Bloomburg Businessweek article: "Figure Skating FALL" | Page 3 | Golden Skate

Bloomburg Businessweek article: "Figure Skating FALL"

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Don`t be fooled. Jason Brown, Davis and White, Wagner, gold while marektable in their own right are far far bewlow of yester year skating stars as to marketability. To us uber fans we know Jason but he still is a reltive u nknown regardless of youtube. If he medals at the olympics then his stock will rise considerably but I am not sure he is marketable in the states. Male skaters aren`t that marektable unless with a female partner like danc eor pairs. They better have a huge title and wonderful personality. I don`t think Evan did as well as some think sure he had some endorsements and opportunities but sadly skating isn`t the draw it used to be and there is still homophobia out there whether a skater is straight or gay. We haven`t been emancipated as much as we hoped - yet
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
Great points in this thread by everyone.

Jason Brown is unique. Taking an educated guess, he wears a ponytail not to be different but to be himself and he isn't afraid of being himself. But he is also distinctive and different. He doesn't seem to do anything cautiously but rather he seems to do everything assuredly. That is pretty unique not just with any athlete but any person. WYSIWYG. Remember when he skated at Skate America and there were not a small number of comments on this site that he should lose his ponytail and fix up his appearance? Anyone doubt that he hasn't been getting those comments for years and years, and that someone hasn't told him that it might affect his endorsements if he ever got big? I don't mean to take anything away from D/W because they are awesome but my impression is that their image is somewhat filtered so I too filter anything they say (and that takes effort so I really don't pay too much attention to anything they say or endorse). I don't get that sense with Brown and that puts him, to me, in a special category. I don't have to filter him and he has many likeable qualities.

D/W are very recognizable because of their wins, so I will note them if they show up on a commercial as being associated with a product, and the product will therefore get recognition with me. But to me are not relatable like Brown and so an endorsement by Brown would make me think more deeply about the qualities of the product, more than just the name recognition.

Bottom line, and my point, is that although Brown must continue to develop (and eventually to rack up wins), he could be a godsend to the sport and a repudiation of many of the article's points.

Or am I wrong and the writer correct in inferring that popularity has to come from the female side of the sport (which is impossible because of its pixie-ness)?

I mentioned this in some other thread, but what struck me was how quickly Jason has adopted to dealing with the media in such a short time. I've heard him do interviews with everyone from renowned public radio interviewers (WBUR's Tom Ashbrook on "On Point") to local television/radio affiliates who have no knowledge or understanding about skating (WGN in Chicago) and he's been able to be articulate yet authentic to each one of them.

What's interesting is once you get past Jason's "OMG" reaction regarding going to the Olympics/having a viral FS video on YouTube/sudden fame, it's clear that he can answer the questions that's straight forward and to the point.

Here's are two examples:

Arsenio Hall: "So you had to wait after you skated to find out you made the Olympic team?"
Jason: "There's a criteria that goes into it and it's not just the top two that make it."

Tom Ashbrook: "Do you think about the political issues at all in Russia? The crackdown on what they call "gay propaganda" there and all the rest? Is that on your mind as you training."
Jason: "... I definitely don't completely agree with [the Russian political situation], but I’m really trying to focus on my training everyday and doing what I do everyday and trying to represent my country the best that I can.”

Considering all the hubbub others went to avoid commenting on the political issues in Russia, I was impressed that Jason was able to answer plainly and simply.

Jason's approach seems like a happy medium between being blunt and being overly PC.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
Because of his mom having been Arsenio's executive producer, Jason & his sister have been aware of tv talk shows their whole lives. It's got to help.
 

phaeljones

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 18, 2012
Don`t be fooled. Jason Brown, Davis and White, Wagner, gold while marektable in their own right are far far bewlow of yester year skating stars as to marketability. To us uber fans we know Jason but he still is a reltive u nknown regardless of youtube. If he medals at the olympics then his stock will rise considerably but I am not sure he is marketable in the states. Male skaters aren`t that marektable unless with a female partner like danc eor pairs. They better have a huge title and wonderful personality. I don`t think Evan did as well as some think sure he had some endorsements and opportunities but sadly skating isn`t the draw it used to be and there is still homophobia out there whether a skater is straight or gay. We haven`t been emancipated as much as we hoped - yet

