Zagitova prepares for senior debut

Sam L · Jun 11, 2017

Jaana said:
Sam L, great that you enjoyed your stay here! Here you can see the national flag that people have on their yards in official flag days and various state flags:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Finland

The flag I have as my country flag is the one that was available here on this forum.

Yeah that's the one I'm familiar with. I've just never seen the one here from Golden Skate before. I thought it was from the Grand Duchy days for a second.

Skater Boy said:
She needs a Michelle Kwan tranformation. She really needs to skate like a lady and not a girl.

Then she should skate like Shizuka Arakawa?

In all seriousness, what does that even mean? She skates like any Senior lady already.

FSGMT · Jun 11, 2017

Why is she allowed to compete in Seniors next season? I thought juniors had to wait two seasons before being able to move up (as Medvedeva and Tsurskaya did). Did she skip the first eligible international junior season for some reason? :scratch3:

Hannah555 · Jun 11, 2017

FSGMT said:
Why is she allowed to compete in Seniors next season? I thought juniors had to wait two seasons before being able to move up (as Medvedeva and Tsurskaya did). Did she skip the first eligible international junior season for some reason? :scratch3:

It has already been confirmed that she has moved to seniors. In addition she got two GP's assignments. She has moved to Tutberidze team in 2015 so we didn't see her in international competitions before 2016-2017 season. She turned 15 this May so she meets ISU Age Requirements for senior competitions and OG.

gotoschool · Jun 11, 2017

FSGMT said:
Why is she allowed to compete in Seniors next season? I thought juniors had to wait two seasons before being able to move up (as Medvedeva and Tsurskaya did). Did she skip the first eligible international junior season for some reason? :scratch3:

\\\

Hannah555 answered this question while I was writing. But, I think the requirement for seniors is the skater must be 15 years old on July 1st before the upcoming season. Since Alina was born on May 18, 2002, she meets these requirements, but Evgenia who was born on November 19, 1999 did not meet these requirements in the 2015-2016 season and Polina just missed in the 2016 - 2017 season because she was born on July 11, 2000. Furthermore, Alina did skate in 2015-2016 at least at Russian Junior nationals. She just didn't finish that high- 9th place. i am glad she had such a big turn around in one season. I enjoy Alina's performances and I wish her the best in her senior debut season.

TheCzar · Jun 12, 2017

I mean technically, and without clout- Zagitova should easily overtake Medvedeva technically. She has legit, harder combos with Rippon arms. Med's 2nd 3-3 is a measly 3S-3T. Even with a 3rd 3T, if Alina tacks a 3T at any of her 3-3s, they should beat her easily.

PCS-wise, Med is riding high with the judges on that department, so Alina will have to Nathan Chen her way around next season if she wants to beat her seniors. Even with her visually-demented 'ballet' skating (what is that? She skates to Don Quixote like a toddler showing her mother quick ballet poses she learnt at kiddie care class), she blows Radionova and Pogorilaya. Then again, if Zagitova gains a Lipnitskaia-esque momentum this season, she could come up aces.

Bluediamonds09 · Jun 12, 2017

TheCzar said:
I mean technically, and without clout- Zagitova should easily overtake Medvedeva technically. She has legit, harder combos with Rippon arms. Med's 2nd 3-3 is a measly 3S-3T. Even with a 3rd 3T, if Alina tacks a 3T at any of her 3-3s, they should beat her easily.

PCS-wise, Med is riding high with the judges on that department, so Alina will have to Nathan Chen her way around next season if she wants to beat her seniors. Even with her visually-demented 'ballet' skating (what is that? She skates to Don Quixote like a toddler showing her mother quick ballet poses she learnt at kiddie care class), she blows Radionova and Pogorilaya. Then again, if Zagitova gains a Lipnitskaia-esque momentum this season, she could come up aces.

Thank you thank you thank you. I have to agree with pretty much everything you wrote. I always though alina's ballet program was not ballet at all. She has so much potential I wish her coaching team would help her out artistically too!!

linkintank · Jun 12, 2017

TheCzar said:
I mean technically, and without clout- Zagitova should easily overtake Medvedeva technically. She has legit, harder combos with Rippon arms. Med's 2nd 3-3 is a measly 3S-3T. Even with a 3rd 3T, if Alina tacks a 3T at any of her 3-3s, they should beat her easily.

