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Thread: 2018-2019 Ice Dance's Power Ranking

  1. #41
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    OK. But it's just a draw which country will have their own representatives in the panel of judges. If you can conclude based on that how panel is friendly to Sinistsina/Katsalapov and unfriendly to Stepanova/Bukin, well - i don't know what to say

  2. #42
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    I am not sure about the judges, I just remember reading on another forum that this years judges are very pro-zhulin, it might be all made up. Even if they are, I dont think anyone will challenge P/C unless they make some huge mistakes.

  3. #43
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    Yes, but that has nothing to do to with Zhulin. I think the most of the judges are the same as before. They just 'like' Sinitsina/Katsalapov skating more this season. (Maybe if Zhulin is the one who has Belarusian origins it's more likely S/K will finish over S/B, cause judges tend to reward home skaters/coaches(?) a little bit more )

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1904sk8 View Post
    I am not sure about the judges, I just remember reading on another forum that this years judges are very pro-zhulin, it might be all made up. Even if they are, I dont think anyone will challenge P/C unless they make some huge mistakes.
    I think we will see if the judges are 'pro-zhulin' or not with the spanish Pairs, not so much the russians

  5. #45
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    S/B's Edith Piaf tango is weak style-wise while S/K's FD is snoozy, it suffers from negative comparisons to Klimova/Ponomarenko's OGM FD

  6. #46
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    Do you think S/K are trying to do some sort of P/C style in their FD? I think when they have their longs in the same flight it shows the weaknesses of SinKats free.

  7. #47
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    No. I don't think they are trying to do so. The program is constructed differently than a Marie-France program in that the music builds to a more powerful crescendo rather than fading away at the end. (S&K are skating to Klimova & Ponomarenko's 92 Olympic Bach program combined with Grishuk & Platov's 92 Olympic Prelude & Allegro). I think the program has some original elements; but the two halves feel too disconnected. I think the build at the end is necessary; but there needs to be a stronger connection. To me, the program suffers from the lack of a clear point of view.

    To be honest, I can't remember anything from Papadakis & Cizeron's FD this season either except the hydroblade-style lift. Nor do I care for Hubbell & Donohue or Chock & Bates's less than original FD material. Post-Olympic seasons. So many teams use their best ideas the season before that the following year's programs often feel like a letdown.

    I do like Stepanova & Bukin, Guignard & Fabbri, and Gilles & Poirier's FDs this season. Which, actually, is a higher percentage than back in 2015 when all the favorites were skating to warhorses. We start here and build for the following seasons.


    Note: As far as Weaver & Poje's FD is concerned, I'm waiting to see how their program looks now with some development.

  8. #48
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    I agree, I feel like the programs the year after the olympics never really live up to the olympic programs. I think they will continue to get better as the quad goes on. I do really like p/c RD (probably one of my favorites of theirs and one of my top 5 rhythm dances).

  9. #49
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    I always like more RDs than I like FDs. (With everyone trying to best each other at the same thing, I'm always bound to fall in love with someone's style). This year I love Weaver & Poje's, McNamara & Carpenter's, and Sinitsina & Katsalapov's. I also like Guignard & Fabbri's, Smart & Diaz's, Chock & Bates's, Popova & Mozgov's, and I think I will like Hurtado & Khaliavin's if they ever skate it clean. I also really liked Stepanova & Bukin's at the GPF, though I do think it's a Paso/Flamenco. P&C's RD doesn't have enough drama for my taste in the tango, but I do love her dress.

  10. #50
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    Missing the Grand Prix? No problem we will just perform our RD (and FD) multiple times a week on the TTYCT, refine it, hit all our key points and put on a showstopping performance at Nationals : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSPMPJTRUgM

  11. #51
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    If you watch real Tango performances, there’s never overt “drama” in the dancing. Its tension is interior, its melancholy sublimated. P/C’s RD is the truest representation of this idea, and they also have the most refined details.

    The thing that separates them from the others has been and still is movement quality. Just compare the opening moves of Papadakis and Weaver. Look at the former’s finely calibrated acceleration and deceleration, the turn-out of the feet, the elegant torque of the torso and the head, the eyes (brief glimpse at her partner but otherwise looking away and sightlines moving with her head, no “flirting” with judges), the plastique and the amplitude. This level of refinement is not matched by any team I’ve seen.

    This is why many people in the dance world took to them immediately last season. I’ve heard from more than one professional dancer and dance critic that “they (P/C) are dancers, not (just) skaters”. A retired professional ballet dancer told me she was hooked as soon as she saw the opening arm movements of the Moonlight Sonata program. Of course dance people know little about blade work, but skating people do and P/C’s edge quality is widely admired. This combination (which I think the judges have sensed and come to appreciate) and their potential for further growth, is why I think they will remain the exemplar Dance team for years to come.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bcash View Post
    If you watch real Tango performances, there’s never overt “drama” in the dancing. Its tension is interior, its melancholy sublimated. P/C’s RD is the truest representation of this idea, and they also have the most refined details.

    The thing that separates them from the others has been and still is movement quality. Just compare the opening moves of Papadakis and Weaver. Look at the former’s finely calibrated acceleration and deceleration, the turn-out of the feet, the elegant torque of the torso and the head, the eyes (brief glimpse at her partner but otherwise looking away and sightlines moving with her head, no “flirting” with judges), the plastique and the amplitude. This level of refinement is not matched by any team I’ve seen.

