2017 GP Internationaux de France Ladies FS | Page 54 | Golden Skate

2017 GP Internationaux de France Ladies FS

Figure 8's

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 10, 2014
The simple reason in my mind is that they want a Canadian lady to be a contender.

Her musical interpretation isn't great and her technique isn't good. At times she almost looks like a windmill out there with all that flailing. Her PCS are the most puzzling to me. Kostner's I can sort of understand if I try to look at it from a point of view that I don't necessarily agree with, but I just don't see any way for Osmond to the get PCS she does. Especially for this program. She wasn't with it for a moment.

Osmond is a very powerful Athletic Skater. Why on earth she chose to skate to Black Swan is beyond me. A Swan she is not.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
I've watched Kaetlyn's free skate. I have yet to watch this program until now, so this is my first impression of it.

Which is this: I really wish she was skating to a different piece of music.

I get why her team thought Black Swan would/could work -- it is a powerful piece of music. I can see why they thought that she could pull it off. And I'm not of the school that you need to have ballet skills to skate to ballet music.

But the choreography, IMO, just doesn't go with the music she's skating to. It's more conclusive to like a Samson & Delilah or Salome. And I'm not sure what's with all the arm movements.

Her SP works great and is a perfect fit. I don't feel the same about this FS.

Alina Zagitova is next. Now, I wish for many of the same things for her as I do for Kaetlyn. She has quite a few extra hand movements and it seems that a lot of the moves are choreographed for difficulty's sake. But the choreography + jumping passes + the music really do go well together and do leave an impression. I think the folks that are upset that she got 68 PCS have a case, however, those last 1.5 minutes really leave an impression and I can understand (though not necessarily agree) why they score her the way they do.

And I watched the rest of the ladies.

I'd say the two skaters that stood out for me was Elizabet Tursynbaeva and Yuna Shiraiwa.
For Elizabet, it was nice to see everything come together for her in the FS. I thought the layout was smart, backloading 2A-3Ts was good. I don't necessarily love the choreography or the program, but it worked for me today. Bravo!

I enjoyed Yuna's program a lot , in spite of the fall at the end. I really like her power and her speed. I think the choreography made good use of her strengths. Also I loved her dress (but that's a shallow thing)

Overall, I can't really argue with the placements based on the performances.
 
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Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Country
France
An interesting comparison to Osmond's "Black Swan" program is Michelle Kwan's "The Miraculous Mandarin" - https://youtube.com/watch?v=9JgjgI2IBmk

The one time Michelle ever skated that program she had 3 jump mistakes, and those mistakes are nearly identical to the 3 jump mistakes Osmond made in this competition. Yet despite those mistakes, Kwan's performance remains captivating and is still talked about 17 years later. It's a less challenging program in terms of transitions and yet it has so many memorable choreographic passages, whereas Osmond's program has barely any or none at all really.

Kwan remains composed and authoritative throughout the whole performance as well, despite the mistakes. Osmond's body language is mostly blank in comparison. Most of the ladies these days, even when skating well, fail to create the beautiful held positions and movements seen in Kwan's program. Here we can see the distinct difference in how effective it is to hold your body well, to project, and to create meaningful movements in a program (some of them being subtle arm variations and foot placements), rather than just constant turns across the ice.
 

kevinVchicago

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 13, 2016
Some last thoughts and questions on Laurine at IdF:

First question: Why did the coaching staff feel that it was a good idea to make changes to her FS half-way through the GP? The IdF was unquestionably a huge event for her. It was clear that she hadn't adjusted to the new program. She was lost after the first minute. I've never seen skate so poorly before. Even when she has falls she commits to the performance.

Second question: Why did the coaching staff decide to make THOSE changes to the her FS? The opening of the program was perfectly fine before and she was skating it well. There was no need to change it. People took issue with the "My Heart Belongs to Daddy" section, which is understandable. But to just tack on that screechy non-Marilyn version of "Diamonds are a Girl's Best Friend" for the last 90 seconds... Why?

