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Thread: Quad Watch (Ladies)

  1. #181
    “I solemnly swear I’m up to no good” Sam-Skwantch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    On the other hand, I would imagine that landing all cockeyed and sideways can't be good for your body, either.

    Maybe the small girls who get it done by quick rotation rather than great height and distance have the right idea.
    You’ll have to remind me who they are again

    diDr2j4yr1o.jpg

  2. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by yume View Post
    It's great to think that next season, maybe there won't be only one girl who will consistently land quads in international competitions, but many girls. Honestly, i want 2020 worlds to be like 2017 worlds for men. Incredible technical level and performances. There is potential to have 3 to 5 girls at least with quads/3A (Trusova, Scherbakova, Kihira, Kostornaya, healthy Wakaba). We saw these girls lands these jumps at practice at least and say that they work on them. It would be epic.
    Yep. 2020-21 can be the last year for those five or for some of them. The next Olympics year may do the same for Alysa etc.
    Female FS becomes more like a mincing unit. Now it's a run not for medals but for ISU ratifications and Wikipedia articles.

    We have to wait till quads take the place of 3Lz. And 3A will guarantee no medals even in Europe Chmp.
    Mainstream required.

    P.S. The first male OGM needed to land 4T to win was Kulik. Urmanov succeeded without. Quadless Petrenko won against Brana with a quad.

  3. #183
    Tripping on the Podium Lunalovesskating's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arbitrary View Post
    Yep. 2020-21 can be the last year for those five or for some of them. The next Olympics year may do the same for Alysa etc.
    Female FS becomes more like a mincing unit. Now it's a run not for medals but for ISU ratifications and Wikipedia articles.

    We have to wait till quads take the place of 3Lz. And 3A will guarantee no medals even in Europe Chmp.
    Mainstream required.

    P.S. The first male OGM needed to land 4T to win was Kulik. Urmanov succeeded without. Quadless Petrenko won against Brana with a quad.
    Yeah, we will see next year what kind of impact the quads will have on those girls physically and if quads can be maintained.


    Also Lysacek won OGM over Plushenko without a Quad.
    I think we saw also with Alena at GPF that a quad does not guarantee a win, but rather beautiful skating skills + good technical content are what judges love. That is why Mie Hamada, Rika's coach wanted to focus on Rika's artistry this season and not pull out the quads already this season.

    I think just because the quad girls are coming it is not over for other girls quads are exciting but also high risk and have a low consistency rate compared to triples. Nontheless it is exciting to see girls trying to be more competetive with the 3 Axels and Quads, it is something new. I just hope they all stay healthy.

  4. #184
    #Lizadeservedbetter yume's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arbitrary View Post
    Yep. 2020-21 can be the last year for those five or for some of them. The next Olympics year may do the same for Alysa etc.
    Female FS becomes more like a mincing unit. Now it's a run not for medals but for ISU ratifications and Wikipedia articles.

    We have to wait till quads take the place of 3Lz. And 3A will guarantee no medals even in Europe Chmp.
    Mainstream required.

    P.S. The first male OGM needed to land 4T to win was Kulik. Urmanov succeeded without. Quadless Petrenko won against Brana with a quad.
    All of this to say what actually?
    I don't know why it hurts so much when girls don't just skate like princesses with 3-2 combos and 4 triples programs that win medals.

  5. #185
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    Folks, we are here to track and discuss quad attempts. Not to decide if guads are good or bad, if the girls will keep quads past puberty, what will happen in 2020, 2021 or 2022.

  6. #186
    GS Supporter flanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lunalovesskating View Post
    I think we saw also with Alena at GPF that a quad does not guarantee a win, but rather beautiful skating skills + good technical content are what judges love.
    I was glad that Alyona won, but nobody should overestimate that. Alyona's overall score was only two points higher than Sasha's. And Sasha fell during FP and her other quad wasn't clean also, that's -1 deduction and -GOE in two cases. If clean, she would have won without discussion. At rusnats Anna won with one clean quad. One could point that Alyona fell during her SP, but she was still ahead of Anna after SP. In the match of their FP Anna won for her quad, as their skating skills and other components are nearly the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lunalovesskating View Post
    I think just because the quad girls are coming it is not over for other girl
    No, but from statements of some users it seems like it is in fact over just for those with quad attempts

    I'm glad that the sport is not stagnating, that they try something new and that those first more numerous attemts inspire others. From the 2002 it took 15 years to another succesful quad attemp, but now it is like raining have started.