This is a good point too. Part of what so intrigues me about this thread is how my perspective has changed as the comments have come in. What draws me to the sport, I realize, is not what necessarily makes it or can make it generally popular. Most of the people who come to this site regularly, I am thinking, are drawn to the sport because they love to watch great skating (as we each appreciate it). The general mass popularity, the more casual viewer follows his and her sports for a different reason, and it was those reasons that the writer of the article tried to address. As you properly point out, SB, it is not just what us uber fans think, but relatively the way and trends of how and what broader portions of the population, who will never been uber-any-sport, think and do, and some of the rather visible hard reality is not that good.

The road for recovery for figure skating is not going to be an easy one. (I am still hopeful though.)
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
...
Jason Brown is unique. Taking an educated guess, he wears a ponytail not to be different but to be himself and he isn't afraid of being himself. But he is also distinctive and different. He doesn't seem to do anything cautiously but rather he seems to do everything assuredly. That is pretty unique not just with any athlete but any person. WYSIWYG. Remember when he skated at Skate America and there were not a small number of comments on this site that he should lose his ponytail and fix up his appearance? Anyone doubt that he hasn't been getting those comments for years and years, and that someone hasn't told him that it might affect his endorsements if he ever got big? ...

Agree with your educated guess (and I admire Jason for being 100% comfortable with himself), but don't understand why his ponytail is under discussion at all in the context of this thread.
(Shaun White was wearing his hair long and loose at the time that he became an extremely popular superstar. The much shorter hairstyle that he has now also looks good on him. Doesn't make him any more or less appealing to me [someone who is a generation older and who always has liked him].)

p.s. I have realized that my post above (#35) perhaps was unclear. When I said, "But sponsors already have placed their bets" on Davis/White and the ladies, I was responding to noidont's opinion that "the golden marketing period is after the Olympics, not before." I meant only that sponsors already (before the Olympics) have staked their claims on D/W and the ladies -- to be prepared with a pre-existing relationship if/when they hit the medal jackpot. Was not saying that it's too late for sponsors to place their bets on Jason as well.

I think the Businessweek story was deficient for not mentioning Jason's FS video. I think that the phenomenon of it going viral signifies that contrary to conventional wisdom, the general public is not hard-wired to prefer the ladies' discipline. All bets are off, and that's a good thing.
 

LRK

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Jason's ponytail: He said in an interview that his hair is very unruly... I forget the exact term he used however, and that as a child he was told.... by judges or someone or other?... to eithr cut it very short or grow it out and have a ponytail. Because they found it distracting. And he's had a ponytail since.

The 0,7 "in the demo". Well, I've been following ratings of US broadcast shows on Deadline, and "the demo" is apparently all that matters to the advertisers - as explained by posters earlier in the thread. I can add that scripted shows that hit 0,7 are almost immediately yanked off the schedule. The "demo" often does not watch live however, and the broadcasters are trying to make the advertisers also take into consideration the whole month of viewing (as of now they count Live+3 days, I believe.) So far without success. Shows with 7-8 million (or more, my memory for figures is very poor) viewers have been cancelled if the numbers have not been good enough in "the demo".

Somebody somewhere decided that people over 50 aren't interested in trying new things, and that's what the advertisers religiously believe.
 

concorde

Medalist
Joined
Jul 29, 2013
The US needs a top skater who is marketed correctly. Michelle Kwan was the last American to have both. Davis/White fit the bill as top skaters but they are not well know outside of the ice skating world. For the ladies we don't have a top skates at the international level.

Name recognition plays a HUGE roles in the public's perception of a person. I'm sure Lindsey's Vonn name recognition factor greatly increased when she starting Tiger Woods.
 

Manitou

Medalist
Joined
Jan 17, 2014
Somebody somewhere decided that people over 50 aren't interested in trying new things, and that's what the advertisers religiously believe.

