What's next for Patrick Chan? | Page 5 | Golden Skate

What's next for Patrick Chan?

lakeside

On the Ice
Joined
Jun 29, 2012
I don't think all Japanese guys are humble. Machida, for example, is not humble at all. Before GPF he said he wants to win 2018 Olympic gold medal. After Worlds he said he will grab the gold medal from Yuzru at next Worlds.
 

lbc2138

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 7, 2014
I don't think all Japanese guys are humble. Machida, for example, is not humble at all. Before GPF he said he wants to win 2018 Olympic gold medal. After Worlds he said he will grab the gold medal from Yuzru at next Worlds.

I think it's more ambitious than quote on quote not humble. He's just making it obvious what his goals are and all he probably wants is people to pay attention to him. Yuzu says he'll do what it takes to get gold in 2018 but I wouldn't classify it as not humble. I don't blame Tatsuki for doing so since he's been the dark horse for men's figure skating in Japan for quite sometime now.

If Patrick were to want to win another Worlds to add on his three, when should he ideally do it? 2015?
 

Meoima

Match Penalty
Joined
Feb 13, 2014
I don't think all Japanese guys are humble. Machida, for example, is not humble at all. Before GPF he said he wants to win 2018 Olympic gold medal. After Worlds he said he will grab the gold medal from Yuzru at next Worlds.

I think Hanyu is the most ambitious. Hanyu might sound humble and playful off-ice, but his true nature is a competitor. Frankly, Hanyu is more brutal on ice than most men out there. He is a show-off on ice, just like Plushenko. There's really a resemblance here. Personally, I think this kid is the least Japanese out of all.

For me, Machida is the most Japanese guys out of Hanyu and Daisuke. Machida is hard to read, ambitious but silent and patience. He does not show his competitive nature often.

The most well-respected Japanese skater is Daisuke, he is a true hard-working skater at heart, his feels of music, and his genuine actions and his passion pouring though skating, people can feel a lot from him. As for me, Machida hasn't showed that side as much as Daisuke. I can get why some people say they don't like Machida much because he has a difficult-to-read vibe. One of the reasons Daisuke is loved the most in Japan, because he is so matured and genuine and classy.
 

gottadance

On the Ice
Joined
Jul 27, 2009
I wonder if Patrick is not so much struggling with the failure to win Gold in Sochi but rather with the pretty much indisputable fact that he made a serious error in judgement in not continuing with a jump coach .
If he is to continue in skating as I pray he does, then he needs to come to terms with the fact he made a hugely costly mistake and rectify it - otherwise he will continue to struggle against the higher BV of the up and comers. I have no issue with his modern dance coach who he clearly has a great rapport with , but it MUST be augmented by a first class regular jump coach.
 

JayW

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 8, 2013
From time to time, I am wondering whether Chan's inconsistency is the result of bad techniques or just his mentality?
 

Meoima

Match Penalty
Joined
Feb 13, 2014
From time to time, I am wondering whether Chan's inconsistency is the result of bad techniques or just his mentality?

I would say it's his mentality. PChan has great techniques when it comes to movement control on ice. But well, his axel is his nemesis.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
That all depends on the structure of his program in terms of beating Yuzuru. Of course this if both are skating cleanly. By next year, I'm sure Yuzu will probably have landed the 2+ quads in addition to his high valued axel combinations. If Chan can get around his mental block with the axels, then maybe. But PCS isn't going to save Patrick anymore, looks like the judges have found a new favorite.

Pretty much. If Hanyu skated to his potential and landed the quad salchow I wouldnt see even a clean Chan ever beating him. Now if Hanyu skated a LP like worlds with low landings on almost every jump then perhaps. Hanyu has a big base value edge, and if they both skate their best will likely win on GOE too. That leaves too much a PCS to make up, especialy now that Hanyu is getting PCS close to Chan (deservedly or undeserved). I have actually said since 2012 I believe Hanyu is overscored on PCS, and while his skating has improved immensely since then, I believe he is still is as high PCS are alot higher now too. Granted I also find Chan inflated on PCS, I have long said those are the two most overscored skaters of this era in general.