She looked totally unprepared for this competition. The FS was not ready. It was clear that she hadn't mastered the new choreography. How could the coaches allow this? [emoji20] She also did her GREASE program at the Gala with a white slip over a black corset and gym shorts. What happened to her iconic costume? I am sensing chaos.

I know that Laurine is more concerned with the long game because she often speaks about her goals toward 2022 Olympics. They've been training the 3A, but are hoping to use it in the future. But she had so much momentum coming out of 2017 Europeans, and then the 3Lz-3T became crashy and the momentum came to a dead halt. That jump looks a bit more secure and some details in the skating look cleaner but she hasn't advanced. In fact, she's going to struggle to get the Olympic spot because Meïté is looking much better this season--and has beaten her twice, here and at French Masters.

I know that coaches aren't magicians, but the decisions about the FS have really made me question their judgment. At this point there is less than a month until French Nationals and they have an unusable clunker of a FS. I don't know what's going on behind the scenes, but as someone who follows her closely this seems totally clear... what were they thinking? I guess the good news is that apparently they threw together her new SP in a week or so.

I keep feeling like... huge breakthrough at Trophée de France 2016, French national champion, 5th at Europeans, first time with two GP assignments... the time is now, the time is now, grab this moment... and it seems now that the moment has passed. Whatever help she needed to grab the opportunities, she isn't getting it. I'm glad that she seems happy, though, and I know that she'll have another breakthrough. But sadly this isn't her season.

Everyone knows that last year's programs were 100x better and had a great deal to do with her sudden success. What an unfortunate moment to drop the ball. I don't know if Kori and Rohene have the artistic sensibility to match something like her programs last year though... I don't know much about them because I've never been a big Jason Brown fan.

Anyway, on and up, Laurine... [emoji254][emoji123][emoji632]
 

Sabrina

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
An interesting comparison to Osmond's "Black Swan" program is Michelle Kwan's "The Miraculous Mandarin" - https://youtube.com/watch?v=9JgjgI2IBmk

The one time Michelle ever skated that program she had 3 jump mistakes, and those mistakes are nearly identical to the 3 jump mistakes Osmond made in this competition. Yet despite those mistakes, Kwan's performance remains captivating and is still talked about 17 years later. It's a less challenging program in terms of transitions and yet it has so many memorable choreographic passages, whereas Osmond's program has barely any or none at all really.

Kwan remains composed and authoritative throughout the whole performance as well, despite the mistakes. Osmond's body language is mostly blank in comparison. Most of the ladies these days, even when skating well, fail to create the beautiful held positions and movements seen in Kwan's program. Here we can see the distinct difference in how effective it is to hold your body well, to project, and to create meaningful movements in a program (some of them being subtle arm variations and foot placements), rather than just constant turns across the ice.

I don't think there is any comparison between the 2 programs. Michelle did 3T3T, with a 2 feet landing, while Kaetlyn had a wonderful 3f3T. Michelle's jumps were small and had a few UR, if you just compare the 2 programs. And about presentation, Michelle had a wonderful 2-3 seconds in the middle of the program when she expressed the music, and that was all. Short spins (that was the era). Kwan was an amazing skater, but there is no comparison, and I find Kaelyin much better for jumps and music expression.
But the story is longer. I agree there is something wrong about this black swan program. I can't really point what is wrong, and I don't know who's fault is this. Can Buttle really portray that black swan, or he has no clue how to do it with Kaetlyn. I doubt it is only Kaetlyn's mistake. I think she needs a more balletic style (strech,poses), not too much, still...we have Alina's Don Qixote, and she really is Kitri. Katyin's black swan is missing something.
 

jenaj

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Country
United-States
Osmond is a very powerful Athletic Skater. Why on earth she chose to skate to Black Swan is beyond me. A Swan she is not.

Ironically, this same music worked really well for Ashley Wagner, a skater who has some similarities to Kaetlyn in that she is a performer and more athletic than balletic. Ashley skated it strong, powering through it with a few cursory nods to the ballet. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXc8UO8WLTQ Kaetlyn skates it softer--more balletic, which I agree is not her style. I was bored for most of the performance. It only comes alive with the footwork section near the end. I also find Kaetlyn's heavy makeup and ballet-like costume distracting.
 