Exactly, which is completely b.s. From my observation people over 50 spend much more time before TV than any other group. They are very vulnerable to lots of advertising: cosmetics, phones, travel deals, cars, healthy lifestyle related products, hobby products, cameras, gadgets. They are the ones who crowd arenas at concerts, shows, movies and sporting events. As generous grandparents they are also very vulnerable to any advertising related to young kids.
Of course they are absolutely not interested in video games or similar useless garbage, and that alone is taking a huge portion of marketing industry, but there are plenty other things they are very open to.

The thing is the world is now completely controlled by the pop-culture. The world IS pop-culture. The world is Capitol. Look at the TV. Everything must be young, white and beautiful. And photoshopped to death.

Another problem is that everything in US sports must be measured by millions. If something falls short of those millions then it must die. Everything must be huge, gigantic, the greatest in the world. Huge games, huge arenas, huge crowds, huge ratings and huge earnings.
Everything else is destined to die. Or thrive in self-financed niches. There is no concept of something in the middle. Kids very talented in volleyball after graduating from college must go to Europe so that they can continue playing volleyball. Because volleyball is to small for America. It's great for Europe, but for America is not measured in mega-millions, so it has no right to exist.

What is the point comparing figure skating to football or basketball? Why do we even try to compare them? Why do we have to compare them? If figure skating in not measured in mega-millions by TV networks then why don't they leave it alone and treat it as college lacrosse? There is plenty room on ESPN for live college lacrosse, so there should be enough room for live figure skating too, right? Don't block it, don't try to make huge money on it by blocking it and claiming exclusive rights to it, or kill it if it doesn't make those money. Just let it live.
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
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Feb 27, 2012
Name recognition plays a HUGE roles in the public's perception of a person. I'm sure Lindsey's Vonn name recognition factor greatly increased when she starting Tiger Woods.

Agree about the power of name recognition.

Disagree with your comment re Lindsey Vonn. Her name recognition (at least in the U.S.) already was very high before the 2010 Olympics, and it went up even higher because of her success in Vancouver. Dating Tiger Woods might have caused a minor increase -- but I doubt that it was a great increase because her name recognition already was extremely high.
(I am not a skiing fan. I don't watch non-Olympic skiing. And I watch Olympic skiing only when NBC forces me to as an interruption [from my perspective] to other Olympic sports that are being televised on the same night. But before the Vancouver Games even had started, I was tired of hearing the endless Vonn hype by many media outlets (not only NBC). It was inescapable.)
 

louisa05

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 3, 2011
After watching the grammies last night, I assume that most sports will die a slow death in the U.S. It was clear that the young crowd prefers gimmicks and spectacle over all else. If Jeremy skated in a helmet, Davis & White sprayed paint all over themselves, the pairs dry humped each other and Ashley and Gracie attempted to sing while doing their triples with all of it including pyrotechnics, skating might have a chance. But if they are all just going to skate, the young and hip in this country are going to find it boring. But that is bound to be true of all sports including the major ones.
 

noskates

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
:laugh:

Unfortunately - I think you're pretty close to being correct. But the visuals your post inspired just made me laugh out loud!
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
The US needs a top skater who is marketed correctly. Michelle Kwan was the last American to have both. Davis/White fit the bill as top skaters but they are not well know outside of the ice skating world. For the ladies we don't have a top skates at the international level.

Name recognition plays a HUGE roles in the public's perception of a person. I'm sure Lindsey's Vonn name recognition factor greatly increased when she starting Tiger Woods.

I thik as attractive and champion oriented as D and W are they sadly just don't have the it factor, that charisma that takes you to the top of the sponsor desired stars. They say the right stuff but are rather blah and ice dance while popular to skating enthusiast is mocked the most by the public for not being a sport. Hard sell fortoughness or anything.
 

