Russian Nationals podium

CanadianSkaterGuy · Apr 23, 2014

volk said:
So many people are writing off Kovtun, but I don't mind. After the Worlds he talked about improving his endurance, choreography and increasing difficulty for next season. Unless he has a major disaster at Nationals he should make the team.

Barring a complete meltdown, he will win Russian Nationals, IMO. I don't think people are writing him off, so much as they don't like the bratty type of person he is (which I thoroughly agree with). Anyone with half a brain should know that Kovtun will medal at Russian Nationals. And if he loses, it'll be to Voronov (who has picked up his consistency), but should still make the World team. I was impressed with how quickly Kovtun picked up the quad salchow, and went from two quads to three quad programs in less than one season (not to mention, going from 17th to 4th at Worlds). He needs more consistency and confidence, and his overall skating needs much refinement, but he's certainly on his way from a jumping standpoint.

Miss Ice · Apr 23, 2014

I don't like any of the Russian ladies except Pogo (haha, she is not even technically Russian) and Sakhanovich. IMHO, Lip is extremely overrated, zero expression, mostly tiny jumps, personally for me not pleasing contortionist positions in spirals/spins. Sotnikova is unlikely to come back, and if she does, given her consistency (or lack thereof) on the ice shows, I would say is not a contender although if she competes, her PCS's would be super inflated at Nats and I can see her winning Nats over a clean Pogo just because of PCS. Same with Lip, she has yet to prove to be consistent, but her PCS will continue to be inflated for no reason. IMO, Pogo and Sakhanovich have the most ladylike skating (but so far sucky music, unfortunately; they gotta fix that or get better choreographers). I really dislike Radionova's skating style; just another juniorish jumping bean who has yet to prove herself, yet people are already placing bets on her. This is Ladies' skating, so I only recognize ladies.

Anyway, pretty much all of them are pretty expressionless right now, and I am hoping some of them improve on this in the upcoming season.

MsLiinaLii · Apr 23, 2014

Miss Ice said:
I don't like any of the Russian ladies except Pogo (haha, she is not even technically Russian) and Sakhanovich. IMHO, Lip is extremely overrated, zero expression, mostly tiny jumps, personally for me not pleasing contortionist positions in spirals/spins. Sotnikova is unlikely to come back, and if she does, given her consistency (or lack thereof) on the ice shows, I would say is not a contender although if she competes, her PCS's would be super inflated at Nats and I can see her winning Nats over a clean Pogo just because of PCS. Same with Lip, she has yet to prove to be consistent, but her PCS will continue to be inflated for no reason. IMO, Pogo and Sakhanovich have the most ladylike skating (but so far sucky music, unfortunately; they gotta fix that or get better choreographers). I really dislike Radionova's skating style; just another juniorish jumping bean who has yet to prove herself, yet people are already placing bets on her. This is Ladies' skating, so I only recognize ladies.

Anyway, pretty much all of them are pretty expressionless right now, and I am hoping some of them improve on this in the upcoming season.

Pogo is technically Russian as she was born in Moscow.

But if I follow your logic, then a gymnast Nastia Liukin, who was born in Russia and both of her parents are Russian, should defenitely be considered Russian, not American.

AliceInWonderland · Apr 23, 2014

Miss Ice said:
I don't like any of the Russian ladies except Pogo (haha, she is not even technically Russian) and Sakhanovich. IMHO, Lip is extremely overrated, zero expression, mostly tiny jumps, personally for me not pleasing contortionist positions in spirals/spins. Sotnikova is unlikely to come back, and if she does, given her consistency (or lack thereof) on the ice shows, I would say is not a contender although if she competes, her PCS's would be super inflated at Nats and I can see her winning Nats over a clean Pogo just because of PCS. Same with Lip, she has yet to prove to be consistent, but her PCS will continue to be inflated for no reason. IMO, Pogo and Sakhanovich have the most ladylike skating (but so far sucky music, unfortunately; they gotta fix that or get better choreographers). I really dislike Radionova's skating style; just another juniorish jumping bean who has yet to prove herself, yet people are already placing bets on her. This is Ladies' skating, so I only recognize ladies.

Anyway, pretty much all of them are pretty expressionless right now, and I am hoping some of them improve on this in the upcoming season.

