2015 US Nationals Senior Men Short Program Jan 23
- Thread starter dorispulaski
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that escalate quicklyso you think Adam or Josh should have won NOW?
I'd give it to Adam. I'd still have Josh in 3rd even with credit for the 3Lutz that was "zayaked". Brown had the overall better LP performance.
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that's my placement as well. I think Adam deserves it more. But to be fair Jason is more consistent and PCS friendly than Adam. So he is more of a safe choice IMO.
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Well consistency should have nothing to do with how an event is scored. As always, though, the judges give padding to whoever is anointed. If Jason repeats this exact performance at Worlds he's going to be scored in the 86-87 range.
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But we all know the title US Champion will give him more point in PCS. I am sure both Jason and Nam will get some higher PCS internationally after they become champions in their respective Nationals. That's what Nationals are for. To choose the no.1 who will receive the most back up from their feds.
And consistency is the key.
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Not that much, for a performance like this.
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i dont know about Nam's PCS but JAson got 44+ already, i dont think they are gonna give him more than that at Worlds regardless of he is US champ or not
He has scored 44+ nationally... internationally his PB is 40.81 so as US number 1 skater he probably will score somewhat higher then that (even though I'm allways more convinced that being number one isn't as important reputation wise as it was in the past)
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that escalate quickly
This makes me laugh because I, just like BoP watched the top three SPs and LPs attentively today, which I hadn't really done with all of them (Jason particularly). Only I ended up changing my mind exactly the other way round!
Now everybody here probably knows by now that I'm this forum's biggest Jason stan, and some may know that I'm also a big fan of Adam's.
On Sunday, I was pretty convinced that I also thought that Adam should have won the whole shebang on PCS. Obviously I was sorry that Josh Zayaked and would have liked him to get silver. I even tweeted about it. Two nights later, with a clearer head, I have had to reconsider.
I liked Juke when I first saw it in a summer comp, but I ended up not enjoying it that much at all (I rue the day they decided to put in the sprinkler! And the sparkly suspenders!) and I have been hoping that they would tone down the hamming all season long. No luck. Normally I'll watch all of my faves' clean programs multiple times. I think I watched the Nebelhorn Juke maybe twice, others only once. His free I adore - yet my season's favourite free belongs to Adam, possibly partly because I saw it live and it was magnificient.
Today I rewatched both the SPs and the LPs very attentively, and I was just amazed by the difference in content between Adam and Jason/Josh. Because I was watching Jason's SP and really trying to block out the cheese factor (I was looking at it through the eyes of someone who enjoys that kind of thing, basically) I managed to concentrate on the technical much more. And I had to admit to myself, even though I had really wanted to give the SP to Adam as well as the FS, it does belong to Jason. Though only slightly over Joshua. But Adam, I hate to admit, belonged in 3rd (if he'd executed the elements that he intended, and received the PCS he deserves & the GOE that a Rippon Lutz deserves) or 4th (on PCS & Rippon GOE only).
Overall, the cleanest and most confident, assured program was Jason's.
Adam lost alotta points on his spins, and no matter how ugly someone thinks Jason's spins were, he got the levels. Josh also had one level 3 spin.
Both Adam and Josh had clearly superior Axels, but one had an UR (which I hear was very clear at the rink) solo jump without connecting steps, and the other had a bobble on his combo. All Jason's jumps were clean, with transitions in and/or out, and his combo was unusually good. Adam's combo of course was brilliant, and I have been saying forever that the Rippon variation should get much better GOEs than is currently the case. But unfortunately it doesn't, and it's a travesty.
Step sequences were all good, but I had never realised how packed Jason's is in this program. It has quick turns, changes of direction, all sorts of crap that makes it more diifficult (and not just the stsq, throughout the program there are random turns and steps). And as he's normally the slowest of the three (jmo, it looks to me anyway), in this step sequence he's a blur in comparison. Jason did have a blink-and-you'll-miss-it bobble during his stsq, and we don't know if the judges noticed it. I'm not a fan of the program as a whole so much, but I can't deny the difficulty. The amount of crossovers even looked to me to be a lot less than Adam's.
PCS is a different kettle of fish.
Adam has always been lowballed in PCS imo. It may have something to do with previous bad performances, unfulfilled potential, whatever. Who knows? I have seen his comparatively poor PCS mark come up on the screen so many times I had learned not to be disappointed. Now I do have hope that, based on his FS, his PCS will start climbing again!
