I thing Count of Monte Cristo has to be read between the ages of 10 and 14. Then it's one of the best book ever!the worst fiction I've read in the last few months was "The Count of Monte Cristo" by Dumas, which I didn't care for at ALL. I
You know, opinions on that vary greatly. I know several older gentlemen who place most of the blame on Lolita! Now, those are very honorable men, who would never think of doing anything like that themselves, but they do come from a different generation. In fact, I find that most people who are closer to Nabokov's generation than to mine (either gender) see Lolita as at least in part the "guilty party"! Which brings up an interesting question of what did Nabokov himself put into this. IMO, he basically had no moral judgement of his own on the relationship itself, and put in the whole Hubert/Lolita's mom thing to make Humbert more of a villain.novel. I truly hate Humbert. He is as slimy as characters get.
Hey, what about the Holy Bible! Killing: Cain & Able. Incest: Lot & his daughters. Trickery: Jacob & Esau. Then again, people do often refuse to discuss those...Rgirl, what did your students think of the morality of the Shakespere plays you read? IIRC most are full of killings, incest, trickery, etc...
No, unfortunately not. I read Russian and English. Used to be able to read French, but have let it slide in the past few years. I think that both Nabokov writing in English and Kundera writing in French turn out fiction that is less than what they do in their native language.Mathman said:Ptichka, do you read Russian and Czeck and French and English?
So, to answer your question, we started with "Hamlet" and when I brought up the incestual themes the response was, "What incest?"
"Look, you've got to get me a lot of money for this because nobody will hire me for at least three years after it comes out."
berthes ghost said:Did you ever see that scene where The Soporanos go to Meadow's house for dinner and Carmella gets all in a tizzy because the kids talk about homosexual subtext in Herman Mellville? It's hysterical, but also sad because it's so true.
YES! I hadn't made the connection but that's exactly it.
Oh please! He [Irons] must have told his agent this after every role! A bi-sexual worshiper of aristocricy and thier houses, a prig who most probably tried to bump-off his wife, a middle aged man having wild sex with his son's fiancee, etc... Has he ever played anyone nice?
And let's not forget the twin drug-addicted misogynistic gynecologists where the twins have kinky sex with the same woman pretending they're the same guy, one brother designs torturous gynecological surgical instruments, and in the end one brother murders the other "for his own good" in "Dead Ringers." Now there's a likable role, lol.
You're probably right, but people still liked Charles Ryder, and I thought Irons made Claus von Bulow likable in an "I know I'm a strange, slimy, manipulative man but hey, that's just me" kind of way. Besides, even Disney included the "You have no idea" line in "The Lion King"--of course knowing full well the kiddies wouldn't get it.
The only thing different about "Lolita" is that at least the other movies got theatrical distributors. "Lolita," even with a big money-making director like Adrian Lyne behind it could not get a distributor because it was "Lolita." But Irons may have exaggerated his "didn't work for three years" bit. "Lolita" was on Showtime in '97 and in '98 Irons was in "Man in the Iron Mask" in the role second only to Leo's. However, he probably signed on for and made "MITIM" before "Lolita" came out. But, after that, he really didn't do anything much until "Longitude" (hey, there was a nice guy) and even that was on A&E.
OTOH, from "Reversal of Fortune" in 1990 until "Lolita" and "MITIM" in '97/98, Irons did at least a major role every year, including "Damage" in '92. If "Lolita" didn't have such a history--Jsomething like the ten actors turned down HH before Kubrick approached James Mason, whose career also suffered after doing it--I'd say Irons story was probably BS. But when even the worst indie films can at least get a theatrical distributor and Adrian Lyne's "Lolita" can't, I have to give Irons the benefit of the doubt.
But as for being creepy, that's another story, lol. Every big power person, i.e., "stah" (no typo) I've ever come in contact with--whether it's been a dancer, actor, doctor, business person, writer, editor, whatever--was kinda creepy. I lived in SLC for many years and worked at the Sundance Festival for a few of them. It was fun in the early years, but when it got big, it definitly turned Park City into Creep City. Though I must say Ordinary Bob was nice when he was saving our dance company from bankruptcy. Of course his face had so many lines in it--not wrinkles, just hundreds of little creases--that that's all I could think about when I met him.
I met [Irons] once when we designed something for him and he came off as kinda creepy. Then again, I thought that all of our clients (David Coperfield, Disney, etc..) were kinda creepy.
What kind of design work do you do? And I'm still dying to know what your avatar is.
Rgirl
Kewl.berthes ghost said:Architecture.
Duh I've always assumed it was a painting (BTW, I love it) but am I totally wrong? Did you make it? And who is Berthes Ghost and what's her story? Totally OT, I know, but in a thread about a great story, I figure it's as good a place as any to ask.It's a depiction (dramatization? ) of Berthes Ghost.
"De swamps have got a curse on dem!" Great guess, Mathman. I bet you're right or at least I hope so. That would be the bird's chirp.Mathman said:Does it have anything to do with Tante Berthe's Cafe?