    This is why many people in the dance world took to them immediately last season. I’ve heard from more than one professional dancer and dance critic that “they (P/C) are dancers, not (just) skaters”. A retired professional ballet dancer told me she was hooked as soon as she saw the opening arm movements of the Moonlight Sonata program. Of course dance people know little about blade work, but skating people do and P/C’s edge quality is widely admired. This combination (which I think the judges have sensed and come to appreciate) and their potential for further growth, is why I think they will remain the exemplar Dance team for some time.
    I agree with everything you said. For me, W/P RD is still very strong (maybe not P/C level). My top three RD this season would probably be P/C, S/K, W/P

  13. #53
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    I've been keeping Weaver/Poje out of my top teams this year but it's definitely time to bring them back in. The rhythm dance is very, very, very good. It won't be Papadakis/Cizeron, but no one will. I'm not sure exactly where I would rank them yet, since their free dance lost by a nudge to Gilles/Poirier.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyena View Post
    I've been keeping Weaver/Poje out of my top teams this year but it's definitely time to bring them back in. The rhythm dance is very, very, very good. It won't be Papadakis/Cizeron, but no one will. I'm not sure exactly where I would rank them yet, since their free dance lost by a nudge to Gilles/Poirier.
    I was curious and watched Papadakis/Cizeron's and Weaver/Poje's TR pattern at their respective Nationals to directly compare them. To me, Weaver/Poje executed it better. For example, Papadakis/Cizeron's helicopter at the beginning looks somewhat sloppy compared to Weaver/Poje and Weaver/Poje's Criss-Cross is better held than Papadakis/Cizeron's. P/C likely has worked on the pattern since but comparing Nationals to Nationals, there is a chance that W/P edge P/C in the RD based on their TR execution. W/P do have some work to do on their FD, as they lacked some of the abandon shown at ACI, there were glitches in some of the elements like losing levels on their spin, but the plus side is that they almost received top levels on both their diagonal (4) and one-foot step (L3+M4). They have two strong programs to build on and can challenge.

  15. #55
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    I haven't watched Weaver/Poje's TR pattern with a technical eye, but I can believe they executed it better than Papadakis/Cizeron. I still see P/C getting the higher scores though, for better or for worse.

    W/P are very much back as a possibility for the Worlds podium in my mind, along with Sinitsina/Katsalapov, Hubbell/Donohue, and possibly Stepanova/Bukin. There are a few more "outside shots" as well. We'll know more after this weekend.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyena View Post
    I haven't watched Weaver/Poje's TR pattern with a technical eye, but I can believe they executed it better than Papadakis/Cizeron. I still see P/C getting the higher scores though, for better or for worse.

    W/P are very much back as a possibility for the Worlds podium in my mind, along with Sinitsina/Katsalapov, Hubbell/Donohue, and possibly Stepanova/Bukin. There are a few more "outside shots" as well. We'll know more after this weekend.
    I think the first part of the TR was clearly executed better by w/p (p/c got a level 1 on it at IdF) but that was two months ago so they could have improved it since. I think the problem was more with timing then technique for P/C, that is at least what I have read in multiple places, but I might be completely wrong.

  17. #57
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    Top 10 ranking after Europeans/4CC:
    1. Papadakis/Cizeron FRA (--)
    2. Chock/Bates USA (new)
    3. Stepanova/Bukin RUS (+2)
    4. Weaver/Poje CAN (--)
    5. Hubbell/Donohue USA (-3)
    6. Sinitsina/Katsalapov RUS (-3)
    7. Gillies/Poirier CAN (--)
    8. Guignard/Fabbri ITA (-2)
    9. Hawayek/Baker USA (--)
    10. Fournier Boudry/Sorensen CAN (new)

    Papadakis/Cizeron are the clear favourites to win every competition they enter if they are avoiding bigger mistakes. 2nd to 8th ranked teams will fight for silver and bronze with almost equal chances to medal and with teams from the different countries being on the podium as the most likely outcome.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baron Vladimir View Post
    Top 10 ranking after Europeans/4CC:
    1. Papadakis/Cizeron FRA (--)
    2. Chock/Bates USA (new)
    3. Stepanova/Bukin RUS (+2)
    4. Weaver/Poje CAN (--)
    5. Hubbell/Donohue USA (-3)
    6. Sinitsina/Katsalapov RUS (-3)
    7. Gillies/Poirier CAN (--)
    8. Guignard/Fabbri ITA (-2)
    9. Hawayek/Baker USA (--)
    10. Fournier Boudry/Sorensen CAN (new)

    Papadakis/Cizeron are the clear favourites to win every competition they enter if they are avoiding bigger mistakes. 2nd to 8th ranked teams will fight for silver and bronze with almost equal chances to medal and with teams from the different countries being on the podium as the most likely outcome.
    H/D behind S/B? Until 4CC H/D were undefeated this season and S/B have lost 3 times and couldn't even win their own National title.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    H/D behind S/B? Until 4CC H/D were undefeated this season and S/B have lost 3 times and couldn't even win their own National title.
    S/B scored at Europeans in the same range C/B scored at 4CC, which is 5 points higher than H/D who didn't even medal. S/B average score this season is basically the same as H/D now. SinKats and H/D were ranked higher before the Europeans/4CC (you can see the previous list too) and this is the ranking after both H/D and S/K failed to finish on the podium at the biggest competition before Worlds, so C/B and S/B who just did that replaced them in the rankings. However the difference between all of them is so small and every team ranked from 2nd to 8th can win the medal as i already mentioned! But i don't think judges will put at 2nd and 3rd teams from the same country when they can choose teams from different countries who are skating on a similar level as those two. More probably the outcame will be one of the two USA teams in 2nd and one of the two RUS or two CAN teams in 3rd.

  20. #60
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    S/K fell in the RD at Euros and H/D had a spin drastically downgraded; neither catastrophe is likely to repeat at Worlds. Given that, where those two teams finished at Euros/4CC has no bearing on how they will place at Worlds.

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