I wouldn't have had Jason 1st out of the three in SS, even though I can now appreciate the skill and balance it requires just to stay upright doing that Rohene choreo. I'd put him slightly behind Josh and pretty equal to Adam.
Transitions - I couldn't give Adam much more there, Josh's scores I would bring up a bit and Jason's down a wee bit.
PE/EX: Jason was clean, Josh nearly, Adam a bit less so. All performed like crazy, so I would bring Adam up a bit there.
Choreo and Interpretation are the most subjective.
I LOVED Josh's choreo and his interpretation really spoke to me, and I would have been happy to see him leading here based on personal preference.
I liked Adam's interpretation a lot, but the choreo was a on the empty side (not surprising when the program is so new).
Jason...he was perhaps overscored (I felt that high 8s would have been more appropriate), BUT... When I tried to think about it from the point of view of a person whose tastes are very different to mine, I came up with a comparison. I think of him and his SP as I would think about a world-renowned singer whose style I don't care for. I can appreciate that, say, Idina Menzel is a great singer. Still, I do not usually enjoy her musical style and I really didn't like Let It Go. I would hear it on the radio and change the channel, but if asked I would never have said that she is a bad singer, an incompetent performer, a lousy interpreter of music, or that the song is inherently awful just because I personally didn't like it. If Jason is Idina then Juke is my skating Let It Go - I'd rather not listen, but I cannot deny the difficulty, the popularity, or the spot-on interpretation (I actually did enjoy Frozen the movie very much!). He may be interpreting music I don't care for in a FS context, and his interpretation does not appeal to my tastes, but that doesn't mean that the song=choreo or the singer=music/interpretation are no good.
So all in all, I've come to accept the judges' decision as the correct one. Had Adam executed level 4 spins (and we know he is fully capable, being one of the best spinners right now), he would have won, and I would have been over the moon. Especially because then I wouldn't have had to see all the hate on social media toward Jason (and even Kori!).
On PCS I could happily give Adam a point more, even close to two if I were really generous (and I love him!). But not quite 2,5 points. I try so hard not to be a blind fan that sometimes I go too far in the other direction. In this case I had a slight attack of blind-fan-ness but I made it go away by going through this reasoning process
For what it's worth, what I will remember most from these Nationals is Adam's Liszt free skate. Just like 2014 Nationals to me will always be about Jason's Riverdance. I'm happy Jason won, but I find that I'm even happier that Adam did so well, and I have been celebrating him much more than Jason - which is something that I wouldn't have expected at all. For instance, I only very rarely share FS videos on Twitter, even less on Facebook. And the only videos I've shared this time are Ashley's free and Adam's free.
I think that even though Adam didn't win, in the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter, because he has given the world this amazing performance. Jason didn't win last year, but nobody cared (except maybe some blind fans
) because he gave us Riverdance. Next year maybe it's Adam's turn to win and Josh's turn to break the free skating record!
Nice post,TMC. It would be fantastic if Adam's FS got as many hits as Riverdance. It's true, Adam's FS will long be remembered as the great performance of 2015 Nationals from the men. Kind of interesting that both performances won the FS and got the skater an unexpected Silver medal.
I am happy for Jason's win, but it wasn't a resounding victory over Adam. He won by about 2 points, which is not much in the grand scheme of things.
I thought Jason was excellent in his SP, even if I do think Juke is kind of cheesy. His jumps looked so much higher and he does have the difficult transitions. I preferred his Prince program from last year to this, even though I saw big improvements in one year. It will be interesting to see what Rohene picks for him next season.
Speaking of Rohene - it was nice to see him bookending Kori's students in the K&C. He really does look like Prince, LOL.
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- Jan 27, 2014
I just rewatched Adam's skate (probably my 12th time today
) and his smile is so amazing! His whole demeanour is just lighter and happier. Last year I noticed how many, many people who commented on Riverdance on Youtube and the like said that what they'd most enjoyed was how Jason was smiling and looking like he was enjoying what he was doing. Well this is the first time I've seen Adam skate with a huge grin on his face and like he hasn't a care in the world. What a difference it makes!
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- Feb 13, 2014
Gracie never won any GP event before this season, and she automatically got very high PCS when she became US Champion. Her PCS at SA and NHK spoke it all. So I am not surprised if Jason got much higher PCS in 4CC and WC.
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then if thats the case i hope they will give other national champions PCS they deserves as long as they skate well of course (satoko and so youn
)
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- Feb 13, 2014
JSF and KSU are no USFA or Russian Fed I am afraid.then if thats the case i hope they will give other national champions PCS they deserves as long as they skate well of course (satoko and so youn
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