Russian dominance in ladies

puremagic · Sep 27, 2017

Spirals for Miles said:
At least Anya is pushing the boundaries instead of the same old same old. And she's proven that she can pick herself up from injury, relatively well at least. Let's not be hating on a 13-year old.

Hey, tars loves Anna, maybe even more than we do. He just wrote the cruel reality, when the most talented 13yo skater got injured and can't compete.

jenaj · Sep 27, 2017

Sam-Skwantch said:
There is a growing history of other nations having zero success on juniors and only limited success at Seniors. Success for the purpose of this discussion being podium finishes. Of the last three seasons only two non Russian skaters have won a GPF medal. I'm surprised this isn't considered "dominant" to you.

Are we talking about the system and its ability to churn out medal winners or measuring their individuals careers? Is there a system somewhere else that is rivaling what we see in Russian Ladies Skating? Japan maybe and the results just aren't materializing yet. At this point it is clear to me that Russia is dominant at least for now on the ladies elite circuit. How can it be seen any other way based on the results.

Actually three GPF medals have been won by non-Russian skaters in the past three years. That is still impressive for Russia but at the bigger event, Worlds, non-Russian skaters have won four (of nine) And most recently, they won 2 out of 3. Russia has certainly made its mark in Ladies skating in the past several years but it remains to be seen whether it will continue. Japan is on the rise again and Canada, too. There are juniors in Korea who look promising.

Osmond4gold · Sep 27, 2017

^^ Please keep in mind as well, that some of the elite ladies level skaters were unable to compete over the past several years, due to long term injuries, bans or other circumstances, as was the case for Carolina, Satoko, Gracie and Kaetlyn, as prime examples. So perhaps, now that the playing field is starting to become representative of the collective ladies talent, the results especially the more recent, are a truer reflection of where the Russian ladies are, in comparison to other top elite skaters.

samkrut@mail.ru · Sep 27, 2017

Osmond4gold said:
^^ Please keep in mind as well, that some of the elite ladies level skaters were unable to compete over the past several years, due to long term injuries, bands or other circumstances, as was the case for Carolina, Satoko, Gracie and Kaetlyn, as prime examples. So perhaps, now that the playing field is starting to become representative of the collective ladies talent, the results especially the more recent, are a truer reflection of where the Russian ladies are, in comparison to other top elite skaters.

Cannot agree with those examples

2015/16 Caro - no, Satoko - yes, Gracie - yes, Kaetlyn - no Total 200%
2016/17 Caro - yes/no, Satoko - no, Gracie - no, Kaetlyn - yes Total 150%
2017/18 Caro - yes, Satoko - unclear, Gracie - unclear but rather no, Kaetlyn - yes. I would say 250%

No trend, sorry, beside Osmond. If the point was to bring her to limelight another time, then yes. Well, to be fair Caro also fits the trend but so far she is not in big contention.

Manitou · Sep 27, 2017

Osmond4gold said:
... Carolina, Satoko, Gracie and Kaetlyn, as prime examples.

Satoko and Kaetlyn injured, Carolina banned - they are objective circumstances, but I don't think in the case of Satoko or Carolina it would make any difference.
As to Gracie - she was not banned, did not retire, was not injured, and was fully at her physical peak. She is simply a wrong example to anything. She is her own category.

Sam-Skwantch · Sep 27, 2017

Adelina was injured and didn't compete. Surely she would have been a contender for medals and let's not forget Sasha Proklova. She was permanently injured but could have easily been a tremendous skater at elite levels. They are tough but the Russians have suffered injuries too that harbor potential implications for the elite ranks. No??

Grin · Sep 27, 2017

Secrets of Russian Skating with Alexei Mishin
https://youtu.be/1U-7ZCFTjpg

samkrut@mail.ru · Sep 27, 2017

Sam-Skwantch said:
Adelina was injured and didn't compete. Surely she would have been a contender for medals and let's not forget Sasha Proklova. She was permanently injured but could have easily been a tremendous skater at elite levels. They are tough but the Russians have suffered injuries too that harbor potential implications for the elite ranks. No??

