yet. One thing I absolutely agree with is your first point, about incorrect technique. When one analyzes most of the modern skaters who would go in this "category to be named later," they do indeed have some technical shortcoming that prevents them from being completely consistent. One of the most famous ones is Sasha Cohen, who was spectacular at the things she was good at (posture, positions, grace) but had an admitted lack of good blade technique, especially compared to Michelle. This weakness affected her jumps just enough to hold her back from the very top, though she certainly racked up a splendid record during her career. Likewise, Alissa can't count on her jumps or her speed, which of course would create insecurity both mentally and physically.

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I doubt her lack of good blade technique had much to do with how consistent her jumps were. How do you think one contributes to the other?

I'm by no means the person to ask, but I gather from more expert posters that if one can control one's movement on the ice, it gives a consistent speed and force to the takeoff and makes the jump more secure in the air, and then the landing is also more secure. Don't quote me, though! Maybe someone else can come in and explain it more accurately.

Olympia said:

I really like what Robeye said about the connotations of the word headcase, and indeed that is how I always use the term. It does not imply any kind of mental illness or, as Robeye points out, moral weakness. Some people are just more sensitively calibrated than others. (I count myself among them.) Others are cool as a cucumber under pressure or might even be energized by the pressure. Katarina Witt was certainly one of the latter, while someone like Emanuel Sandhu (for whatever reason) might appear to be one of the former. No other term we've come up with seems to be equivalent in terms of describing this, though I continue to be open to suggestions. Consistency in and of itself isn't the issue. Some very calm people are inconsistent because (a) they haven't trained enough; (b) they don't have good basic technique; (c) they're going through body changes because of puberty and haven't yet gained a sense of their new capacities; or (d) something else.

Many skaters learn to overcome this weakness, just as a skater can learn to overcome some shortcoming based on muscle, flexibility, or other physical cause. Carolina Kostner certainly seems to be a different skater in competitions these days. (And isn't it wonderful to see?) Whatever degree of the trait Sasha had, she rose above it in that tense long program at the 2006 Olympics. In the old days, she would have melted down after the first fall. This time, she picked herself up and kept going. To this day I'm still grateful that I didn't chicken out and leave the room after that second stumble, because I would have missed the way she persevered to the end of the program with such grit.

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I think people generally use the term in an insulting sense and it's even worse when it's applied to skaters coming straight out of the junior ranks. I think people forget that skaters are usually trying their best, and while it's obviously frustrating to see talented skaters fail for the reasons you mentioned, calling them that isn't helping. I think for certain skaters, like Sandhu and Cohen the implication of "headcase" is more applicable, because they have had many competitions which they've done poorly. Although it negates from the times they actually do skate well. Nobody ever wants to be regarded as that type of skater.

CanadianSkaterGuy said:

I think people generally use the term in an insulting sense and it's even worse when it's applied to skaters coming straight out of the junior ranks. I think people forget that skaters are usually trying their best, and while it's obviously frustrating to see talented skaters fail for the reasons you mentioned, calling them that isn't helping.

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I agree. But I also agree with Robeye that is it even worse to be called a choker. :yes:

As a fan rather than a competitor, I confess to being the world's worst headcase. When my favorite skater was on television I was too nervous to watch. I would hide around a corner and peek out only if I heard a roar (and not an "awwww") from the crowd.

Mathman said:

As a fan rather than a competitor, I confess to being the world's worst headcase. When my favorite skater was on television I was too nervous to watch. I would hide around a corner and peek out only if I heard a roar (and not an "awwww") from the crowd.

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me too!!! :yes:

Personally, I always thought Cohen's problems were mostly with technique more than with concentration. You couldn't tell her flip from her lutz, other than by whether she did a turn before the jump in addition to the long edge changing bit. And she would land jumps on the wrong edge, an easy way to trip and splat.

Who knows what Sandhu's problems were? not me.

Tatjana Flade ‏@Tatjana21

@GregGuyCBC It was more a test skate with skaters doing competition programs. I love @EvgeniPlushenko 's new SP & @Artur_Gach 's programs.

plushyfan said:

Tatjana Flade ‏@Tatjana21

@GregGuyCBC It was more a test skate with skaters doing competition programs. I love @EvgeniPlushenko 's new SP & @Artur_Gach 's programs.

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So Plushenko's SP is ready and some lucky people had a chance to see it.
Good to hear Tatjana likes it, she is very knowledgeable in FS, but sill no official announcement about music choice. Can't remember when we knew music choice last time before 2010?

Gachinsky is back and it is also good news, because he has so much potential.

All I've seen is that it is some "unpublished" Ukranian music - that's right, isn't it, plushyfan? And that they are going to work on the long with Maxim Stavisky?

LRK said:

All I've seen is that it is some "unpublished" Ukranian music - that's right, isn't it, plushyfan? And that they are going to work on the long with Maxim Stavisky?

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For the SP music, yes, that is what Mishin said in one of his interviews.

And yes, they plan to work with Maxim stavisky for LP.

