What are Yuna Kim's strongest points as a skater? | Page 19 | Golden Skate

What are Yuna Kim's strongest points as a skater?

aftertherain

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 15, 2010
The author of the book, "The Right Stuff", Thomas Wolf would disagree with you.

And you, what is your opinion?

So, you can't say Yang Bo was the "best balance beam worker of her era", IF SHE DIDN'T WIN. You can SAY she had the most promise or the best form, but that is all.:)

I think one can still say she was the best balance beam worker of her era---she just wasn't a particularly good competitor.
 

CarneAsada

Medalist
Joined
Sep 17, 2011
The author of the book, "The Right Stuff", Thomas Wolf would disagree with you. If Yu-Na is unable to win in Sochi it might well be because of this latest injury of hers, DUE TO THE APPROACH AND RESULT OF HER TRAINING. But at the end of the day the hard truth will be she didn't have the "right stuff" (ALL that is needed to win); it's ALL included no matter how unfair it might seem. So, you can't say Yang Bo was the "best balance beam worker of her era", IF SHE DIDN'T WIN. You can SAY she had the most promise or the best form, but that is all.:)

But that's silly; Yuna has already shown she has everything needed to win from her Olympic title and her 2 World Championships. Even if the injury prevented her from doing her best at Sochi, there will always be people saying "Kostner/Asada/Whoever Else" may have won, but Yuna wasn't at her best there." Saying that being prevented from winning by an injury or by flopping when it counted most means you "didn't have the right stuff" is like saying "Kristi Yamaguchi was a better jumper than Midori Ito because she landed her jumps when it counted."
 

RABID

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
But that's silly; Yuna has already shown she has everything needed to win from her Olympic title and her 2 World Championships. Even if the injury prevented her from doing her best at Sochi, there will always be people saying "Kostner/Asada/Whoever Else" may have won, but Yuna wasn't at her best there." Saying that being prevented from winning by an injury or by flopping when it counted most means you "didn't have the right stuff" is like saying "Kristi Yamaguchi was a better jumper than Midori Ito because she landed her jumps when it counted."

I am a huge Yu-Na fan but when she lost the Worlds to Miki Ando it is because she didn't have what it takes (that day at least) and the gold around Miki's neck was the proof of it all. Many people like to maintain that Sasha is a better figure skater than Yu-Na. Wrong. When you are talking COMPETITION skating the ONLY thing that matters is where one ends up on the podium; the reward and affirmation of good work, good program, support, talent, nerves, health and often timing/luck. I wouldn't pay to see Miki but I would Yu-Na. But that is apples and oranges. Regardless of raw ability and an impressive list of accomplishments if she doesn't win gold at the Olympics people can make the argument, and with good cause, that she wasn't the figure skater Katerina Witt was and that would be sad and maybe even tragic but that is what the "kiss and cry" is for. In golfing circles there is this guy who was famous in golfing circles for his amazing striking ability, meaning he could hit the golf ball within a few feet of where he aimed. I don't remember his name. You know why? Because everything else about his game was sub par and so he rarely won. Great striker? Yes. Great golfer, no. So to say, Ito was a better jumper than Kristi is irrelevant because, yes, when it counted Kristi made the jumps and that meant she was the better FIGURE SKATER (at least on that day) and that is what we are talking about here, right?
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
When you are talking COMPETITION skating the ONLY thing that matters is where one ends up on the podium.

May be. But when you are talking Greatest of All Time you are talking body of work. Fifty years from now we can revisit the question and see whose programs are still watched over and over. The great skater may have lost the battle, but won the war. :yes:

It's your legacy, your impact on the sport, not whether you won this medal or that. :cool:
 

Alex D

Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
I don't want to offend anyone, but, do you think that something like the "Greatest, Best ... of all time" is actually an achievable rank? We never saw Witt compete against Yuna, we never saw both of them compete versus Henie and so on.

From my point of view, you just cant say who the best is or was, as not all were fighting with the same tools, not all in the same time and especially not against each other.

What you can say is who the most successful one was and if I am not mistaken it would be Sonja Henie.

That doesn't change the fact though, that everyone of us has his personal "best of all time", but this is more based on the impact that particular Skater had on us, than the actual "performance ranking" among all skaters.
 

Krislite

Medalist
Joined
Sep 22, 2010
May be. But when you are talking Greatest of All Time you are talking body of work. Fifty years from now we can revisit the question and see whose programs are still watched over and over. The great skater may have lost the battle, but won the war. :yes:

It's your legacy, your impact on the sport, not whether you won this medal or that. :cool:

Impact on whom? In what way? The thing is, the most consistent champions (like Michelle Kwan) have the biggest impact and legacy. It's really tough to have a counter example (apart from Janet Lynn). The skaters with the biggest impact tend to be those who have a certain level of both longevity and dominance: Kwan in the US, Slutskaya in Russia, Asada in Japan, and Kim in Korea (and Asia in general). All of them have won several major titles. In fact, Lynn's exception just may prove the rule.
 

