2015 U.S. Figure Skating Classic - SLC Ice Dance-SD and FD | Page 6 | Golden Skate

2015 U.S. Figure Skating Classic - SLC Ice Dance-SD and FD

tulosai

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
Based in last year? Shibs were better than H/B.

Yes but the Shibs have been more or less stagnant for years too, just a bit ahead of H/D, with the one obvious exception of a more-or-less fluke world medal from which they've regressed. H/B on the other hand are on a clear upward trajectory.

This is just my prediction/how I see it. I could be wrong and don't really care if I'm wrong- I like all 3 teams fine, and in fact have been a big fan of H/D and their programs for years, but at the end of this season I'm predicting the rankings are going to be:

1. C/B -rather large gap-
2. H/B -smaller but still clear gap-
3. Shibs -tiny gap-
4. H/D
 

Jammers

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
Not sure about H/B overtaking the Shibs so quickly as to be the US number two team at the end of this season. I could see it happening by 2018 though if they continue to improve and the Shibs keep stagnating.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
The Shibs did fine last season. Their SD was solid, they beat nearly every team at some point and practically tied Chock and Bates at nationals with it. They broke the 100 point barrier several times, something they hadn't done previously. Plus a top 5 finish is nothing to sneeze at.

I think last season really renewed the Shibs. Consider that at the end of the Olympic season they wouldn't commit to another Olympics. By the post-Nationals press conference they were saying they would keep going through 2018. They seem really hungry in a way I hadn't seen them in the past. They picked out programs early, been actively working with different folks and even exploring new looks for themselves.

I think Hawayek and Baker are very talented, but the thing I notice with them is they are prone to make silly errors. They can't do that if they are want to pass any team.

All that said it's going to be interesting to see what happens!

Eta: FWIW, when the Shibs were truly struggling a few years back, many thought they would be surpassed by several teams by now, including some that are no longer together. So the unpredictability of ice dance. Hence my reluctance to many declative statements.

Also to make thing relevant: it's early in the season and Hubbell/Donqhue still have time to make adjustments and improve. They seem hungry to keep their place as well.
 

Barb

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 13, 2009
Yes but the Shibs have been more or less stagnant for years too, just a bit ahead of H/D, with the one obvious exception of a more-or-less fluke world medal from which they've regressed. H/B on the other hand are on a clear upward trajectory.

This is just my prediction/how I see it. I could be wrong and don't really care if I'm wrong- I like all 3 teams fine, and in fact have been a big fan of H/D and their programs for years, but at the end of this season I'm predicting the rankings are going to be:

1. C/B -rather large gap-
2. H/B -smaller but still clear gap-
3. Shibs -tiny gap-
4. H/D

well, it is definitely easier go from 9 to 5 than 5 to 1st. I think at their best H/B will be fighting for the second spot with Shibs. Not Shibs and H/D for the 3rd.
 

Layback11

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
well, it is definitely easier go from 9 to 5 than 5 to 1st. I think at their best H/B will be fighting for the second spot with Shibs. Not Shibs and H/D for the 3rd.

:yes: that's how I see it. IMO, H/B are better artistically but not nearly as solid technically (as a previous poster mentioned, prone to silly errors) as the Shibs are. I really don't see anyone but C/B beating them just yet, unless H/B have gone through some P/C-type "overnight change." (Which I highly doubt.)
 

slider11

Medalist
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
I am hopeful that the Shibs will make their move for a significant gain this year. I don't see that Chock and Bates have the technical ability on the Shibs but the Shibs need a vehicle where they can put forward their artistry. And the US judges may be more inclined to keep C/B in first but it is in the world arena where they Shibs may have the chance to edge up. Regardless, and as much as I am a Hawayek/Baker fan, I think the order in the US will be :1. Chock/Bates 2. Shibs-second but gaining ground on C/B 3. Hawayek/Baker 4. Hubbell/Donahue
 

tulosai

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
I am hopeful that the Shibs will make their move for a significant gain this year. I don't see that Chock and Bates have the technical ability on the Shibs but the Shibs need a vehicle where they can put forward their artistry. And the US judges may be more inclined to keep C/B in first but it is in the world arena where they Shibs may have the chance to edge up. Regardless, and as much as I am a Hawayek/Baker fan, I think the order in the US will be :1. Chock/Bates 2. Shibs-second but gaining ground on C/B 3. Hawayek/Baker 4. Hubbell/Donahue