It will be interesting to see whether Fernandez can improve enough to have a chance vs even a clean Hanyu, and if he can improve his consistency to actually deliver more clean performances. The worst thing about him is alot of his mistakes mental ones and not understanding COP. His Olympic LP looked almost clean, yet by the protocals had 6 mistakes and places of points lost. He would have won worlds this year had he not singled the lutz, even with the ridiculous Japanese inflation (especialy for Machida).

Machida seems to be a late bloomer so will be interesting to see what he can continue to do. He wont get scores like he did at worlds anywhere but Japan though unless he does continue to improve alot.

Ten is another interesting prospect moving forward. Both his big event medals were out of the blue and completely unexpected. He isnt consistent at all, and he doesnt have the scoring potential of the others, but he seems to have a knack for pulling his best performances out of nowhere at big events lately where others fall apart. Despite his excellent skating skills, and quiet elegance, and intricate choreography of his programs his PCS are fairly low. Judges (probably like many of us) find him lacking excitement and a bit boring. His GOE arent super high either.

What I am most interested in though is the development of the young American men and the young crop of guys we saw at world juniors this year (although dont expect the latter to be any factor until atleast 2017). I think the U.S could have a bright future with Farris, Brown, Aaron, Dornbush (if he continues), Chen, and I havent totally given up on Rippon and Miner yet should they continue.
 

blue dog

Trixie Schuba's biggest fan!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 16, 2006
He has earned this season off. We forget that he's been on the international circuit for close to a decade. I'm not a vocal fan of Patrick, but like any skater, if he wants to take a break and come back, let him.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Agree with pangtongfan and Panpie

I think Sochi was poorly organized in that the men only had one night in between their skates. I mean Worlds was a much better performance from both women and men's singles because they spaced out the event nicely (of course it leaves room to get injured in the day between).

I think that extra night would have made all the difference for all of the skaters at Sochi considering how relatively poorly everyone did. Denis was amazing but overall even before the final group it was just a splatfest. People were especially cruel as to why they didn't understand why Yuzu and Chan even placed and how anti-climatic everything was, but then again they probably don't know how the system works since to the amateur viewer, a clean performance is better than a flawed but harder program.

You make some good points about the poor scheduling of the Olympic mens LP, but you have to remember this is a VERY inconsistent era of mens skating. That is the biggest reason (along with often poor judging) Chan has won so many of his titles with poor skates with lots of mistakes, and Hanyu won his Olympic gold that way too. The 2013 worlds was horribly skated and what was the excuse there. Not scheduling. 2012 worlds was mediocre at best, although the top 4 had pretty good, but not great or even clean, LPs (well Joubert's 4th place one was the only clean LP but outdated). 2011 world was an epic mess outside of Chan and Kozuka's LP. 2010 Olympics and 2009 worlds were meh at best, how else could quadless Lysacek end up as champion after all. The last great events for men before worlds this year were 2007 worlds or for a semi big event 2008 Four Continents. i guess 2012-2013 season grand prix final was fairly good with Takahashi, Hanyu, Chan, and Fernandez in the LP phase all skating very well, but again not great. It was good to see the men skate well at worlds, and it has been the first time in such a long time.

Still I think 2009-2014 will go down in history even 100 years from now as the all time dark age of mens skating. Awful judging, awful skating, awful competitors, awful scoring system. Thank goodness it is over and worlds this year was a sign of better things to come.
 

Meoima

Match Penalty
Joined
Feb 13, 2014
Still I think 2009-2014 will go down in history even 100 years from now as the all time dark age of mens skating. Awful judging, awful skating, awful competitors, awful scoring system. Thank goodness it is over and worlds this year was a sign of better things to come.
And awful costumes. :cry:
 

lbc2138

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 7, 2014
BTW you are right lbc2138 Japanese inflation anywhere near as bad as Chanadaflation or Russianflation when there are events held there so it wasnt meant as a dig at the Japanese.