Barb

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 13, 2009
After watching the grammies last night, I assume that most sports will die a slow death in the U.S. It was clear that the young crowd prefers gimmicks and spectacle over all else. If Jeremy skated in a helmet, Davis & White sprayed paint all over themselves, the pairs dry humped each other and Ashley and Gracie attempted to sing while doing their triples with all of it including pyrotechnics, skating might have a chance. But if they are all just going to skate, the young and hip in this country are going to find it boring. But that is bound to be true of all sports including the major ones.
But seriously I think some skaters should to skate music of Justin Bieber, One direction and Miley, at least people will realize figure skating is live yet. I was watching Shibs MJ program and a lot comments in youtube seem of MJ fans purely, not figure skating fans :yes:
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
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But seriously I think some skaters should to skate music of Justin Bieber, One direction and Miley, at least people will realize figure skating is live yet. I was watching Shibs MJ program and a lot comments in youtube seem of MJ fans purely, not figure skating fans :yes:

Along the lines of what you are suggesting, Max Aaron opted for Daft Punk, who won four Grammys on Sunday, for his SP last season. Very cool :cool:.
OTOH, Jason Brown skates to Riverdance, which is much more of a niche choice in terms of music. And his FS program went viral. Go figure.

I thik as attractive and champion oriented as D and W are they sadly just don't have the it factor, that charisma that takes you to the top of the sponsor desired stars. They say the right stuff but are rather blah and ice dance while popular to skating enthusiast is mocked the most by the public for not being a sport. Hard sell fortoughness or anything.

Blah is in the eye of the beholder ... and I would say that Davis/White are blah-free more often than not, esp. in comparison to certain U.S. skaters who (inexplicably to me) are media darlings. (I am not referring to Jason Brown.)
 

noskates

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 11, 2012
I think D & W will be very marketable - especially if they win the OGM. They're attractive, both are articulate, they've been together forever but not romantically inclined, college students, have a life outside of skating, etc. etc. It isn't enough to win a medal - you also have to have a personality. And 'some' of the media darlings (not Jason Brown) are devoid of personality on and off the ice!
 

LRK

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Along the lines of what you are suggesting, Max Aaron opted for Daft Punk, who won four Grammys on Sunday, for his SP last season. Very cool :cool:.
OTOH, Jason Brown skates to Riverdance, which is much more of a niche choice in terms of music. And his FS program went viral. Go figure.

Interesting point. I think the problem with looking for a "formula for success" is that.. there really isn't a "one size fits all formula". There are individual circumstances... and often the reasons for anyone gaining popularity over anybody else can be pretty random. Would anyone have guessed the success, for example, of Susan Boyle? Wouldn't her story pretty much go against any formula ever devised?

I certainly doubt that a skater skating to Justin Bieber would have his fans turning out in droves suddenly becoming ardent figure skating fans. Or maybe they wouldn't even ever be made aware that there even is a figure skater skating to his music.
 

ice coverage

avatar credit: @miyan5605
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Interesting point. I think the problem with looking for a "formula for success" is that.. there really isn't a "one size fits all formula". There are individual circumstances... and often the reasons for anyone gaining popularity over anybody else can be pretty random. Would anyone have guessed the success, for example, of Susan Boyle? Wouldn't her story pretty much go against any formula ever devised?

I certainly doubt that a skater skating to Justin Bieber would have his fans turning out in droves suddenly becoming ardent figure skating fans. Or maybe they wouldn't even ever be made aware that there even is a figure skater skating to his music.

LRK, agree with you 100% that it would be an exercise in futility to try to identify a magic formula.

LOL, another thought on how Jason Brown proves that popularity is unpredictable:
His SP music is from Prince, but his Riverdance FS video is the one that went viral.
(As an aside, I said in another thread that I think the limited inherent appeal of Riverdance music worked in Jason's favor in a way. What got some people excited about the video is that the quality of his performance overcame their dislike of the music.)
 

bluelutz

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 23, 2003
On Thursday night, I watched Men's SP on NBC.
Actually I had already watched it on internet, but still liked to hear what Scott and Sandra would say.
However, NBC showed Free style skiing during the prime time, which I really enjoyed,
and they finally showed a few Figure skaters toward the end of the program.
I did not count exactly how many were shown, but compared with the past coverage, it was definitely far less.

Of course, I knew the decline of the popularity of figure skating in US, it has been talked for quite a while,
but now it is less than free style skiing???

During the last Olympic games coverage, Bob Costas stated that at least in the North America,
Figure skating was the main piece of the winter Olympic.

Because of the internet, I do not care about the network coverage much,
but still it is a bit scary.
 
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