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Thread: Evgenia Medvedeva withdraws from Worlds 2018

  1. #316
    Bona Fide Member Shayuki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Side note: gotta love people using the scientifically sound method of leveraging 30FPS YouTube videos to determine rotational speed and quad potential.
    For Trusova's quads at junior worlds, it was a 60 FPS video, actually.

    38/60 FPS of air time and 5.4 - 5.5 revolutions per second of rotation speed(Consistent between both quads). And that was enough for a borderline quad.

    I don't see what's wrong with the method, especially when using 60 FPS footage... You can see a lot in it.

    On Osmond's potential, she will not improve her air time and rotation speed by enough even if she puts everything into it. The requirements are insane.

  2. #317
    In Alina We Trust russianfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    What was the FPS used to determine Osmond's rotational speed, and from which competition?
    competitions

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    And like I said, Osmond's rotational speed is "slow" because she doesn't need to rotate as fast as some of the other girls due to her height.
    I actually think it's rather "she requires good height, because her rotation speed is too slow". The same with Tsurskaya for example (on her highest jump, 3Lz she has the slowest rotation speed)

  3. #318
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    Quote Originally Posted by russianfan View Post
    competitions



    I actually think it's rather "she requires good height, because her rotation speed is too slow". The same with Tsurskaya for example (on her highest jump, 3Lz she has the slowest rotation speed)
    Osmond/Tsurkaya get good height which means she doesn't have to rotate as fast. It makes sense - the more airtime you have the less tight you have to be (although skaters like Chen seem to be an exception, where she does get good height but rotates slowly, hence URs). My coach always said, JUMP your jumps, don't rotate them... if you jump them you don't have to rely on fast rotation as you do harder jumps.

    I don't know why my previous post got deleted but essentially it was arguing that a skater usually has lower rotational speed based on the difficulty of the element being executed. A 2T will have less rotational speed than a 3T. So using Osmond's or anyone else's triple rotational speed as a measure of how fast they would rotate a quad isn't accurate. I also made the point that a skater who can do a triple jump fully rotated with slower rotational speed means they have the height plus perhaps some room to pull in tighter whereas a skater who needs fast rotation to land their triples (like Satoko in that link) will be unlikely to attempt a quad.

    Note some of the jumpers with the greatest height have the lower speeds of rotation because if they rotated faster with the height they get they would overrotate the jump. For potential quadsters, I'm watching for skaters with a combination of good height & LOWER rotations per second on their triple, versus skaters who have high rps on their triples (and would need to be even faster to do a quad). In that list, Daleman, Osmond, Medvedeva and Tsurkaya seem to be the most obvious candidates. And also bear in mind this is not up to date data either, from last season.

    Also note that Wakaba Higuchi has some of the highest rotation but the slowest rotation speed of her 2A... and is the only one on that list who has shown she can land a 3A. Which supports my point.

    I'd be interested in seeing an updated list of this with a high FPS rate, and I'd also be interested in comparing things like height and rotation speed on Nagasu/Kihira/Tuktamysheva/Asada/Higuchi's 2A vs their 3A, and height and RPS on Trusova/Scherbakova's quads vs those jumps as triples.

  4. #319

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    Well said. Fans don't understand jump science like past or present skaters do. On that note I know that there's a slim chance of me landing anything more than a 2T or 2 S in my life time. I'm an adult skater who began to learn figure skating at the age of 38 and before that I held onto the boards. Back in my early 40's I had a ¼ cheat on my 2S. Now at 55 with middle age spread, I'm lucky to land a clean 1Lz once in a while. As an adult on-set skater, I know that the more height I have on my jumps, the more chance of landing my jumps clean. If I don't have enough height with the width and weight of my body, pulling in tighter can only get me so much hang time to rotate. Which means if I only pull in but don't give myself enough air, the jump will fail.

  5. #320
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    Wow this thread has really diverged Tsurkaya and Osmond's rotation and height on jumps in respect to quads. I wonder how Evgenia feels watching at home.

    Right now Carolina isinthe lead and with the Italian "luck" or "magic" of competing in Italy so far Italy islooking really "good"so Caromight winandIwonder if Evgenia regrets not competing??

  6. #321
    GS Supporter lavenderblossom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skater Boy View Post
    Wow this thread has really diverged Tsurkaya and Osmond's rotation and height on jumps in respect to quads. I wonder how Evgenia feels watching at home.

    Right now Carolina isinthe lead and with the Italian "luck" or "magic" of competing in Italy so far Italy islooking really "good"so Caromight winandIwonder if Evgenia regrets not competing??
    I'm sure Evgenia would love to be here, she hated having to skip GPF and Nationals, but she needs to rest and fully heal her injury first. Yes, she might have been over Kostner if she had competed, but at what cost? By resting now she won't have to spend the off-season healing and she can work on possible tech upgrades for next season.
    It would take 3 falls or other major errors from Alina for Caro to win anyway, Caro can't touch a clean Alina's TES.

    One interesting thing is that when Evgenia did compete at Euros and Olympics Alina performed both programs a lot better. I wonder if not having Evgenia there might have put a damper on Alina's confidence.

  7. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Side note: gotta love people using the scientifically sound method of leveraging 30FPS YouTube videos to determine rotational speed and quad potential.
    Hihihi.

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