Boyang Jin

Li'Kitsu said:

How is Boyang stagnating? Adding more quads is not the only way to improve, and his SS, PE and IN have improved by miles

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Might have meant technically -- not about more quads, but I don't know if there's much else his current team can provide for him here, and he does still need transitions/difficult entries. Also, while his jumping itself is beyond reproach, I do think he could use a bit more fluidity (which will come from better SS/knee bend I guess). His SS will improve more if he's with a team he can work everyday with, IDK if that's true currently? I just know Lori works with him on that when he goes to her. Zhao says the same thing about him stagnating, in the interview.

And for the other things, I think the Olympic season and the injuries threw a spanner there. The programs were better and he looked better, but the progress between 15-16/16-17 and 16-17/17-18 shows a decrease in rate. But then, this was also the season he was supposed to start getting the tech and the PCS together at the same time, so maybe that was fine in the end.

Maybe stagnated is the wrong word, but they also might be looking at future prospects.

chopinskate said:

Might have meant technically -- not about more quads, but I don't know if there's much else his current team can provide for him here, and he does still need transitions/difficult entries. Also, while his jumping itself is beyond reproach, I do think he could use a bit more fluidity (which will come from better SS/knee bend I guess). His SS will improve more if he's with a team he can work everyday with, IDK if that's true currently? I just know Lori works with him on that when he goes to her. Zhao says the same thing about him stagnating, in the interview.

And for the other things, I think the Olympic season and the injuries threw a spanner there. The programs were better and he looked better, but the progress between 15-16/16-17 and 16-17/17-18 shows a decrease in rate. But then, this was also the season he was supposed to start getting the tech and the PCS together at the same time, so maybe that was fine in the end.

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Yes Zhao said it too, and it irritated me there too.

SS are a technical improvement. As for jumps - why hurry? Yes he's practicing 4Lo, but how much else is even left? There's going to be an end to the quad race, because 4A or quints are pretty much out. So it makes sense to focus on the other parts - SS, IN, PE - first.
I also don't agree about the "fluidity" part, look at his 4CC LP - those landings were great. Way better then anything he did just last year. He didn't show that at WC too, but the right direction is there. So I doubt his team is that clueless about what to do. Also disagree about his improvement rate going down to this season compared to last, despite the injury even.

Of course he needs more transitions and all, and TCC would be a great place to work on that. But that is far from "stagnating".
(And again, or sadly also doesn't mean TCC will take him)

I don't agree with "stagnating", but yeah. I don't agree with just focusing on quads at all, so IMO his approach is good, of course, because I'd rather he did PCS first, too. But concerns are probably there for the future. I think the "decrease" in rate was fine honestly, because he did deliver great technical content and good PCS both at the same time this season (he was struggling at it the last season, except at Worlds). It was to be expected, and it was fine, for me (and really, nothing can compare to how much he improved between his first and second season, that was a transformation!). He's working towards it, and he had to split his focus! Now that he has a strong overall base, I bet we see a lot more development. (Though maybe you meant "progress overall", in which case, sure, he made about the same amount of progress, as he was able to land jumps much better this season.)

I doubt his team is clueless, but it's also true that very few coaches apart from Orser (and maybe really no one else at all, if you consider quality) have been able to get their skaters to do transitions into quads well.

As for jump "fluidity", he's still got more way to go. His flow-out now is not bad at all, and he gets it out of all quads now (I guess his bad habit of landing on flat edges has been worked through, and of course he's got softer knees and stronger ankles now), but he's still not really close to the flow-out Kolyada and Yuzuru get. Also, if you notice Yuzuru on his quad combos, his tagged-on toeloops look more like one fluid motion. Boyang does the technique there properly I'd say (he doesn't twist his body into it, like many do), but he does need more practice there, I think. (In the sQuad thread, someone called it "snap" I think) It's nitpicking of course. It probably takes time to master it. (and he has it on his 3Lz-3T)

He's clearly working on his SS, and it does show in all parts of his skating, so "stagnating" is perhaps not right, and he definitely has improved in the areas you mentioned a lot, even from last season. He wouldn't have been able to pull off his SP this season, otherwise. He was really mature in his presentation there, and that's definitely a good development -- one of range. And he committed to it really well! I guess I still see a few of the same issues from last season to say he was improving on his PCS at the same rate (especially in the LP, but that was also just a bad program). But that's not to say there was only a little improvement. There was a lot of it, especially in the musicality/IN area.

Also, to some people, his progress isn't enough for whatever reason (I don't agree with all parts of those criticisms, because they almost always begin with how he was "very bad" in his first senior year and he's better "in comparison", and I utterly disagree there -- I like both programs, though his LP was certainly not the best). I think (and another person I've spoken to, as well. I wonder how he'd fair with a tango now that he's older and a better performer, his performance is what made that SP good) he's improved the most out of anyone in the current group over the past few years, but we did also agree that he could've been a bit further at this stage. Again, nitpicking, and he's on the right path as you said, so just a matter of pacing himself, which he's been doing correctly, IMO. I'm sure he and his team all know what is right for him.

