Free Dance: 2013 NHK Trophy

deneuved said:

Totally agree with what was said about Gilles/Poirier - I just caught up with their free dance and what a masterpiece it is!! I really hope Piper will get her Canadian citizenship in time and we'll be able to see them in Sochi

Click to expand...

herios said:

Can someone help me understand something, as I feel lazy to open the COP Bible? I thought the GOE mark on an element should be the average of the GOE mark posted by the judges, with the highest and lowest being dropped, then how on earth it becomes an 1.07, when all the judges gave it either a 2 or a 3?

Click to expand...

deneuved said:

Totally agree with what was said about Gilles/Poirier - I just caught up with their free dance and what a masterpiece it is!! I really hope Piper will get her Canadian citizenship in time and we'll be able to see them in Sochi

Click to expand...

caitie said:

Well, I mean Finlandia was V/M's season debut (and they had some visible errors there to boot), so I don't really think that's fair. Their FD is def worth more than 100 on any ice.

TontoK , actually don't quote me on the Dean connection. I read it on FSU but I just tried to confirm it and could only find Dean mentioned in articles about their 2012 FD, hmm.

Click to expand...

csparkles said:

Actually, Christopher Dean had nothing to do with this program at all, it was choreographed by their coaches Carol Lane and Juris Razgulajevs shortly before Paul broke his leg.

Click to expand...

Mathman said:

GOEs are not always incremented in whole number units, 1. 2. 3. Each element has its own scale, with the effect that, roughly, GOEs amount to a percentage of base value. (Very roughly. ) For Davis and White's CoSp4 each GOE point is worth 0,50. After throwing out highest and lowest, they had six 2's and one 3, for an average of 2.14. Multiply by .50, and there you go.

Click to expand...

NoNameFace said:

some thoughts, I've watched only Elena/Nikita, Gilles/Poirier and Davis/White for this moment ( after last two nights with waking up so early I overslept for ice dance fd's...) and sorry as always for the lenght

Elena/Nikita - firts of all I think they should do programs like that - to maybe overused pieces but with some dramatic, characteristic storyline, because their last two season's free dances made me shivers and no in a good way unfortunately...They are exquisite on ice - have great presence, character, good ice coverage imo, but their potential was (and for me still is) not used and shown in 100%. Music is suprisingly well-connected with choreo, which is quite good itself (I'm suprised in a good way, because Morozov's arrangements of movements for this couple always made me scream for help...I just don't understand - he was coaching an ukrainian couple who gained bronze in Torino and I remember that some of their choreographies were fantastic, especially for original dances), the elements are at least better than previous seasons - lifts are amazing and if they will be all executed well along with the other elements ofc, this dance would be mindblowing for me. Now I see they captured the feeling, the essence of this music and I see they try to express drama, love, passion, anger and other emotions and that's the attitude which I like for dance couples. Even with weak technically step sequences they shown much more character than Davis/White - I see the chemistry between them, some artistic spark which may not be get from great technique but form the fact that when they dance, they put not only their bodies into choreography but also their minds and feelings. I always have some doubts when ice dancers picked overused, popular music with well-known story interpreted by thousands artists - I have them there also, but after watching it I'm interested and I'm strating to get into their story. One last thought about costumes - they looked fabulous, but please Elena get out off your beautiful head this tacky plastic tiara and put there a headband which you had on practice session!

Davis/White - in my post at SA FD thread I wrote about my feelings about this FD and my opinion isn't changed - they are almost perfect technically already, this perfection gives them monstreous PCS score, this can't be denied. But this performance leaves me once again with feeling of well- executed program and nothing more, while in comparision Elena/Nikita and especially Piper and Paul (about them I'll write below) interested me with their dances, not only programs treated as "some choreo put along with some music". As I said execution and technical level, sharpness, speed are incredible - in that scoring system this is almost everything, because if you're a good technician, performance is good also and so PCS is high - and if we add to this the reputation of a skater, there's no possibility to not getting high scores. Davis and White knows that and this is why they are the best, but they may not have the best fd/sd themselves. Compared to other, worse technically teams their this season dances are not the best - when they skate them I can see big elements well-executed with no personality and some character. One of users said earlier something about them as a robots under Marina - somehow it is truly statement for me, because in last season and in the present one when I watched them I see only technicall execution of choreography which may be good or bad and for me there is no deeper thought about interpretation, personality, the story telling - the music is Notre Dame, they have some costumes suitable for it the same in Scheherezade, but I don't see they become the characters on ice. I would be even more excited and glad with them just playing the roles of characters in that Scheherezade story without putting some new wave of personal interpretation of the story and music, but now there isn't even that thing... Now I just see a great skated program with huge score, nothing else and comparing to other's performances in which I feel much more than that (some emotions - good or bad about THE DANCE), it's sad.