RABID

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
May be. But when you are talking Greatest of All Time you are talking body of work. Fifty years from now we can revisit the question and see whose programs are still watched over and over. The great skater may have lost the battle, but won the war. :yes:

I will concede that. And maybe she doesn't have to win it all and to tell you the truth this argument of mine has been more of an academic exercise by me and doesn't really reflect how I think it will all turn out for Yu-Na. Her Lark Ascending at the 2007 Worlds was one of my favorites of hers even if it cost her the championship. No matter what her setbacks, I would expect at least that kind of performance from her and if she skates like that in Sochi she will have secured her place in the annals of figure skating greats.
 

shine

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
LOL at this thread.....I can go on for days about why I freaking love Stephane Lambiel and why he's the one and only skating god but I don't. I don't force feed my uberdom to others, but why do others always do it to me?
 

thinspread

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 8, 2013
LOL at this thread.....I can go on for days about why I freaking love Stephane Lambiel and why he's the one and only skating god but I don't. I don't force feed my uberdom to others, but why do others always do it to me?

lol.. Check again the thread title! What did you expect? If someone start one about Lambiel, I can see people like me going on and on gushing over him too.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Impact on whom? In what way? The thing is, the most consistent champions (like Michelle Kwan) have the biggest impact and legacy.

That is my point. Michelle Kwan never won an Olympic gold medal, but she had a greater impact on the sport than many who did. Kurt Browning never won an Olympic medal of any kind, yet he would be a defensible choice for all-time great consideration.

It's really tough to have a counter example (apart from Janet Lynn)....In fact, Lynn's exception just may prove the rule.

Janet Lynn is indeed unique. Without ever winning anything except some national titles, she brought down the whole sport of figure skating, replacing it with a new thing altogether. :cool:

That doesn't change the fact though, that everyone of us has his personal "best of all time", but this is more based on the impact that particular Skater had on us, than the actual "performance ranking" among all skaters.

Quite so. I wouldn't want it any other way. :rock:

But here's an objective and quantifiable test. The skater with the greatest number of hits on You Tube is the most popular of all time. That would be 9-year-old Starr Andrews with Whip My Hair (14,000,000 views). Runner-up, the ice dancer who fell out of her costume in the middle of a performance.
 
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dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
But here's an objective and quantifiable test. The skater with the greatest number of hits on You Tube is the most popular of all time. That would be 9-year-old Starr Andrews with Whip My Hair (14,000,000 views). Runner-up, the ice dancer who fell out of her costume in the middle of a performance.

That would be Ekaterina Rubleva (of Rubleva & Shefer RUS). I will remind everyone that Ekaterina was doing the Finnstep CD while having her wardrobe malfunction. So don't y'all try to tell me that people can't be gotten to watch a Compulsory Dance ;)
 

Krislite

Medalist
Joined
Sep 22, 2010
That is my point. Michelle Kwan never won an Olympic gold medal, but she had a greater impact on the sport than many who did. Kurt Browning never won an Olympic medal of any kind, yet he would be a defensible choice for all-time great consideration.

Janet Lynn is indeed unique. Without ever winning anything except some national titles, she brought down the whole sport of figure skating, replacing it with a new thing altogether. :cool:

Well my point was that these skaters apart from Janet have all won either multiple Worlds and/or Olympic gold medals. They won both key battles (if not all of them) and the war. ;)

Now I'm not so sure about evaluating Kim's legacy at this point and comparing them to Kwan's or Browning's. She's not done competitively yet, although she has undoubtedly inspired many young skaters (not just Koreans) and have influenced their decisions and choices.
 

thinspread

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 8, 2013
Now I'm not so sure about evaluating Kim's legacy at this point and comparing them to Kwan's or Browning's. She's not done competitively yet, although she has undoubtedly inspired many young skaters (not just Koreans) and have influenced their decisions and choices.

Yes, she will leave her own legacy for sure and obviously has many followers among the young skaters. Recently, Radionova expressed her admiration in an interview after Nebelhorn: http://rsport.ru/figure_skating/20130928/690145029.html

[Google translated] Elena Radionova, won a landslide victory in his first senior competition - competition Nebelhorn Trophy in Oberstdorf, said the agency "F-Sport", which seeks to ride as beautiful and confident as Olympic champion and world champion Korean Kim Yu-Na.

