2019 4CCs: Ladies' FS

readernick · Feb 9, 2019

chopinskate said:
I think this should have been a Japan sweep... 1. Kihira 2. Sakamoto 3. Mihara. Tursynbaeva's quad attempt didn't offset her overall simpler content otherwise and lower skating quality.

It was very close. I do think Tursynbaeva deserved slightly lower PCS and GOE which would have out her fourth. I don’t necessarily think Kaori should be higher than Mai though..

And, I guess I must be slightly blind because I love Kaori knees down. Her SS are amazing but her upper body and expressions are not very good in my opinion. She is artistic but not the best here. I think 2nd in PCS or even tied with Mai is fine. Kihira’s performance and the choreo in the long program are far superior in my opinion. Every step and every extension fits the music and her speed across the ice is unmatched. Every movement means something. Just a different level of program in my opinion

Tolstoj · Feb 9, 2019

chopinskate said:
I think this should have been a Japan sweep... 1. Kihira 2. Sakamoto 3. Mihara. Tursynbaeva's quad attempt didn't offset her overall simpler content otherwise and lower skating quality.

I also had Sakamoto as the highest PCS for the LP. Whoever says she doesn't have artistic talent is plainly blind.

Tursynbaeva's FS was the most difficult if you look at the BV, even higher than Kihira. It's not just the quad but also 3s-3t, 2a-3t and 2a-1lo-3s all with the 10% bonus.

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1819/fc2019/fc2019_Ladies_FS_Scores.pdf

Disagree with the Japanese podium sweep, that would have been a bit sad considering Mai Mihara's SP wasn't great, and Sakamoto made mistakes in the free skate losing a lot of points. Tursynbaeva was better overall.

chopinskate · Feb 9, 2019

readernick said:
It was very close. I do think Tursynbaeva deserved slightly lower PCS and GOE which would have out her fourth. I don’t necessarily think Kaori should be higher than Mai though..

I can see that, but I think Sakamoto's LP puts her quite a bit ahead on PCS. Her performance quality is really coming through in it. It was close. I had 2-4 within 4 points of each other (Kihira sat 6 points ahead of Sakamoto).

readernick said:
And, I guess I must be slightly blind because I love Kaori knees down. Her SS are amazing but her upper body and expressions are not very good in my opinion. She is artistic but not the best here. I think 2nd in PCS or even tied with Mai is fine. Kihira’s performance and the choreo in the long program are far superior in my opinion. Every step and every extension fits the music and her speed across the ice is unmatched. Every movement means something. Just a different level of program in my opinion

Kihira's program could be better, but it wasn't so here, IMO. She was relatively tentative at points.

The blind comment wasn't directed at you

A certain pair of commentators, actually.

Tolstoj said:
Tursynbaeva's FS was the most difficult if you look at the BV, even higher than Kihira. It's not just the quad but also 3s-3t, 2a-3t and 2a-1lo-3s all with the 10% bonus.

http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1819/fc2019/fc2019_Ladies_FS_Scores.pdf

Yes, I misspoke sorry. I should have said lower technical quality. Although, if you notice, she ticks off her jumps right one after the other after the halfway point, whereas Kihira, for instance, spreads them more evenly. A 3S right at the end of the skate should have more of a bonus attached (pretty good transition into it, too), and her 3 jump combo comes in later, too, iirc. I also had Tursybaeva as UR for the 4S. Not to mention, her SP had the simplest combo of them all.

Bcash · Feb 9, 2019

Orlov said:
I don't like Japanese ladies' programs because of their uniformity. They don't have raisin. They are absolutely not remembered. Programs Mai Mihara especially faceless. Sorry but not sorry.

Do they have bran?

Bcash · Feb 9, 2019

Orlov said:
Just for clarify - I didn't talk about the programs of all Japanese girls. Wakaba Higuchi has remarkable, interesting programs. But many Japanese ladies follow a simple path - they perform programs that do not require large emotional investments. As we say: "Музыка играет - спортсмену не мешает" (I can not translate with rhyme as original, so literally : "Music played - and it does not distract the athlete") Japanese women too often take the image of vanilla princesses skating under a nice soft music. It's boring. And for me - this is the easy way.

That line applies much better to Eteri girls, who tend to take the image of robots.

GoodMorningGrapeseed · Feb 9, 2019

Orlov said:
Just for clarify - I didn't talk about the programs of all Japanese girls. Wakaba Higuchi has remarkable, interesting programs. But many Japanese ladies follow a simple path - they perform programs that do not require large emotional investments. As we say: "Музыка играет - спортсмену не мешает" (I can not translate with rhyme as original, so literally : "Music played - and it does not distract the athlete") Japanese women too often take the image of vanilla princesses skating under a nice soft music. It's boring. And for me - this is the easy way.