Tsurskaya?

Skater Boy · Sep 27, 2017

Tolstoj said:
1) It was the same for Mao Asada, because Yuna fans are honestly the worst (and let's be clear i don't blame Yuna, but the behaviour from her fans), and most of the haters are them unfortunately. The rest is simply because they can't accept a champion that keeps winning every single medal leaving no chances to the others.

2) Kostner hasn't ever beated Evgenia, like not even close so far. Of course she will compete for a medal at the Olympics, but to win the Olympics you have to be very lucky (anything can happen though, Tara Lipinski, Sarah Hughes and Adelina Sotnikova Olympic champions are the proves)

3) Maria -> agreed, we'll see this season.
Pogo, Tukt and Radionova -> don't forget what they did during this Olympic cycle.
Lipnitskaya -> the Kimmie Meissner of the situation.

Karen and Gracie's careers compared to Radionova are a disaster. No GPF / Worlds / 4CC medals whatsoever.

Alina hardly impressive is laughable considering her only mistake in both the SP and the LP (two insanely difficult programs) was in the 2a in the short and she won that event against one of the biggest competitor from Japan and Carolina Kostner.

Evgenia's flutz is nothing compared to Ashley underrotations, unfinished and shaky spins, Satoko's underrotations, Kaetlyn's inconsistency (and she has the flutz too),... each skater has their own weaknesses. So far (the past two-three seasons) Evgenia's flutz has never been a problem at a point where she lost to someone else.

- - - Updated - - -

you're right i forgot about Mao, but still my point stands.

Okay that is just wrong. That is an insult and really unfair to compare Yulia to Kimmie. Nothing against Kimie but Kimmie was a Maria S type skater - nothing special, she just won when the big gu ns retired or did not show, she skated clean I give her credit but without style, without panache, without huge jummps, without great it factor and without super prgrammes. She was definitely a one hit wonder and even then the it was a blah programme - granted a pretty dress. She won it fair and square because no one showed up (physically or metaphysically I guess).

Grin · Sep 27, 2017

tjb said:
and another conspiracy theory was debunked. this is all lakernik's fault

ROFL

JumpinJava · Sep 27, 2017

Wow - I just checked this for the first time since posting. Thanks for all the great responses!!

Baron Vladimir · Sep 27, 2017

voolfee said:
Russian domination among women is associated with a much larger number of girls being brought to figure skating

And that is the answer of the question. Simple as that :agree:

Tolstoj · Sep 27, 2017

Skater Boy said:
Okay that is just wrong. That is an insult and really unfair to compare Yulia to Kimmie. Nothing against Kimie but Kimmie was a Maria S type skater - nothing special, she just won when the big gu ns retired or did not show, she skated clean I give her credit but without style, without panache, without huge jummps, without great it factor and without super prgrammes. She was definitely a one hit wonder and even then the it was a blah programme - granted a pretty dress. She won it fair and square because no one showed up (physically or metaphysically I guess).

Actually i was talking more on the type of success and not the style (they are completely different as you said).

They both came out on the senior circuit and did great things right from the start (Yulia was more consistent and had much more success in juniors, while Kimmie won the World title) but then for many reasons they weren't able to sustain that type of success and they both ended up with a very short career in seniors.

Now if i have to compare similar skaters stylistically, Julia is definitely more a Sasha Cohen.

russianfan · Nov 18, 2017

wanna talk about some dominance?
7/7 junior gp events and 4/5 senior gp events so far with the last one looking easy for Tsurskaya(i hope). Now that's what i call dominance... :agree:

tars · Nov 18, 2017

<- And all of this with one beast still locked in the cage. :dev3:

Russian dominance in ladies

puremagic

-

jenaj

Osmond4gold

[email protected]

Medalist

Manitou

Sam-Skwantch

“I solemnly swear I’m up to no good”

Grin

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Medalist

Skater Boy

Grin

JumpinJava

Baron Vladimir

Tolstoj

russianfan

Match Penalty

tars

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