"As long as Axel in three and a half times I will not do - Radionova said, responding to a question about whether she's going to continue to complicate the program. - It is better to focus on the triple jump - and ride beautiful as Kim Yu-Na. She jumps triple so beautiful that her axel in three and a half turns is not necessary - it will benefit all of the components.'s what I want to jump like it. were to ease, a beautiful glide and beautiful jumps. If complicate the program, it is only moving the stages of the second half."
 

Robeye

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
In golfing circles there is this guy who was famous in golfing circles for his amazing striking ability, meaning he could hit the golf ball within a few feet of where he aimed. I don't remember his name. You know why? Because everything else about his game was sub par and so he rarely won. Great striker? Yes. Great golfer, no. So to say, Ito was a better jumper than Kristi is irrelevant because, yes, when it counted Kristi made the jumps and that meant she was the better FIGURE SKATER (at least on that day) and that is what we are talking about here, right?
Are you maybe talking about Moe Norman, the Canadian golf savant? :)
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
Now I'm not so sure about evaluating Kim's legacy at this point and comparing them to Kwan's or Browning's. She's not done competitively yet, although she has undoubtedly inspired many young skaters (not just Koreans) and have influenced their decisions and choices.

IMHO Kim's legacy is utterly secure. This child has never finished off the podium. Her two masterpieces, the 2010 Olympic LP and the 2013 world championship LP, are two of the finest in figure skating history. They will never be diminished. She took a wrecking ball and demolished the CoP. She wrote the manual on jump technique. She can stand with the giants preceding her and not be ashamed.

I suppose it is not fair -- after all, we are talking about skating, not character off the ice -- to mention how she conducts herself away from the sport, so I will stop here. ;)
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
...none of which is to deny the obvious fact that Mao Asada has a fine sense of rhythm and musical phrasing. :p
 

thinspread

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 8, 2013
IMHO Kim's legacy is utterly secure. This child has never finished off the podium. Her two masterpieces, the 2010 Olympic LP and the 2013 world championship LP, are two of the finest in figure skating history. They will never be diminished. She took a wrecking ball and demolished the CoP. She wrote the manual on jump technique. She can stand with the giants preceding her and not be ashamed.
....

I agree + I think the most influential and dominance-setting program of Kim was the Danse Macabre. Her performances to it at SA, 4CC and Worlds were all out of this world.

...none of which is to deny the obvious fact that Mao Asada has a fine sense of rhythm and musical phrasing. :p

Right, Asada has wonderful qualities. She can be very good as long as she stays in her comfort zone, like in her programs to Chopin. However, outside of that, I don't find her as impressive or convincing. I consider Tarasova's Bells of Moscow as a masterfully choreographed program. A great program, but a mediocre performance.

Same can be said about Alissa Czisny. Her style can work very well with slow-paced, lyrical pieces. But, if she goes beyond that, for example with a rigorous program that calls for a keen sense of rhythm and phrasing to fast beats or changing phaseal changes/nuances, I bet her program will be diminished to some pieces of catching-up efforts. I'm not saying it only on that Czisny is a poor jumper.

Maybe this would be a good topic for another thread about skating/performing talent, whether a skater/dancer who has a superior talent in picking up, e.g., hip-hop moves can also excel in lyrical movements to fine nuances; or vice-versa.
 

Alex D

Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
Quite so. I wouldn't want it any other way. :rock:

But here's an objective and quantifiable test. The skater with the greatest number of hits on You Tube is the most popular of all time. That would be 9-year-old Starr Andrews with Whip My Hair (14,000,000 views). Runner-up, the ice dancer who fell out of her costume in the middle of a performance.

Haha, so had to laugh while reading that!

Maybe I should record a video of my partner and me trying to do a twizzle in a monkey and banana costume and we could become the world most famous skaters too?
 

mary01

Final Flight
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
I agree + I think the most influential and dominance-setting program of Kim was the Danse Macabre. Her performances to it at SA, 4CC and Worlds were all out of this world.



Right, Asada has wonderful qualities. She can be very good as long as she stays in her comfort zone, like in her programs to Chopin. However, outside of that, I don't find her as impressive or convincing. I consider Tarasova's Bells of Moscow as a masterfully choreographed program. A great program, but a mediocre performance.

.

This is hilarious, because if I had to describe Kim's programs one of the first words that would come to my mind is comfort zone and mediocre, with the big orchestral climax at the end, the same elements repeated again and again, at the same placements. The same pained expression, turn of the music and it would be impossible to distinguish which of her steps belongs to which program, that's how similar they are.

I am pretty sure that you would be able to find a lot more similarities between Kim content (same layout), music choices (with the usuel climax), choreography (with the same expression and arm movements), and how her programs usually are constructed, then you would with Mao's program :laugh:
 
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