I disagree about the Shibs having a technical edge at this point. If anything the teams are equal; if you take the whole of last season, not just the last few competitions, a strong argument could be made that C/B are ahead. Either way. C/B consistently got level 4's last year. At 4CC's,in the SP, the Shibs did achieve one more level 4 than C/B (on one of the step sequences); otherwise their levels were identical. In the FD, C/B actually got 5 level 4's, while the Shibs only got 4.

At World's, C/B got ALL level 4's in the SD. The Shibs got 2 level 3's. In the Free, C/B got 4 level 4's and 3 level 3's. The Shibs got 4 level 4's, 2 level 3's, and a level 2.

I actually sincerely think the best thing the Shibs could do for themselves (and this could be a real difference maker) is to start getting more level 4's. We all know they CAN do it, because they did in the past, when both Marina and Igor were working with them. They need to find a tech coach that can actually help them do this. I believe if they did this, their placements at competitions would indeed go up. I do think they actually have the POTENTIAL to be better than C/B technically, but at the moment, the reality is just not showing that.
 

Alba

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 26, 2014
Yes but the Shibs have been more or less stagnant for years too, just a bit ahead of H/D, with the one obvious exception of a more-or-less fluke world medal from which they've regressed. H/B on the other hand are on a clear upward trajectory.

The thing with H&B though is that I have the feeling they are repeating themselves a bit this season. I was expecting something else for them, in terms of program (FD). Shibs on the other hand looks like they are going for a transformation and their SS are way better than H&B. Well, I think they are better than H&D also. Therefore, I would be very surprised if they lose the no.2 USA team. I think they want to challenge C&B, if anything.
 

Alba

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 26, 2014
I have been a little harsh maybe on H&D SD, when I saw it the first time calling it a snooze. It's not bad but the thing is you really need to be a great skater to settle the mood and captivate with this music (which is a wonderful song by the way) through movements, dancing. I magine V&M or a couple like K&P what they could do with this dance and H&D are not there.
 

Ice Dance

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
The thing with H&B though is that I have the feeling they are repeating themselves a bit this season. I was expecting something else for them, in terms of program (FD). Shibs on the other hand looks like they are going for a transformation and their SS are way better than H&B. Well, I think they are better than H&D also. Therefore, I would be very surprised if they lose the no.2 USA team. I think they want to challenge C&B, if anything.

Ditto. I think there is no comparison between H&B and the Shibutanis. The Shibs had 20 points on H&B at Four Continents. Meanwhile Maia & Alex were less than 4 points off the podium.

If H&B had the goods to snag a bronze medal in their first Worlds, they would likely have "regressed" also. Are we going to declare P&C finished if they go down in the rankings now? The Shibs have climbed steadily since their 8th place finish in 2011. If they hadn't won that bronze, eighth place would have been considered a frigging outstanding debut. H&B certainly weren't ranked that high in the world last season. I can see them getting a bronze at SA, but the field is weak. They have potential & I like the concept for their free, but they were in Paul & Islam territory last season. That's out of the top ten, not fighting for the final five. Where the Shibs were up against the #1 teams from every powerhouse in the World.
 

semosk8tfan

Medalist
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Country
United-States
Finally had a chance to catch the FD portion of the event and have to say I was totally underwhelmed. Like the summer competition in Quebec, when you see the skaters coached by Dubrieul/Lauzon in such a small competition, the sameness of the choreography is glaring. Hubbell and Donohue have their work cut out for them, they need to make a bold statement this year that they are top tier skaters and to me their FD just solidifies their position as middle of the pack and this makes me sad.
 
Top