Haha no worries, that's what I'm here for! I got called out a lot in terms of political correctness during my first couple years of college so that's how you learn.
 

anyanka

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 8, 2011
god yes, what is it that Hanyu wins. Who the heck is his costume designer, Johnny Weir, LOL! It looks like he borrowed some netting from a hornet or bee factory and sewed it together with some lace to make a costume.

Er, actually ... yes. It does look like Johnny's 2005-06 SP to The Swan, reversed, and strung up with Christmas lights.
 

Figure 8's

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
I don't know who I felt more sorry for, Patrick, Elvis or Curt. They all bombed at the Olympics when they were the favorites and should have won. Patrick will recoup and move on just like the others did.
 

anyanka

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 8, 2011
I don't know who I felt more sorry for, Patrick, Elvis or Curt. They all bombed at the Olympics when they were the favorites and should have won. Patrick will recoup and move on just like the others did.

Don't forget the original double silver winner, Orser. And he's doing just fine coaching others to gold. ;)
 

JayW

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 8, 2013
Elvis never bombed at the Olympics. He skated very well in all 4 Olympics he was ever in for that matter. Skated his absolute best in 92 (not as a serious contender) and 94, and many felt should have won in 94 but the judges went with Urmanov. In 98 he had a pulled groin and turned in one of the most heroic performances in history to win silver, skating a clean 8 triple program with a pulled groin, while many of his fully healthy rivals like Eldredge and Yagudin bombed to let him win that silver. 2002 past his prime he again skated very well with only a small error in the short, and an almost clean LP with 2 quads.

I used to like Elvis a lot, since he symbolized hard-working under dogs. His short height, his not-so-handsome look and his disproportional body, all made me like him more. However, he tends to weigh in a lot of issues. Sometimes it is just annoying. My initial respect to him is fading away. Is it just me or not?
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Actually while I liked him alot for the same reasons you do, this was true in his amateur days. He whined constantly about how he was scored, when outside the 94 Olympics (underscored in LP) and 94 worlds (deserved his scores) he was in fact overscored relative to his competitors, especialy Eldredge, Sandhu, Zagarodniuk, the Chinese men, at times Kulik and Yagudin. I often though it was an intimidation tactic to get higher marks, and based on the scores he often received I suspect it worked.

Not really an intimidation tactic. He usually landed his jumps. And in those days, if you landed your jumps and achieved a certain rank, all you had to do was land the jumps and it didn't matter if other competitors had better programs or were more interesting. Elvis (who I respect a lot for his consistency) had the same old macho shtick in his programs, the same way Plushenko powers into his first 3 jumping passes in every single program the exact same way. Those guys were predictable, albeit very consistent, and when nobody else jumped well, it didn't matter that their program content in between the elements was intrinsically basic and unoriginal... they still did the quad and ticked off the list of jumps the best, ergo, win. It's the very reason Plushenko won in 2006 and beat out skaters in 2010, he landed his jumps... didn't matter that Lambiel/Buttle/Chan/Takahashi had far better programs. Would skaters like Elvis and Plushenko get away with that today, now that the field is technically more consistent? Probably not.
 

moviechick

On the Ice
Joined
May 7, 2008
I don't know who I felt more sorry for, Patrick, Elvis or Curt. They all bombed at the Olympics when they were the favorites and should have won. Patrick will recoup and move on just like the others did.

Elvis achieved about as much as he could have in this sport with his talents. Because he was so uninterested in being artistic, he had to rely on other people flopping a bit to win and since he did not perform his much hyped quad in either Olympics, I think he did as well as possible. Plus he has 2 silver medals from 2 different Olympics.

Kurt bombed 3 times, so yeah, I do feel bad for him.

Patrick bombed twice, but the worse part for him is that he lost to a performance with 2 falls and it should've been so easy/manageable.
 

moviechick

On the Ice
Joined
May 7, 2008
Patrick did not bomb in 2010. He actually had one of his best competitions of the season at the Games. Remember he had been injured and was clearly not up to speed that season.

Based on the hype though? And was trash talking that season too and making digs at legends like Yagudin (for having easy footwork).

I mean, he did not have a good SP or LP and ended up 5th, after which, everyone cried foul at how Weir was robbed.
 
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