The *stagnating* part could also mean that they noticed that the judges weren't rewarding him more for what he was doing... so they didn't see an obvious improvement despite the work we know/see he's done. A more dramatic move (to TCC) might show the judges that he is seriously working on all parts of his skating and they will know it's a work in progress (as Brian is always saying it takes a lot of time to see the development) and will expect/reward him more in the future.

^^^ Yeah. Unfortunately, stuff like that does matter, and if that's what he needs to get credit, then But I think no one can take away from his visible improvements.

It would make a lot of sense of Brian can't make time to coach Boyang permanently. He has to also focus in his current students especially with Gogolev going into juniors and everyone else working towards 2022.

I got too excited with the thought of Boyang going to TCC. Now the thought that they probably can't take him on.... Ugh

With the national stadium under renovations, he needs a place to train so he went Sanya with the rest of the team probably.

Midnightcass said:

It would make a lot of sense of Brian can't make time to coach Boyang permanently. He has to also focus in his current students especially with Gogolev going into juniors and everyone else working towards 2022.

I got too excited with the thought of Boyang going to TCC. Now the thought that they probably can't take him on.... Ugh

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We don't know anything yet! All we have are a couple of interviews. But that's fine. I still don't think Zhao would have given the interviews if they didn't have something in the works already, though. Also, remember, original announcement was about a collaboration with Orser and Nichol. So Orser might still be a secondary coach. That's true for Orzel and Daleman, I think, who still train at TCC.

chopinskate said:

We don't know anything yet! All we have are a couple of interviews. But that's fine. I still don't think Zhao would have given the interviews if they didn't have something in the works already, though. Also, remember, original announcement was about a collaboration with Orser and Nichol. So Orser might still be a secondary coach. That's true for Orzel and Daleman, I think, who still train at TCC.

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Could have been a little political move to bully Orser into accepting Boyang as a student by hinting to the media that it is already in the works. But that's just me over-thinking.
I guess I'll wait until further news and then get excited. ^.^ Or disappointed... whatever it may be.

To be honest though, Boyang and his current coaches seem really close so I don't think he wants to give that up to go under Borser whose coaching so many other big names and for even a longer time.

chopinskate said:

We don't know anything yet! All we have are a couple of interviews. But that's fine. I still don't think Zhao would have given the interviews if they didn't have something in the works already, though. Also, remember, original announcement was about a collaboration with Orser and Nichol. So Orser might still be a secondary coach. That's true for Orzel and Daleman, I think, who still train at TCC.

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Gabby is with Lee Barkell, who is a coach in TCC. She has no main coach or any coach outside of TCC, and Brian isn't a secondary coach but more something like her "head coach". I'd imagine that to be very different from whatever might happen with Boyang, who will stay with his main coach either way.

Regarding Gogolev, he'll be old enough for 2022 too, and given the whole quad wunderkind thing there, I'd be surprised if the fed didn't try to push him for that too. TCC already has at least 2 younger guys who right now appear like the main hopes for their federations for 2022, Cha & Gogolev. And then there is Yuzu.

Yeah. FWIW I have faith that Boyang will keep improving and keep delivering even if he doesn't go to Orser. That won't change, IMO, given what he's been doing these three seasons, but this would certainly accelerate the process a bit, being near a team that can help him with everything at the same time. He's driven from what we know, so he won't "stagnate".

My only issue regarding Boyang is that he jumps too close to the boards (an issue he should really fix), regarding artistry there was definitely improvement between his first senior season and now. This, plus having the best 4Lz in the field. But the judges still don’t give him full credit. A move to TCC to BOrser is definitely a good idea imo, so I hope this on-going rumor will come true. Plus, being with other strong skaters like Yuzu (and Jun of course) will definitely motivate him more and help him progress more, especially since they get along well.

Interesting interview with Boyang's mother and a peek of his dorm in Beijing.

https://youtu.be/eVu67BSh2Lg

https://m.weibo.cn/1864631673/4233181198543855

https://m.weibo.cn/1686668674/4233200903661633

https://m.weibo.cn/5685056612/4233173469141959

He's such a dork.

HoneyBear said:

https://m.weibo.cn/1864631673/4233181198543855

https://m.weibo.cn/1686668674/4233200903661633

https://m.weibo.cn/5685056612/4233173469141959

He's such a dork.

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The sunshine of my life :luv17:

(Seriously, I had a horrible day at work when I saw that Jumping Beeyang video and had to laugh instantly. He's pure joy in human form :luv17: )

My favourite part is where he flails his legs after getting stuck to the wall.

(page 70! :yay

chopinskate said:

My favourite part is where he flails his legs after getting stuck to the wall.

(page 70! :yay

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Yes, that is so cute I also love the little "aww" you hear, I guess by the guy filming? xD

Boyang going to Orser is the best news I have heard for awhile! Orser is able to take someone with talent and then develop them into skilled performers.

Oh, Hallelujah! Hope that would truly eventuate. That would be so great for Boyang !

https://twitter.com/BoyangFanpage/status/989890963991445504

https://m.weibo.cn/1957216570/4234590681849580

He's spotted in an ice rink open to the public. Not sure what he's doing there, but it didn't seem like he's teaching kids for an event (as he did last year). It's possible that his training center is closed for the national holiday and he decided to at least get some time on ice in the meantime.