  7. #187
    Bona Fide Member atsumiri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Maybe the small girls who get it done by quick rotation rather than great height and distance have the right idea.
    Say it again..... to 63-65cm Sasha' 4T. Which has better height and distance than 80% of current senior men' 4T
    https://giphy.com/gifs/lklzPsOPRjUc7S1zDY
    https://gph.is/2VHinfg
    https://gph.is/2C9NdUE

  8. #188
    Bona Fide Member Osmond4gold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flanker View Post
    my point wasn't at all to strip any success from Osmond.
    Well...you did flanker, before I and others called you out for doing so, whether it was unintended or not. PM should you wish to discuss further, as I do not want to derail the Thread.

  9. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lunalovesskating View Post
    A different topic:

    I am excited to see if Alysa Liu will attempt and land her Quad Lutz in competition this season. She tried it some time ago and landed it in her warm up, but fell during the competition. She probably won't attempt it at Nationals, but maybe in a different comp.

    Also I am really excited for next season. Rika wants to start to get her quads consistent this season so she can pull them out next season. I am kinda looking forward to the battle of the quads between Sasha, Anna and Rika. Also Kaori Sakamoto apparently wants to train a 4T.
    I wish she'd go for the 4Lo considering how consistent her 3Lo is, although something to think about is that maybe the reason we don't see a lot of 4F and 4Lo is that there aren't many jump coaches who know how to teach them? They are only a year old, even the 4Lz is older and could be why it's the 3rd most popular quad

  10. #190
    “I solemnly swear I’m up to no good” Sam-Skwantch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by atsumiri View Post
    Say it again..... to these 63-65cm Sasha' 4Ts. Which has better height and distance than 80% of current senior men' 4T
    https://giphy.com/gifs/lklzPsOPRjUc7S1zDY
    https://gph.is/2VHinfg
    https://gph.is/2C9NdUE
    Absolutely blows my mind every single time

  11. #191
    #Lizadeservedbetter yume's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tokoyami View Post
    I wish she'd go for the 4Lo considering how consistent her 3Lo is, although something to think about is that maybe the reason we don't see a lot of 4F and 4Lo is that there aren't many jump coaches who know how to teach them? They are only a year old, even the 4Lz is older and could be why it's the 3rd most popular quad
    I don't really see Kaori land a quad, any quad. Seems to me that her rotation speed is not enough. Her triples are rotated by having good height and mostly distance. Maybe she can increase the height, but though visually her jumps have great height, they aren't among the highest.
    But i can see her land a 3A.

  12. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lunalovesskating View Post
    A different topic:

    I am excited to see if Alysa Liu will attempt and land her Quad Lutz in competition this season. She tried it some time ago and landed it in her warm up, but fell during the competition. She probably won't attempt it at Nationals, but maybe in a different comp.

    Also I am really excited for next season. Rika wants to start to get her quads consistent this season so she can pull them out next season. I am kinda looking forward to the battle of the quads between Sasha, Anna and Rika. Also Kaori Sakamoto apparently wants to train a 4T.
    Where did you find out about Kaori's quad? I couldn't find any information. It'll be interesting to see if she goes for one, she has good height and distance on her triples

  13. #193
    On the Ice TripleAxelQueens3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yume View Post
    I don't really see Kaori land a quad, any quad. Seems to me that her rotation speed is not enough. Her triples are rotated by having good height and mostly distance. Maybe she can increase the height, but though visually her jumps have great height, they aren't among the highest.
    But i can see her land a 3A.
    I agree, her rotational speed and height is perfect for landing clean and beautiful triples, but I think a quad might be out of reach. Her height is still a little too low in my opinion, but then again Anna Shcherbakova’s triples are rather tiny and yet, she can rotate her quads.

  14. #194
    Bona Fide Member plushyfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by atsumiri View Post
    Say it again..... to these 63-65cm Sasha' 4Ts. Which has better height and distance than 80% of current senior men' 4T
    https://giphy.com/gifs/lklzPsOPRjUc7S1zDY
    https://gph.is/2VHinfg
    https://gph.is/2C9NdUE

  15. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arbitrary View Post
    I'd consider highly dangerous to attempt any quad not being fully prepared.
    Every time Dmitriev locks horns with 4A he risks his future. Better his 4A becomes (he recently stated he succeeded to land 4A from time to time in practice) harder he crashes (higher altitude and velocity).
    Heavily URed quad may not be so heavy upon crash versus the fully rotated one.
    Pure physics...

    And Trusova only landed something named 4F (one video of a very low quality) and no further progress from her or Shcherbakova reported. Anna too wanted to go further to the Dark Side of Quads.
    I see no place for 4F for the next few months.
    Let’s be honest, when anyone attempts the 4A they are risking their future. I’m glad he’s going for broke and actually training it and competing it even if it hasn’t been close in competition yet, but hopefully when going for broke he doesn’t break anything!