CanadianSkaterGuy said:

I think people generally use the term in an insulting sense and it's even worse when it's applied to skaters coming straight out of the junior ranks. I think people forget that skaters are usually trying their best, and while it's obviously frustrating to see talented skaters fail for the reasons you mentioned, calling them that isn't helping. I think for certain skaters, like Sandhu and Cohen the implication of "headcase" is more applicable, because they have had many competitions which they've done poorly. Although it negates from the times they actually do skate well. Nobody ever wants to be regarded as that type of skater.

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The results don't match this narrative with Sasha however. I believe 4th place was her lowest placement from 2002 - 2006, even at 2010 Nationals she placed 4th with probably her weakest long program I can recall. That is a pretty impressive career, especially with a very strong ladies field. Yes I'm sure she would want to skate a few of those programs over, but she has nothing to be ashamed of.

NYscorp6 said:

The results don't match this narrative with Sasha however. I believe 4th place was her lowest placement from 2002 - 2006, even at 2010 Nationals she placed 4th with probably her weakest long program I can recall. That is a pretty impressive career, especially with a very strong ladies field. Yes I'm sure she would want to skate a few of those programs over, but she has nothing to be ashamed of.

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That's what has always struck me about Sasha. Some people regard her as some sort of failure because she generally fell somewhere in her programs (usually the long, as I recall), but look at her actual record. She even placed fourth in her first Olympics, at the age of fifteen or sixteen or so. There isn't a current American ladies' skater (or men's either, for that matter) with her record, unless one takes Evan Lysacek seriously and believes he's coming back to competition. Then there's one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0l4um0tdMrQ

Video of Plu today's news clip with quads, 3A, etc.

Translation later..

I just posted in another thread! I think it's stunning and amazing!

gmyers said:

I just posted in another thread! I think it's stunning and amazing!

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:yes:

NYscorp6 said:

The results don't match this narrative with Sasha however. I believe 4th place was her lowest placement from 2002 - 2006, even at 2010 Nationals she placed 4th with probably her weakest long program I can recall. That is a pretty impressive career, especially with a very strong ladies field. Yes I'm sure she would want to skate a few of those programs over, but she has nothing to be ashamed of.

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Well your example is of Nationals, amongst a group of U.S ladies who would have a 5 year drought of not even getting the U.S 3 spots, let alone medaling. Fortunately for her she didnt make it to the Olympics in 2010 (and the USFSA were thinking of naming her to the team even after her 4th place at Nationals, due to pressure from NBC, and even had a long meeting about it) as she would have been a heck of alot lower than 4th. Most probably well outside the top 10 given the insanely high level of skating there, and the level of skating she was likely to produce around then. Despite that though I agree with your overall point.

Although I wouldnt call 2003-2006 quad a strong ladies field. Nobody was that consistently strong. Kwan was already past her prime, and even in early 2003 when she dominated never attempted more than 6 triple (or a triple-triple) ever again, and continued to steadily decline with a badly damaged hip, increasing age, and a new judging system. Slutskaya's World and Olympic results that quad were WD, 8th, 1st, 3rd, WD, which pretty much sum the various things that she had to endure that quad without me having to explain it more in depth. Arakawa was always a roll of the dice skater and her Grand Prix final, World, and Olympic results for the quad were DNQ (although she got in after some WDs but still placed near the bottom), 8th, 3rd, 1st, 2nd, 9th, DNQ (did not qualify), 1st, WD. Beyond those skaters and Cohen the field was pretty thin, with Fumie Suguri, a pleasent skater but who was obvious to anyone at the time was never going to win a major title, as the best of the remaining pretenders. Part of Sasha's consistently high placements despite her regularity of splats and mistakes was the lack of depth and major lack of consistency and order of the womens field during her prime years, compared to the deeper fields of the 99-2002 quad previous or 2007-2010 quad to follow especialy. The rest was her overall special qualities as a skater that were rewarded highly- spins, spirals, perfect positions. I wouldnt say it is that strong a reflection she is some great competitor that she is unfairly discredited from being.

plushyfan said:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0l4um0tdMrQ

Video of Plu today's news clip with quads, 3A, etc.

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Honestly, Evgeni in this clip is UNREAL to me...
He does NOT AT ALL need to practice these 4T and 3A this early in the season, don't you think? Because I believe those wonderful jumps are FOREVER in his body's muscle memory. And in order to avoid from re-injuring himself. He should rather save them until next January (Euro) and Sochi!

OT but around 1:03, the guy is Sasha Abt, isn't he?

deedee1 said:

Honestly, Evgeni in this clip is UNREAL to me...
He does NOT AT ALL need to practice these 4T and 3A this early in the season, don't you think? Because I believe those wonderful jumps are FOREVER in his body's muscle memory. And in order to avoid from re-injuring himself. He should rather save them until next January (Euro) and Sochi!

OT but around 1:03, the guy is Sasha Abt, isn't he?

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No. He is Vitaly Balikin. Plushy's off ice trainer and friend, he was a runner.