PCS-wise, Med is riding high with the judges on that department, so Alina will have to Nathan Chen her way around next season if she wants to beat her seniors. Even with her visually-demented 'ballet' skating (what is that? She skates to Don Quixote like a toddler showing her mother quick ballet poses she learnt at kiddie care class), she blows Radionova and Pogorilaya. Then again, if Zagitova gains a Lipnitskaia-esque momentum this season, she could come up aces.

She can't add a triple toe, at least not one that would get credit. She does two triple lutzes and two triple flips so she can only do one triple loop and one triple toe and salchow.

Alina isn't trying to beat Med by trying something crazy, I think she's happy to just establish herself this season. If it was the last cycle she would have a shot but this cycle is different with a well established crew of ladies that are getting record scores.

SnowWhite · Jun 13, 2017

TheCzar said:
I mean technically, and without clout- Zagitova should easily overtake Medvedeva technically. She has legit, harder combos with Rippon arms. Med's 2nd 3-3 is a measly 3S-3T. Even with a 3rd 3T, if Alina tacks a 3T at any of her 3-3s, they should beat her easily.

PCS-wise, Med is riding high with the judges on that department, so Alina will have to Nathan Chen her way around next season if she wants to beat her seniors. Even with her visually-demented 'ballet' skating (what is that? She skates to Don Quixote like a toddler showing her mother quick ballet poses she learnt at kiddie care class), she blows Radionova and Pogorilaya. Then again, if Zagitova gains a Lipnitskaia-esque momentum this season, she could come up aces.

That assumes Medvedeva won't up her tech content, which she has talked about. At Worlds she was doing 3Lo-3T, 3Lz-3Lo, 3F-3T-3Lo, 3Lz-3T-3Lo, and 3S-1/2Lo-3F. And she started adding more Rippons too. So she can do harder combos, and I'd bet she ups her current tech in some way. Alina might still have a slightly higher BV, but nothing close to the difference Chen has with his 5-6 quads.

Miller · Jun 13, 2017

SnowWhite said:
That assumes Medvedeva won't up her tech content, which she has talked about. At Worlds she was doing 3Lo-3T, 3Lz-3Lo, 3F-3T-3Lo, 3Lz-3T-3Lo, and 3S-1/2Lo-3F. And she started adding more Rippons too. So she can do harder combos, and I'd bet she ups her current tech in some way. Alina might still have a slightly higher BV, but nothing close to the difference Chen has with his 5-6 quads.

Can Evgenia risk doing Lutz combos with her 'flutz' problems though? If not there's nothing she can do with her SP unless she's willing to do a solo Lutz - a 3F-3Lo wouldn't even help as the best she can then do with her solo jump is a 3S, gaining 0.1 marks compared with a 3T. Similarly in the long all she can do is backload more and maybe do a 2Lo at the back end of her 3 part combo. 2 Flips and 2 Loops are also possible if she decides to go for a 3F/3S-3Lo combo, but it would be quite a risk given her current advantage.

Overall Evgenia can probably get a couple of points back in base value without doing 2 Lutzs, but Alina will always have a 3 point plus advantage because of all her Flips and Lutzs plus everything backloaded.

TheCzar · Jun 14, 2017

Miller said:
Can Evgenia risk doing Lutz combos with her 'flutz' problems though? If not there's nothing she can do with her SP unless she's willing to do a solo Lutz - a 3F-3Lo wouldn't even help as the best she can then do with her solo jump is a 3S, gaining 0.1 marks compared with a 3T. Similarly in the long all she can do is backload more and maybe do a 2Lo at the back end of her 3 part combo. 2 Flips and 2 Loops are also possible if she decides to go for a 3F/3S-3Lo combo, but it would be quite a risk given her current advantage.

Overall Evgenia can probably get a couple of points back in base value without doing 2 Lutzs, but Alina will always have a 3 point plus advantage because of all her Flips and Lutzs plus everything backloaded.

Agreed. Also if she could up her tech content- why hasn't she yet? I mean it would seem a bit insulting seeing all there other ladies going for 3Lz-3T, 3Lz-3L, 3FL-3L combos just for Med to deign to put out a sal combo. Like it doesn't matter because she will get propped up by the panel anyway, so why risk a high-level combo that she doesn't have a consistent grip on? Plus its easier to do and less risk of her splatting.