and Piper and Paul - when I watched them my jaw was litterally dropped down, what a great suprise from them!! When they started to skate together I considered them as a good-looking couple with some interesting choices of music and choreos. And when they skated even I with my non-professional eyes could see a technical difference between him and her. They were for me one of some medicore couples...until now. In last night's sd they shown me some promise - both in technical and presentation side, promise that they're better dancers, not only better skaters. And tonight's fd prove that promise, got it into life - there was everything I always expect from dance: a great choice of music (not overused- good ground for putting some freshness and personality), well-connected innovative choreo (timing of elements was great, lifts were just amazing, especially first one OMG) and to give the movements personal feeling, to alive them, not only execute them as parts of the program and they just alive that music, that choreo. All Their movement was in character all the time when they skated - even little music details were mentioned by moves. Also they created some "aura" there - some feeling of anxiety, unknown, tension - and yes, THEY created it along the music and it's super rare nowadays. And the technique was there also - I see she worked hard on edges, hands etc. and I very aprieciate that, because it shows that she wants to be better and so wants they to be better as a couple. To sum up - great positive surprise, because I would never pick that music for them and that's what I love - the courage (some unexpected choices and self - power of transformation, of changing along with that choices, that's great for them not only as a dancers but as a people)

Click to expand...

csparkles said:

Actually, Christopher Dean had nothing to do with this program at all, it was choreographed by their coaches Carol Lane and Juris Razgulajevs shortly before Paul broke his leg.

Click to expand...

Great 2nd practice for P2, nice run thru of free dance, everyone suitably creeped out Goal achieved today, we enjoyed every minute.
10:14 PM - 6 Nov 13
https://twitter.com/cjlanecoach/status/398332588202278912

So proud of P2 today, clean SD, nice levels, good score, and maximum enjoyment. It's a great day, only we know how far we've come
3:51 AM - 9 Nov 13
https://twitter.com/cjlanecoach/status/399142086257033216

Thanks P2 for making "Director's Cut" a magic moment, and bringing my idea to life. And Japanese fans are awesome, thank you all so much!
12:19 AM - 10 Nov 13
https://twitter.com/cjlanecoach/status/399451175600136192​

Skater Boy said:

Very well stated. The very reason I want V and M to win OGM though I doubt they will. The criticisms of Totmiana and Marin when they won OGM should apply to DW - i ti just on this forum D and W fans are much more supportive to D and W than ever to T and M. The difference here though is there is at least one other team that should be deserved or competitive with D and W. I know we all ahve our biases but D and W have limited range - which because of the rules and judging system is not penalized or won't show in the score -unless the SD had been like a tango , flamenco or something deeply passionate. bolywood is maybe the one exception but then again it was more just he music. Technically great but what might keep them from being really remembered is that they were like good cup of chicken soup but not particularly memorable.

I and K - how sad. C and l were already clpse to the podium last year folks so really I and K has closed the gap despite obvious technical problems. this seems to be the problem with all the Russian teams right now. Part of the problem might be Morosov as his programs usualy not that great and he is not an ice dance specialist unlike Zueva, Shipland, Krylova/Carmelango, the famous french coach, Zhulin, Pomanko Krylova etc. Their pcs are getting up there. Hopefully this was just htem getting a feeling about levels and all. They might beat Bs who seem to be scrambling around with finding the right program. C and L looked to be the faves for OGM then W and P seem to be saying look at us and the two Russian teams are struggling to find themselves. The Shibutanis appear to be securing them a spot on the US team but don't really have the goods in the Fd to win a medal - they will just have to beat it!

I agree wow from Gilles and Poirier = wonderful. They seem to go up and down and now are going back up - interesting to see if she gets her citizenship in time but I doubt it.

I guess i and k are finished for the GP finals at least.

As well as C and L did here in winning silver in a way they did the worst as I and K and he shibutanis were nipping at their heals with I and K the most room to improve due to level issues.

Click to expand...

blackswanphoto said:

And V/M is memorable with their boring, easy program and technical deficiency? It is not just the people on this board who consider D/W superior. Look at the crowd reactions they get wherever they skate. Always standing ovations around the World. V/M rarely get those reactions outside of Canada, and as the commentators have mentioned rinkside D/W are in a whole other league. On what basis should V/M win? Because of a body line? Because as athletes they are nowhere close and this is a sport. The only people who think they should win are the Nationalists and their 3 or so fans on this board.

Click to expand...

golden411 said:

LOL, please allow me to inform you that Virtue/Moir receive a huge amount of online support -- from both Canadians and others -- on platforms other than GS.
Members of FSU could cite a list of luminaries of ice dance (former champions, etc.) who consider V/M to be in a league of their own.
And as for who is boring, I strongly disagree.

Click to expand...

blackswanphoto said:

Mostly old-school dinosaurs from the 6.0 era. I bet in the last two years most of those "luminaries" who said that have kept their mouth shut.

Click to expand...

golden411 said:

LOL, then you would be wrong.
I will leave it there ... because what I bet is that Davis/White would cringe to know that any of their respective supporters feel the need to tear the other couple down. The two couples are respectful of each other, so I for one like to follow their example.

Click to expand...