  16. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by TripleAxelQueens3 View Post
    I agree, her rotational speed and height is perfect for landing clean and beautiful triples, but I think a quad might be out of reach. Her height is still a little too low in my opinion, but then again Anna Shcherbakova’s triples are rather tiny and yet, she can rotate her quads.
    Oddly with Kaori it almost looks like she doesn’t have enough speed going into some jumps and then explodes into the air. If she went into some of her better jumps with more speed I could picture her having a go at a quad.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by atsumiri View Post
    Say it again..... to 63-65cm Sasha' 4T. Which has better height and distance than 80% of current senior men' 4T
    https://giphy.com/gifs/lklzPsOPRjUc7S1zDY
    https://gph.is/2VHinfg
    https://gph.is/2C9NdUE

    That second one in particular... just WOW. She actually over-rotates it!

  17. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by flanker View Post
    And somehow those injuries did not alarm anybody? How's that possible if people are so alarmed with any new tape on Alina's leg?

    To be more serious. Yes, injuries belong to this sport and many skaters are injured many times, Eteri's team is no exclusion, but it should be applied in both ways, they are injured sometimes but they are not the only ones, so those concerns so much targeted at them are, to put it mildly, strange.

    And I would also say that noone is obliged to win constantly to call his career succesful, that was in fact meaning of my comment. But again, by some double standart, when Alina gets only silver, there are immediately tons of advisors about coach changing, when with other skaters it is called succesful career.

    And, to end this, it is again funny that the very same people who are clapping Zhenya when she replies to someone not to give advices (which was very good answer) to her are giving advices to other skaters. I openly say that it is pure trolling and hypocrisy, not interest about those skaters.
    I think you're conflating apples and oranges here. Kaetlyn's broken leg for example happened via a freak accident (when she was stroking around and tried to avoid another skater). Her Skate Canada accident was a fluke fall on a flying spin. Obviously a coach wouldn't be blamed for something like that. Whereas a coach overtraining their skaters or having them attempt elements that could seriously injure them is a legitimate cause-and-effect-based concern. I, for one, think Eteri's doing a balance of it and in the Ted interview she talks about safely training the quads (and stopping when a skater looks like they're too tired or whatever), but then again it's obvious that she's still pushing her skaters to do these elements (who are obviously agreeing to do them too) and that might not sit right with everyone.

    I also don't think a silver for Alina merits a coach change. Eteri is still arguably the best in the game, and Alina should only switch if she's unhappy (a la Medvedeva) or feels Eteri's camp isn't giving her what she wants. I also doubt any objective person would ever not consider Alina's career already successful. She has an Olympic gold (and team silver) medal after all.

  18. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by tokoyami View Post
    I wish she'd go for the 4Lo considering how consistent her 3Lo is, although something to think about is that maybe the reason we don't see a lot of 4F and 4Lo is that there aren't many jump coaches who know how to teach them? They are only a year old, even the 4Lz is older and could be why it's the 3rd most popular quad
    The first 4Lo and 4F were both ratified in 2016, by Yuzuru Hanyu and Shoma Uno respectively, so they're actually about 2.5 years old.

    Anyway, TSL released a video of Rika Kihira jumping 4T and 4S.

  19. #199
    May Masaru be with you! Elucidus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shanshani View Post
    Wow, actually it's HUUUUGEE step forward in ladies quad revolution! Why? Because now naysayers would shut their traps about quads possible only for juniors (or russians). She just proved that senior 16 y.o. lady skater during or after puberty is capable of doing them as well
    4S is UR - but 4T seems clean. What is funny though is the fact that despite having rather textbook technique for her triples - Rika begin to use heavily prerotated Eteri's technique for her 4T Next season promises to be very interesting! And I hope now considering quadsters international diversity - judges will become more loyal to ladies quads and stop limit them with artificial URs fearing too high score of one particular skater

  20. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elucidus View Post
    Wow, actually it's HUUUUGEE step forward in ladies quad revolution! Why? Because now naysayers would shut their traps about quads possible only for juniors (or russians). She just proved that senior 16 y.o. lady skater during or after puberty is capable of doing them as well
    4S is UR - but 4T seems clean. What is funny though is the fact that despite having rather textbook technique for her triples - Rika begin to use heavily prerotated Eteri's technique for her 4T
    I don't think Kihira has particularly great technique for her triples, at least based on her vault and whippiness.

    I do agree her doing quads as a senior would be great though.

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