Pogo was born and raised in Russia but her parents are Ukrainian. Presently, she hasn't really talked about if she identifies as Russian or Ukrainian or Russian-Ukrainian. It's her choice, really, and until then, I don't think it's fair to say that she's "technically" not Russian. I know I would be offended if somebody told me that I "technically" wasn't Canadian because my parents are not from Canada.

Alba · Apr 23, 2014

Miss Ice said:
I don't like any of the Russian ladies except Pogo (haha, she is not even technically Russian) and Sakhanovich. IMHO, Lip is extremely overrated, zero expression, mostly tiny jumps, personally for me not pleasing contortionist positions in spirals/spins. Sotnikova is unlikely to come back, and if she does, given her consistency (or lack thereof) on the ice shows, I would say is not a contender although if she competes, her PCS's would be super inflated at Nats and I can see her winning Nats over a clean Pogo just because of PCS. Same with Lip, she has yet to prove to be consistent, but her PCS will continue to be inflated for no reason. IMO, Pogo and Sakhanovich have the most ladylike skating (but so far sucky music, unfortunately; they gotta fix that or get better choreographers). I really dislike Radionova's skating style; just another juniorish jumping bean who has yet to prove herself, yet people are already placing bets on her. This is Ladies' skating, so I only recognize ladies.

Anyway, pretty much all of them are pretty expressionless right now, and I am hoping some of them improve on this in the upcoming season.

WOW! For someone who doesn't like (to use an eufemism) any of the Russian ladies you certainly took your time and energy to express your opinion laud and clear. I find that amusing, since based on your comment this topic should not be of any interest to you. :sarcasm:

AliceInWonderland said:
I know I would be offended if somebody told me that I "technically" wasn't Canadian because my parents are not from Canada.

Don't be, just ignore it.
These kind of people are the same little hypocrits who open their mouth to talk about Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité, human rights etc. when it suits them only.

YLFan · Apr 23, 2014

I don't know how someone can really be overrated that wins 5 golds and 2 silvers in a season. Wouldn't that better fit someone like Gold who is extremely hyped but has never won an International gold medal?

Polina Edmunds could compete for Russia if she wanted to.

Miss Ice · Apr 23, 2014

Alba said:
WOW! For someone who doesn't like (to use an eufemism) any of the Russian ladies you certainly took your time and energy to express your opinion laud and clear. I find that amusing, since based on your comment this topic should not be of any interest to you. :sarcasm:

Wrong. I said that I like Pogo and Sakhanovich. Then I gave reasons for why they are the ones I like.

And ok, sure, she is Russian with Ukrainian roots. It doesn't really matter to me, what matters is the skating.

Alba · Apr 23, 2014

YLFan said:
Polina Edmunds could compete for Russia if she wanted to.

She is not American, "technically"? :eek:

Alba · Apr 23, 2014

Miss Ice said:
Wrong. I said that I like Pogo and Sakhanovich.

But Pogo is not "technically" Russian, and I'm sure if we dig further we would find that Serafima as well it's not from "pure" Russian origins?

And ok, sure, she is Russian with Ukrainian roots. It doesn't really matter to me, what matters is the skating.

Good for you.

Sam-Skwantch · Apr 23, 2014

I've been wondering for some time how Polina would fair at Russian nations. You would need "fair" (its possible)ISU judges of course. I think she would be top 5 and maybe closer to the podium than some might think. I may be critical at times on her presentation but she is the most interesting American to me ATM.

Maybe it's time for a good old top 5 Americans vs top 5 Russians event :popcorn:

Miss Ice · Apr 23, 2014

Alba said:
But Pogo is not "technically" Russian, and I'm sure if we dig further we would find that Serafima as well it's not from "pure" Russian origins?

Um, what. I just said nationality means nothing. The only reason I put that "technically" there is for irony. Irony.

Sam-Skwantch · Apr 23, 2014

Miss Ice said:
Wrong. I said that I like Pogo and Sakhanovich. Then I gave reasons for why they are the ones I like.

And ok, sure, she is Russian with Ukrainian roots. It doesn't really matter to me, what matters is the skating.