It does get a bit repetitive after a while but the Japanese girls represent ice princess image best. I can't think of ladies of other nationalities with the skating skills and softness to execute such programs, but some of the Russian girls come very close.

oatmella · Feb 9, 2019

I think Elizabet’s skating skills are underrated. I have heard her SS look very good in person. From interview with Brian Orser last year: https://fs-gossips.com/brian-orser-in-my-kitchen-there-will-never-be-a-room-for-a-second-cook/

‘She’s fantastic in this aspect, she skates very fast, without making any visible effort. The main feature of Tursynbayeva’s skating and at the same time her difference from many other skaters, is that she skates absolutely noiselessly. This is noted by all who saw her skating live. No sound, no rustling, like she skates not on the ice, but on butter. But all this is also a result of a long work, no less serious than jumping. Elizabet has been training with me for about five years, and all this time I have been paying a lot of attention to her skating skills.’

chopinskate · Feb 9, 2019

Bcash said:
Do they have bran?

I'm really confused about "raisin" too. Some idiom used in Russian, perhaps?

oatmella · Feb 9, 2019

I think in Russian, ‘raisin’ means something interesting or that stands out

Seruleane · Feb 9, 2019

4CC was amazing this year, much better than Euros. Props to the winners: Rika Kihira for showing us she can pull through in the FS no matter what happens in the SP, Elizabet for all the improvement she's made this past season w/ Eteri (and WOW at that quad attempt- she will land it soon in competition), and Mai letting us know to never count her out. I was gutted for Kaori though. She went from being my least favorite Japanese skater last season, to my unquestionable favorite. She has made a lot of improvement in her interpretation and IMO has really found her style. I hope she takes this loss in stride and is not too disappointed. Bradie was also really impressive. She went from such blah programs last season to having the best programs of any North American skater IMO.

Really excited for Worlds now! Aside from Rika being an obvious favorite, it seems there are many medal contenders.

chopinskate · Feb 9, 2019

oatmella said:
I think in Russian, ‘raisin’ means something interesting or that stands out

Cool thanks.

jenm · Feb 9, 2019

I don't like Japanese ladies' programs because of their uniformity. They don't have raisin. They are absolutely not remembered. Programs Mai Mihara especially faceless. Sorry but not sorry.

Disagree. The Japanese ladies here have very different programs and approach, especially the long programs. Rika's LP is different from Kaori's and both are different from Mai's. Rika has a very contemporary approach. Kaori has more of a spontaneous feel to it while Mai has a very soft, lyrical style. Sure they don't have the roughness or boldness of Russian programs but they aren't the same if you pay attention. Perhaps what makes you feel like they're the same is the seamlessness of their movements or the smoothness of their skating skills. XD

Seruleane · Feb 9, 2019

oatmella said:
Kaori does have some great strengths, but her upper body movement looks sloppy/unfinished.

I understand what you are referring to, but I think she makes nice sweeping movements with her arms and upper body that look very modern and clean. It did look awkward and out of place last season (her Amelie program made me cringe at moments) but I think this year, they have really worked on it such that it looks natural and fits well with the music. She is not one of those skaters with delicate, overly fussy arm movements, and I love her for that.

chopinskate · Feb 9, 2019

I think it looks natural and warm. Sometimes clunky.

jenm · Feb 9, 2019

Congrats to the winners!

I love how Rika always sneaks in to steal gold from everyone.
And yeesss to Elizabet! I've been waiting for her to just do the 4S and give it all. Too bad about the fall but still. It's awesome!
So happy for Mai also for a podium finish.

I'm excited for Worlds. Too many possibilities. But I personally would love Rika to have a gold medal hanging around her neck

lanceupper1114 · Feb 9, 2019

oatmella said:
I think in Russian, ‘raisin’ means something interesting or that stands out

Ahh ok. I guess that makes Mariah Bell and Eunsoo Lim the California Raisins of the 4CC.

Orlov · Feb 9, 2019

Bcash said:
That line applies much better to Eteri girls, who tend to take the image of robots.

nice try :agree:

chopinskate · Feb 9, 2019

Orlov said:
nice try :agree:

On... adding their opinion? That was similar to yours about Japanese skating?

Icey · Feb 9, 2019

Raisin: special twist or extra zest

The American girls need to go abroad for some coaching : Japan or if she would take them Eteri

Orlov · Feb 9, 2019

chopinskate said:
I'm really confused about "raisin" too. Some idiom used in Russian, perhaps?

Yes, my mistake - all the time I forget that in different languages, different idioms. I wanted to say that there is nothing catchy, memorable. After watching the short programs Tennel and Bell, I had their images in my head, pictures from their programs, they did not let me go. They had something interesting, catchy, "raisin", as we say

2019 4CCs: Ladies' FS

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