Hannah555 · Jun 14, 2017

Until we see new programs from Alina and Evgenia, any comparison is pointless really... Two many unknown variables....

ejnsofi · Jun 14, 2017

TheCzar said:
Agreed. Also if she could up her tech content- why hasn't she yet? I mean it would seem a bit insulting seeing all there other ladies going for 3Lz-3T, 3Lz-3L, 3FL-3L combos just for Med to deign to put out a sal combo. Like it doesn't matter because she will get propped up by the panel anyway, so why risk a high-level combo that she doesn't have a consistent grip on? Plus its easier to do and less risk of her splatting.

Probably because she didn't have to. Consistency and backloading gave her a comfort of not doing more complicating combos. Besides if she added Lutz combo the GS would burn with comment like "OMG she added Lz combo with her terrible flutz. There is no hope left for figure skating".
I think she will add some more complicated combos in Olympic season taking into the consideration Wakaba's and Alina's TES scores

atsumiri · Jun 14, 2017

ejnsofi said:
I think she will add some more complicated combos in Olympic season taking into the consideration Wakaba's and Alina's TES scores

Wakaba once/twice landed her 3A on a practice... even without 3A... she just once skated her programs .... near to "clean"... :rolleye:

TheCzar · Jun 14, 2017

atsumiri said:
Wakaba once/twice landed her 3A on a practice... even without 3A... she just once skated her programs .... near to "clean"...

Agreed. I have never seen Wakaba as a factor. Not because she's not good- but I mean, she kinda bombed her debut at Worlds. Her and Mihara. I have a little bit more faith in Honda to challenge the Russians because of her PCS and pretty consistent tech. Not necessarily to challenge Med, but to pull upsets and break up the Russian party at least once.

kwanatic · Jun 14, 2017

TheCzar said:
Agreed. I have never seen Wakaba as a factor. Not because she's not good- but I mean, she kinda bombed her debut at Worlds. Her and Mihara. I have a little bit more faith in Honda to challenge the Russians because of her PCS and pretty consistent tech. Not necessarily to challenge Med, but to pull upsets and break up the Russian party at least once.

Wakaba has a chance to move up this season if she can deliver the way she did at WTT. She's grown a lot in terms of her artistry and presentation and her jumps are good. She does have issues with her flip and she also struggles with staying focused throughout the performance...but she can move up.

I also think Honda has a chance to come in and immediately make a splash assuming she can skate the way she did at worlds. Sometimes she can struggle with consistency too; however, overall, I find Marin to be a complete skater already. She's absolutely beautiful to watch and she connects with her music and choreography very well for someone so young. She's got a good amount of technical firepower too, although not as much as Alina.

Alina jumps like a senior lady but her overall skating is still somewhat juniorish IMO. Then again, she may be able to fix that this summer. Just look at how much Tsurskaya improved her presentation over the summer last season. Alina needs some good packaging for next season. I wouldn't be surprised to see her come in and win one or even both of her events. It's a tall order to beat Evgenia simply b/c her PCS margin is 5-6 points higher than everyone else's. Alina could best her in TES but I don't know if she'll be able to close the gap soon enough to beat her this season.

atsumiri · Jun 14, 2017

TheCzar said:
Agreed. I have never seen Wakaba as a factor. Not because she's not good- but I mean, she kinda bombed her debut at Worlds. Her and Mihara. I have a little bit more faith in Honda to challenge the Russians because of her PCS and pretty consistent tech. Not necessarily to challenge Med, but to pull upsets and break up the Russian party at least once.

not so sure... :scratch2:

she bombed almost as much as Wakaba. 4 of 5 SP at this season. and She skated clean SP+FP just once.

Miller · Jun 14, 2017

Think there's umpteen ladies, including Wakaba and Mai who have the firepower to get the 210/215 that will get you within contention for an Olympic medal, that's the sort of figure necessary the last couple of years and at the last Olympics. Whether there's too many ladies who can get the 230 or so that'll push Evgenia that's another matter, only Alina and Kaetyln Osmond come to mind unless there's a potential Triple Axel jumper out there who can do one in both the Short and Long and be clean the rest of the way as well, a pretty tall order.

Zagitova prepares for senior debut

Sam L

FSGMT

Hannah555

Ava artwork by talented ShampooNeko

gotoschool

TheCzar

Bluediamonds09

linkintank

SnowWhite

Miller

TheCzar

Hannah555

Ava artwork by talented ShampooNeko

ejnsofi

atsumiri

TheCzar

kwanatic

Check out my YT channel, Bare Ice!

atsumiri

Miller

Similar threads

Connect with us