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Country
France
Michelle had a wonderful 2-3 seconds in the middle of the program when she expressed the music, and that was all.

No that was not "all". The opening movements, the spins directly working with the music, the spiral with that dark expression (and the more delicate spiral earlier), the arm positions and attention to posture and foot positions, the transition out of the Salchow into a footwork sequence that actually interprets the music, unlike the footwork sequences we see these days, and that great ending. If you find Osmond better at musical expression then I'm not sure what else to say, it's like trying to argue with a totally different level of taste. The details and presentation of Kwan's program are far and away more musical and expressive to me, with a greater coherence and sense of story to the program as well.
 

LiamForeman

William/Uilyam
Medalist
Joined
Nov 24, 2006
^ Do you think that Skate Canada has more influence on the international judges than the Japanese Skating Federation does?

I think Skate Canada has two skaters that are or can be 'star-worthy'. As much as I like Wakaba and Mihara, they are BORING and have no star quality. Osmond has her own "IT", and I'm sure it's even more identifiable in person (which is why I try not to be so perplexed at her scores. I see she is a strong skater.) Same with Daleman when she hits. The Japanese ladies have been in a serious rut after Asada. Satoko is a gorgeous skater, but you can't even put a piece of paper under her tiny and oft UR'd jumps. And she was leading the team up until the last year. There really is no leader for Team Japan. And they obviously aren't trying to 'sell' one to the public, so all we have are three could-be's plus Satoko, and no will-be's. At least the US has Karen Chen and Ashley who legitimately have "IT". Just my opinion.
 

LiamForeman

William/Uilyam
Medalist
Joined
Nov 24, 2006
No that was not "all". The opening movements, the spins directly working with the music, the spiral with that dark expression (and the more delicate spiral earlier), the arm positions and attention to posture and foot positions, the transition out of the Salchow into a footwork sequence that actually interprets the music, unlike the footwork sequences we see these days, and that great ending. If you find Osmond better at musical expression then I'm not sure what else to say, it's like trying to argue with a totally different level of taste. The details and presentation of Kwan's program are far and away more musical and expressive to me, with a greater coherence and sense of story to the program as well.

I never 'got' the greatness of Miraculous Mandarin. It was just typical rote Kwan, same pretty much everything. And the music didn't work for her. Which is probably why she didn't skate it well. Surely it's somewhere on YouTube. I just remember being unimpressed and rolling my eyes when I saw it.
 

Alex D

Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
Osmond is a very powerful Athletic Skater. Why on earth she chose to skate to Black Swan is beyond me. A Swan she is not.

I think that Osmonds abilities don´t come across on TV.

I wrote in my summary about her skating that
she combines athletism and grace, she makes it look easy even when it´s hard. Kaetlyn grabs you with her difficulty and heart. There is no other female skater like her, she is unique and one of a kind. When other skaters force their jumps, she enjoys them. If others are afraid she is courageous with light footwork and powerful jumps.
A true lady, who shows the best of both worlds, athletism and grace.

In my opinion, Kaetlyn has a very special ability, you never see her unhappy, even if she falls six times, she will see something good in it. Her personality benefits her skating a lot and oh boy, has she gone through a lot already. Her transitions are fluent, she can go quite and powerful, slow and fast, without making it too obvious, it´s really nice to look at and with all of that, she has such a great facial expression, as if it´s no problem at all for her.

I still think her SP is stronger, though.
 

Tutto

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
I think that Osmonds abilities don´t come across on TV.

I wrote in my summary about her skating that


In my opinion, Kaetlyn has a very special ability, you never see her unhappy, even if she falls six times, she will see something good in it. Her personality benefits her skating a lot and oh boy, has she gone through a lot already. Her transitions are fluent, she can go quite and powerful, slow and fast, without making it too obvious, it´s really nice to look at and with all of that, she has such a great facial expression, as if it´s no problem at all for her.

I still think her SP is stronger, though.

I share your admiration for Kaetlyn but consider the Black Swan an unfortunate choice for her. No question she can pull it off ..just but it is not a program which feels natural to her. I don't know what her team was thinking of honestly
 
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