Serafima is artistically superior to almost every Russian in the field. I'm a huge fan and glad to see others enjoy her too

Serafima quick fact: she likes heavy rock music like Black Sabbath, Misfits and Van Halen. Not your typical ice queen off of the ice!!!

Alba · Apr 23, 2014

Miss Ice said:
Um, what. I just said nationality means nothing. The only reason I put that "technically" there is for irony. Irony.

Yeah. I'm being ironic too. Don't you like it? :eek:

hwell:

fleeting · Apr 23, 2014

Sam-Skwantch said:
I've been wondering for some time how Polina would fair at Russian nations. You would need "fair" (its possible)ISU judges of course. I think she would be top 5 and maybe closer to the podium than some might think. I may be critical at times on her presentation but she is the most interesting American to me ATM.

Maybe it's time for a good old top 5 Americans vs top 5 Russians event

Would we use the Russian Nationals finishes this year (Sotnikova, Lipnitskaya, Radionova, Proklova, and Leonova) or would we bump up Pogo because of her performance at Worlds?

Anyway, I'd like to see that! Gracie, Polina, Ashley, Mirai, and Samantha vs Adelina, Yulia, Elena, Alexandra and the wild card.

Sam-Skwantch · Apr 23, 2014

Wouldn't matter much to me who they sent. Probably better to leave the Nationals results out of it for fear of influencing the final placements.

I do know that I for one would be so pumped and it could help sell the sport to us Americans I think.

I nominate Joe Louis Arena to host round one!!

hanca · Apr 24, 2014

fleeting said:
Would we use the Russian Nationals finishes this year (Sotnikova, Lipnitskaya, Radionova, Proklova, and Leonova) or would we bump up Pogo because of her performance at Worlds?

Anyway, I'd like to see that! Gracie, Polina, Ashley, Mirai, and Samantha vs Adelina, Yulia, Elena, Alexandra and the wild card.

USA would loose, obviously. Look at the results from Olympics and from worlds. If you have 2 Russians against 2 US ladies, the Russians have been consistently winning the whole season.

And in regards to Sam-Skwantch's question where Polina would place at the Russian nationals - my guess is around 8-10th place. Look where she placed at the JGPF (beaten by 3 Russian youngsters). At worlds beaten by Pogorilaya and Lipnitskaya. At Olympics beaten by Sotnikova and Lipnitskaya. There is no way she would place in the top 5 and maybe closer to the podium as suggested by Sam-Skwantch. Polina is a beautiful skater and very technically competent, but she hasn't had many clean programs throughout this season; there was always a mistake or two. Those mistakes were VERY costly especially at Russian nationals - look how costly it was for Pogorilaya and Tuktamysheva.

aschiutza · Apr 24, 2014

So, alledgedly Gachinski let TAT to do the choreo of his new programs. I hope that boost his confidence (plus he is having then TAT at his side for politicking). I see him now with great chances to go on the place 2... His technik is already good, choreo had also a pretty good past season, what he need is confidence and stay injury free.

sky_fly20 · Apr 24, 2014

aschiutza said:
So, alledgedly Gachinski let TAT to do the choreo of his new programs. I hope that boost his confidence (plus he is having then TAT at his side for politicking). I see him now with great chances to go on the place 2... His technik is already good, choreo had also a pretty good past season, what he need is confidence and stay injury free.

What Gachinski needs is a new coach not Named " Grimm Reaper " Sokolovskaya

aschiutza · Apr 24, 2014

He has already the technik, the choreo is from TAT, what bad can do Sokolovskaya?

sky_fly20 · Apr 24, 2014

aschiutza said:
He has already the technik, the choreo is from TAT, what bad can do Sokolovskaya?

haven't you considered " Grimm Reaper" Sokolovskaya not only destroys jumps but her skaters always gets injured
and disappears into oblivion

Russian Nationals podium

CanadianSkaterGuy

Miss Ice

Let the sky fall~

MsLiinaLii

AliceInWonderland

Alba

YLFan

Match Penalty

Miss Ice

Let the sky fall~

Alba

Alba

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”

Miss Ice

Let the sky fall~

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”

Alba

fleeting

Queen Anissina

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”

hanca

aschiutza

sky_fly20

Match Penalty

aschiutza

sky_fly20

Match Penalty

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